Calling all clutch bleeding experts

Rangerz · 10-17-2014, 08:14 PM

Just got back from my first tack day with a new Specialty Z Max street clutch, flywheel, csc. I also replaced my master cylinder.

the problem I am having is right after I get going in the session 2 to 3 corners or so the clutch pedal engagement goes from about mid pedal range to just off the floor, and a few times deeper into a session the pedal will come back up but, it hesitates before the spring pops it up.

Ive bled the clutch per the FSM and gravity bled it before that. During bleeding I get absolutely no air bubbles at all coming out of my bleed tube.

any idea's, tricks, suggestions?

Thanks

Rusty · 10-17-2014, 08:44 PM

Crack the line open at the master cylinder. Bleed it there. You may have some air trapped there.

Rangerz · 10-17-2014, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rusty

Crack the line open at the master cylinder. Bleed it there. You may have some air trapped there.

Well got a little hiss when I cracked it... re bled it at the master 3 or 4 times then re bled the whole system feels firmer but, I'll find out at the track tomorrow

SPOHN · 10-18-2014, 01:55 PM

What fluid you using? Do you have a SS clutch line also? I'd also recommend the Z1 external SC. I've had several issue using the best clutch fluid and equipment and due to the heat I couldn't get the gears to engage due to the heat. But that always seem to be after the cool down lap.

Rangerz · 10-18-2014, 10:42 PM

Motul RBF 600 and its either hardline or stainless tubing. Very similar in looks to the Z speed CSC.

same issue today at the track. It feels like after the compression stroke it back fills really slowly and as the heat builds in the session it lasts longer. After the cooldown lap it is stiff as can be though WTF?

I think Rusty might have it pegged though air in the MC.

FSM says not to presure bleed it but, not sure what else I can do. I guess I could pull it back out and bleed/fill it on the bench.

One good thing I was able to beat my best time again on the outer track.

Juan@Fontana · 10-21-2014, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rangerz

Motul RBF 600 and its either hardline or stainless tubing. Very similar in looks to the Z speed CSC.

same issue today at the track. It feels like after the compression stroke it back fills really slowly and as the heat builds in the session it lasts longer. After the cooldown lap it is stiff as can be though WTF?

I think Rusty might have it pegged though air in the MC.

FSM says not to presure bleed it but, not sure what else I can do. I guess I could pull it back out and bleed/fill it on the bench.

One good thing I was able to beat my best time again on the outer track.

from the sound of things you are boiling over the clutch fluid, wrap the line in some DEI heat reflective wrap, wrap your testpipes / cat's with some additional heat shielding and bleed your clutch using either Endless RF650 or OE Nissan GTR Brake fluid.

JARblue · 10-21-2014, 12:18 PM

Clutch fluid boiling sounds feasible. Torque RT700 and Castrol SRF might be worth testing out for a track session.

Rangerz · 10-21-2014, 04:31 PM

Boiling the fluid never even occured to me because i have never had that issue with the stock setup. That does make sense though..the feedline to the tilto CSC it to short IMHO. I have a Z1 Ss line i might be able to throw in if the banjo bolt will seal around the female potion of the line conection. I have the line heat wrapped already but, more is better

Juan@Fontana · 10-22-2014, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rangerz

Boiling the fluid never even occured to me because i have never had that issue with the stock setup. That does make sense though..the feedline to the tilto CSC it to short IMHO. I have a Z1 Ss line i might be able to throw in if the banjo bolt will seal around the female potion of the line conection. I have the line heat wrapped already but, more is better

it's a common misconception. Rubber does not retain or handle heat anywhere near as much as rubber does. the OE line is wrapped with some heat shielding and the OE cats have a pretty gnarly heat shield around them so it's rare to boil over the fluid on the OEM line I've personally never seen it happen. (CSC seal will rupture before that happens)

the SS line can withstand more heat and the nature of stainless steel it also retains much more heat which in turn is absorbed by the fluid. also if you have test pipes or HFC's they no longer have any of the factory shielding so that will add to the boiling over factor. temperature control is very important every time we install a SS clutch Line we make sure to wrap the lines in DEI gold reflective wrap and use a few feed of header wrap around the testpipes / hfc portion that is near the fluid to keep the clutch fluid happy.

Rangerz · 10-22-2014, 11:33 AM

Thanks for the input. I will add some more protection and see if that does the trick.

