Difference between street and track driving

Omb · 10-04-2018, 07:47 AM

OK...bear with me here. I am a jeep, truck, suburban kind of guy that got shipped off to Germany. Since I could not afford a 911, got a 370. I've never really driven fast cars before so it's all awesome to me.

So, that said, I see a lot of: Well, are you using this for street or track? What kind of track driving are you doing? Well, in that case, I would go with x,y,z.

Things kind of blur here when it comes to street vs track. I mean, I regularly run 90-110 MPH on the way to work. The Z handles it great. Sometimes if the road is perfect and their is minimal/no traffic I take it up to 120-140 for a few seconds until some Audi wagon tailgates me at 130 then I move over and get back to a more reasonable speed. For the most part I live around 80-115mph though. I don't have a frame of reference so I don't know what 130 should feel like. For me, it feels like it is pushing the chassis to it's limit with anything more than straight line smooth roads. At 110, everything seems locked in.

Some of the high mountain roads in Austria and Italy have seriously awesome turns, curves and switchbacks. This is more carving than the higher speed running I do in Germany. But, I do like to push it through them and I do like the ability to pass people who just have to go 1mph below the limit. Not really any significant complaints in the carving area other than a slight desire to pass a little faster.

So, that said, what are your recs? I have a bone stock 2014 roadster. I am not going to go forced induction. I've read a few threads on NA HP gains and am interested in bolt on mods. What about suspension and tires? I mean, I have no complaints really but that might be because I came from a 7000 truck with a 5.7 that handled like, well, a truck.

Thoughts?

2011 Nismo#91 · 10-04-2018, 09:42 AM

Top speed on a highway or high mountain roads has little to do with track driving.

As you stated "The Z handles it great." and doesn't need much help being a good driving car. You want to make the Z into a 911 it's going to cost a lot and/or sacrifice a lot. The most significant upgrade all around not knowing "Well, are you using this for street or track? What kind of track driving are you doing? Well, in that case, I would go with x,y,z." would be bigger better tires.

Brendan · 10-04-2018, 10:57 AM

I would save your money and buy a 911

Rusty · 10-04-2018, 08:44 PM

Man........you are living in driver's heaven.

What you want depends on your budget. You have to separate your wants and needs. My 2 cents for where you are at and doing.

Good tires. Michelin Pilot Sport 4S. Great summer tire. Don't know if you are going to run in cold weather or not. Winter tires. Don't ask me.

Brake pads and fluid. Pads, I ran the EBC YellowStuff pads for a couple of years. Good pads, but do dust more then the oem. Others run the Hawk and Mu pads. Brake fluid. Bleed your brakes and use something like Motul 660 or better. If you have a stick. Bleed the system and use the Motul 660 or better fluid. Also wrap insulation around the clutch line hose near the exhaust pipe. This will help to keep the fluid from boiling.

Don't know what your oil temps are. But an oil cooler will keep the temps down. The ECU will start to pull timing when the temps get around 240F and then go into limp mode around 280F until the temps come back down. Fast Intentions and Z1 both make a good kit. If you decide to install one and drive in temps below 50F. Make a cover to go over the cooler.

The above will give you a lot. To go beyond. Germany has some goofy inspection laws. So check them out before doing anything else. The stuff you want to put on next has to be TUV appoved or something like that.

NorthStyle · 10-05-2018, 12:24 AM

I was stationed at Spangdahlem AB up until a few months ago. I have a Nismo so the handling at higher rates will most likely be different but it zipped up and down the autobahn just fine around 130 for sustained periods of time. An oil cooler is a must if you plan on driving like that otherwise mine would hover around 230 degrees to 240 on a warmer day. When it was around 110 Fahrenheit a few years ago my oil temps got to around 250... both of these instances were pre oil cooler. Afterwards I'd be hard pressed to get it past 220 even on the Nurburgring. As for curvy roads, Germany has plenty, you just need to get out and find them. I'd check out KMC Unlimited if you're on facebook as they make trips to Hockenheim, the Nurburgring and Spa sometimes. A few of the more dedicated drag guys travel as far as Japfest (UK) yearly.

If you're military (and I'm guessing you are if you got "shipped" to Germany) then you only have to apply with the military/USAREUR inspection laws which are extremely lax compared to what the Germans have to go though with TUV. However, anything too outlandish/obnoxious can have you flagged by the Polizei, at which they'll ask for your car to be re-inspected. Mine never conformed with height requirements at my normal ride height so I would air up the front cups and never had anymore issues. Something to be on the lookout for... I also got pulled over in Kaiserslautern for "improper display of license plate" (it was in the windshield because I didn't want to drill my bumper lol.