10-17-2014, 08:14 PM	#1 (permalink)
Rangerz Enthusiast Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Northern Utah Age: 59 Posts: 476 Drives: 2012 370 Nismo Rep Power: 12	Calling all clutch bleeding experts Just got back from my first tack day with a new Specialty Z Max street clutch, flywheel, csc. I also replaced my master cylinder. the problem I am having is right after I get going in the session 2 to 3 corners or so the clutch pedal engagement goes from about mid pedal range to just off the floor, and a few times deeper into a session the pedal will come back up but, it hesitates before the spring pops it up. Ive bled the clutch per the FSM and gravity bled it before that. During bleeding I get absolutely no air bubbles at all coming out of my bleed tube. any idea's, tricks, suggestions? Thanks __________________ Stillen Gen III/ NST/ Fast Intentions Non-Res HFC & 12" Resonated CF TDX/ Setreb series 9 OC/ SPL upper control arms/ Whiteline front & rear swaybars/ Uprev tuned by Seb@specialtyZ/ 319HP 262TQ/ Z1 PS Cooler/ Z1 SS Premium break lines/ CJM Road Race pump/Carbotech F:XP10 R:XP8 Nismo OC DIY

10-17-2014, 08:44 PM	#2 (permalink)
Rusty Ronin Samurai - Assassin Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Fayettenam,Pennsyltucky Age: 68 Posts: 35,217 Drives: 2011 Nismo GM 6M Rep Power: 2684438	Crack the line open at the master cylinder. Bleed it there. You may have some air trapped there. DIGItonium and Rangerz like this. __________________ 浪人 - 殺し屋 "The Difficult Anytime, The Impossible By Appointment Only" http://www.the370z.com/members-370z-...o-journal.html

10-18-2014, 01:55 PM	#4 (permalink)
SPOHN A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Covington, GA Age: 46 Posts: 14,844 Drives: Waiting on next Z Rep Power: 221	What fluid you using? Do you have a SS clutch line also? I'd also recommend the Z1 external SC. I've had several issue using the best clutch fluid and equipment and due to the heat I couldn't get the gears to engage due to the heat. But that always seem to be after the cool down lap. __________________ Last edited by SPOHN; 10-18-2014 at 02:00 PM.

10-18-2014, 10:42 PM	#5 (permalink)
Rangerz Enthusiast Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Northern Utah Age: 59 Posts: 476 Drives: 2012 370 Nismo Rep Power: 12	Motul RBF 600 and its either hardline or stainless tubing. Very similar in looks to the Z speed CSC. same issue today at the track. It feels like after the compression stroke it back fills really slowly and as the heat builds in the session it lasts longer. After the cooldown lap it is stiff as can be though WTF? I think Rusty might have it pegged though air in the MC. FSM says not to presure bleed it but, not sure what else I can do. I guess I could pull it back out and bleed/fill it on the bench. One good thing I was able to beat my best time again on the outer track. __________________ Stillen Gen III/ NST/ Fast Intentions Non-Res HFC & 12" Resonated CF TDX/ Setreb series 9 OC/ SPL upper control arms/ Whiteline front & rear swaybars/ Uprev tuned by Seb@specialtyZ/ 319HP 262TQ/ Z1 PS Cooler/ Z1 SS Premium break lines/ CJM Road Race pump/Carbotech F:XP10 R:XP8 Nismo OC DIY

10-21-2014, 12:18 PM	#7 (permalink)
JARblue A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Austin, TX Age: 43 Posts: 36,450 Drives: 11 Z34, 98 E36 M3 Rep Power: 2684440	Clutch fluid boiling sounds feasible. Torque RT700 and Castrol SRF might be worth testing out for a track session. Rangerz likes this. __________________ 2011 370Z 6MT Sport Gun Metallic \| ARC \| CJM \| Ecutek \| FI \| Fujimura \| R2C \| SPL \| Stillen \| TWM \| Z1 \| ZSpeed \|

10-21-2014, 04:31 PM	#8 (permalink)
Rangerz Enthusiast Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Northern Utah Age: 59 Posts: 476 Drives: 2012 370 Nismo Rep Power: 12	Boiling the fluid never even occured to me because i have never had that issue with the stock setup. That does make sense though..the feedline to the tilto CSC it to short IMHO. I have a Z1 Ss line i might be able to throw in if the banjo bolt will seal around the female potion of the line conection. I have the line heat wrapped already but, more is better __________________ Stillen Gen III/ NST/ Fast Intentions Non-Res HFC & 12" Resonated CF TDX/ Setreb series 9 OC/ SPL upper control arms/ Whiteline front & rear swaybars/ Uprev tuned by Seb@specialtyZ/ 319HP 262TQ/ Z1 PS Cooler/ Z1 SS Premium break lines/ CJM Road Race pump/Carbotech F:XP10 R:XP8 Nismo OC DIY

10-22-2014, 11:33 AM	#10 (permalink)
Rangerz Enthusiast Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Northern Utah Age: 59 Posts: 476 Drives: 2012 370 Nismo Rep Power: 12	Thanks for the input. I will add some more protection and see if that does the trick. __________________ Stillen Gen III/ NST/ Fast Intentions Non-Res HFC & 12" Resonated CF TDX/ Setreb series 9 OC/ SPL upper control arms/ Whiteline front & rear swaybars/ Uprev tuned by Seb@specialtyZ/ 319HP 262TQ/ Z1 PS Cooler/ Z1 SS Premium break lines/ CJM Road Race pump/Carbotech F:XP10 R:XP8 Nismo OC DIY

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