MrPostman · 10-07-2018, 10:37 AM

Since it hasn't been mentioned yet, your braking while driving on the street will be different than how you apply the brakes on track. Most people apply slight pressure at first with increasing force on the street, on track you need to use them the opposite. Apply as much force as you can at first to scrub off speed as late as you can into the braking zone and then release or trail off (trail braking) into the apex.
I have Carbotech pads, xp12 fr/xp10 r and they have fantastic initial bite with no fade. They are a bit expensive but worth it IMO.

Rusty · 10-07-2018, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrPostman

Since it hasn't been mentioned yet, your braking while driving on the street will be different than how you apply the brakes on track. Most people apply slight pressure at first with increasing force on the street, on track you need to use them the opposite. Apply as much force as you can at first to scrub off speed as late as you can into the braking zone and then release or trail off (trail braking) into the apex.
I have Carbotech pads, xp12 fr/xp10 r and they have fantastic initial bite with no fade. They are a bit expensive but worth it IMO.

MrPostman · 10-08-2018, 10:58 AM

It was all an illusion.....

Rusty · 10-08-2018, 11:48 AM

The last thing you want to do is stomp on the brake pedal. When you do. You do pitch the front of the car down, and the rear up to quickly. This can and will upset the handling. This will unweighted the rear tires. You want smooth steady increasing pressure on the pedal. When you release the brake pedal. Just don't lift off . You want to bring the pedal back up with your foot. You been hard on the brakes. The car is pitched down. There is a lot of energy in the front springs waiting to be released. Wanting to pitch the front up. This is why you ease up on the pedal. Remember, smooth is fast.

MrPostman · 10-08-2018, 12:34 PM

I agree with that 100%, I didn't mean stomping on it, I was trying to put "Threshold braking"into lamens terms. I suppose I should have just sent this link instead:
Braking - Race & Track Driving (formerly Win HPDE)

10-04-2018, 07:47 AM	#1 (permalink)
Omb Base Member Join Date: Jul 2018 Location: Stuttgart, Germany Posts: 17 Drives: 370z Roadster Rep Power: 7	Difference between street and track driving OK...bear with me here. I am a jeep, truck, suburban kind of guy that got shipped off to Germany. Since I could not afford a 911, got a 370. I've never really driven fast cars before so it's all awesome to me. So, that said, I see a lot of: Well, are you using this for street or track? What kind of track driving are you doing? Well, in that case, I would go with x,y,z. Things kind of blur here when it comes to street vs track. I mean, I regularly run 90-110 MPH on the way to work. The Z handles it great. Sometimes if the road is perfect and their is minimal/no traffic I take it up to 120-140 for a few seconds until some Audi wagon tailgates me at 130 then I move over and get back to a more reasonable speed. For the most part I live around 80-115mph though. I don't have a frame of reference so I don't know what 130 should feel like. For me, it feels like it is pushing the chassis to it's limit with anything more than straight line smooth roads. At 110, everything seems locked in. Some of the high mountain roads in Austria and Italy have seriously awesome turns, curves and switchbacks. This is more carving than the higher speed running I do in Germany. But, I do like to push it through them and I do like the ability to pass people who just have to go 1mph below the limit. Not really any significant complaints in the carving area other than a slight desire to pass a little faster. So, that said, what are your recs? I have a bone stock 2014 roadster. I am not going to go forced induction. I've read a few threads on NA HP gains and am interested in bolt on mods. What about suspension and tires? I mean, I have no complaints really but that might be because I came from a 7000 truck with a 5.7 that handled like, well, a truck. Thoughts?

10-04-2018, 09:42 AM	#2 (permalink)
2011 Nismo#91 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: NJ Posts: 2,402 Drives: slowly Rep Power: 40569	Top speed on a highway or high mountain roads has little to do with track driving. As you stated "The Z handles it great." and doesn't need much help being a good driving car. You want to make the Z into a 911 it's going to cost a lot and/or sacrifice a lot. The most significant upgrade all around not knowing "Well, are you using this for street or track? What kind of track driving are you doing? Well, in that case, I would go with x,y,z." would be bigger better tires. __________________ GTR TT 493Whp/431lbft, Ecutek, Southbend 6puck,Quaife, RPM RollBar 4Point, R888R, JRZ RSPro F(10R/10C) R(10R/6C) 1000f500r inlbs+150inlbs Tender, SPL everywhere.Full Specs

10-04-2018, 08:44 PM	#4 (permalink)
Rusty Ronin Samurai - Assassin Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Fayettenam,Pennsyltucky Age: 68 Posts: 35,218 Drives: 2011 Nismo GM 6M Rep Power: 2684438	Man........you are living in driver's heaven. What you want depends on your budget. You have to separate your wants and needs. My 2 cents for where you are at and doing. Good tires. Michelin Pilot Sport 4S. Great summer tire. Don't know if you are going to run in cold weather or not. Winter tires. Don't ask me. Brake pads and fluid. Pads, I ran the EBC YellowStuff pads for a couple of years. Good pads, but do dust more then the oem. Others run the Hawk and Mu pads. Brake fluid. Bleed your brakes and use something like Motul 660 or better. If you have a stick. Bleed the system and use the Motul 660 or better fluid. Also wrap insulation around the clutch line hose near the exhaust pipe. This will help to keep the fluid from boiling. Don't know what your oil temps are. But an oil cooler will keep the temps down. The ECU will start to pull timing when the temps get around 240F and then go into limp mode around 280F until the temps come back down. Fast Intentions and Z1 both make a good kit. If you decide to install one and drive in temps below 50F. Make a cover to go over the cooler. The above will give you a lot. To go beyond. Germany has some goofy inspection laws. So check them out before doing anything else. The stuff you want to put on next has to be TUV appoved or something like that. gomer_110 likes this. __________________ 浪人 - 殺し屋 "The Difficult Anytime, The Impossible By Appointment Only" http://www.the370z.com/members-370z-...o-journal.html Last edited by Rusty; 10-04-2018 at 08:46 PM.

10-07-2018, 10:37 AM	#6 (permalink)
MrPostman Base Member Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: Alabama Age: 56 Posts: 41 Drives: 2010 Nissan 370Z M6 Rep Power: 7	Since it hasn't been mentioned yet, your braking while driving on the street will be different than how you apply the brakes on track. Most people apply slight pressure at first with increasing force on the street, on track you need to use them the opposite. Apply as much force as you can at first to scrub off speed as late as you can into the braking zone and then release or trail off (trail braking) into the apex. I have Carbotech pads, xp12 fr/xp10 r and they have fantastic initial bite with no fade. They are a bit expensive but worth it IMO. __________________ Life is short, don't waste your time driving something boring.....

10-08-2018, 11:48 AM	#9 (permalink)
Rusty Ronin Samurai - Assassin Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Fayettenam,Pennsyltucky Age: 68 Posts: 35,218 Drives: 2011 Nismo GM 6M Rep Power: 2684438	The last thing you want to do is stomp on the brake pedal. When you do. You do pitch the front of the car down, and the rear up to quickly. This can and will upset the handling. This will unweighted the rear tires. You want smooth steady increasing pressure on the pedal. When you release the brake pedal. Just don't lift off . You want to bring the pedal back up with your foot. You been hard on the brakes. The car is pitched down. There is a lot of energy in the front springs waiting to be released. Wanting to pitch the front up. This is why you ease up on the pedal. Remember, smooth is fast. Eagle, JARblue, sx moneypit and 1 others like this. __________________ 浪人 - 殺し屋 "The Difficult Anytime, The Impossible By Appointment Only" http://www.the370z.com/members-370z-...o-journal.html

10-04-2018, 10:57 AM	#3 (permalink)
Brendan Track Member Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Colorado Posts: 642 Drives: Poor man's Porsche Rep Power: 542	I would save your money and buy a 911

10-05-2018, 12:24 AM	#5 (permalink)
NorthStyle A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: Deutschland + SC/FL USA Posts: 1,259 Drives: 2011 370Z Nismo Rep Power: 24277	I was stationed at Spangdahlem AB up until a few months ago. I have a Nismo so the handling at higher rates will most likely be different but it zipped up and down the autobahn just fine around 130 for sustained periods of time. An oil cooler is a must if you plan on driving like that otherwise mine would hover around 230 degrees to 240 on a warmer day. When it was around 110 Fahrenheit a few years ago my oil temps got to around 250... both of these instances were pre oil cooler. Afterwards I'd be hard pressed to get it past 220 even on the Nurburgring. As for curvy roads, Germany has plenty, you just need to get out and find them. I'd check out KMC Unlimited if you're on facebook as they make trips to Hockenheim, the Nurburgring and Spa sometimes. A few of the more dedicated drag guys travel as far as Japfest (UK) yearly. If you're military (and I'm guessing you are if you got "shipped" to Germany) then you only have to apply with the military/USAREUR inspection laws which are extremely lax compared to what the Germans have to go though with TUV. However, anything too outlandish/obnoxious can have you flagged by the Polizei, at which they'll ask for your car to be re-inspected. Mine never conformed with height requirements at my normal ride height so I would air up the front cups and never had anymore issues. Something to be on the lookout for... I also got pulled over in Kaiserslautern for "improper display of license plate" (it was in the windshield because I didn't want to drill my bumper lol.

10-08-2018, 12:34 PM	#10 (permalink)
MrPostman Base Member Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: Alabama Age: 56 Posts: 41 Drives: 2010 Nissan 370Z M6 Rep Power: 7	I agree with that 100%, I didn't mean stomping on it, I was trying to put "Threshold braking"into lamens terms. I suppose I should have just sent this link instead: Braking - Race & Track Driving (formerly Win HPDE) JARblue likes this. __________________ Life is short, don't waste your time driving something boring.....

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