H&R Spacer... Lip shaved/broke off?!

flashburn · 04-19-2011, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kenchan

Kic's. ive been using them for 5-6yrs now on my various cars, never had an issue.

the Eibach's ive used on my Z's fronts are 20mm (built-in stud type) and no issue so far. i agree with ChrisSlicks that it probably has to do with the thickness and reinforcement (or lack of) on the 15mm.

Interesting, for the Project Kic ones, the hubcentric ring is optional (sold seperately), and removable. Well, if these don't work out, I'll give those a try.

flashburn · 04-19-2011, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kenchan

i would be very concerned if im running hub-centric wheels (ie: stock wheels)...

if im running aftermarket wheels that are lug-centric, i would careless.

Meh, well they withstood an HPDE event, and probably 8-10k street miles.

kenchan · 04-19-2011, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flashburn

Interesting, for the Project Kic ones, the hubcentric ring is optional (sold seperately), and removable. Well, if these don't work out, I'll give those a try.

yah, most people run lug-centric wheels so you dont necessarily need the rings. but for our hub-centric wheels the ring is required.

ichiba's are the same way and their rings are actually the same dimension as the Kics. but the biggest difference between ichiba's and kics was that ichiba's overall craftsmanship is low and there's too much play in the ring making them near useless for hubcentric wheels... that's probably why a lot of folks were getting vibrations using ichiba v2 type on the fronts. their tolerance is too wide making it a hit or miss.

im currently using (i should say testing) 20mm ichiba's on the rear of my G35C running lug-centric aftermarket wheels with no issue for the last 2k miles. i would not use them for the Z's front using stock wheels.

flashburn · 04-19-2011, 03:25 PM

Stupid spacers!

I definitely like the idea of the ring just being removable, as long as it doesn't cause vibrations.

kenchan · 04-19-2011, 03:55 PM

i think in HR's case they make their spacers with tight tolerances and with the wheel and spacer metals flexing at a different rate it's bound to snap. perhaps unless you're using heavy materials (something stronger than the wheel's metal) you need some level of 'give' and that's achieved with different materials such as the rings Kics use.

again, im no metal expert and im sure there's a better explanation which HR should provide after doing an full analysis on your failed spacer.

cheshirecat · 04-19-2011, 07:08 PM

To be fair to HR, it does say via a sticker on the spacer packaging that the warranty is voided if they are installed.

kenchan · 04-19-2011, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cheshirecat

To be fair to HR, it does say via a sticker on the spacer packaging that the warranty is voided if they are installed.

So they are a decorative piece for your garage?

that is the stupidest warranty of all time.

flashburn · 04-19-2011, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cheshirecat

To be fair to HR, it does say via a sticker on the spacer packaging that the warranty is voided if they are installed.

Actually what it says is that they cannot be returned if they've been installed. I don't think they mention anything about a warranty to begin with.

phunk · 04-19-2011, 10:08 PM

VERY few auto parts can be returned after installation. its life. its like that because 99% of the time, a failed auto part is caused by installation or misuse/abuse.

there is no expressed warrenty because most people will try and screw them over. however, just because there is no guarentee on the part, doesnt mean they wont replace it for you or help you.

have you actually contacted H&R regarding this? since you are bashing them for this and all, without even knowing why it failed and it could very well be your own fault... perhaps you should ask them for their take on it? it seems logical.

you gotta think man, that is an aluminum part, and its inside diameter must be what it is, and its outside diameter must be what it is. those dimensions cannot change or it will not fit the car/wheel. so you can call it a design error all you want, but the design is the only way it can be. therefore, the only way to make it stronger would be to use a stronger material, such as STEEL, which is what your OEM hub is made of.

I wouldnt be surprised at all if H&R says that these spacers are not meant for use with hubcentric wheels due to the loads it will transfer to that thin *** aluminum lip. what do you expect? i can only assume that the removable KICS ones are removeable because they are steel inserts? i dont know.

ZForce · 04-20-2011, 12:43 AM

That sux...mine held up on both 350z's for well over 20k miles and no issues. Have about 10k miles on both 370Z's and no issues. Hopefully the mfg will want to inspect the spacer for the cause of failure.

Did the front wheel ever take an impact that would cause it to weaken and eventually break? Is tracking the car gonna gonna play a role in the failure? Josh@Stilen comes thru again! It's not often a vendor steps up to plate to take care of a member when the mfg will not. g\l on finding the root cause. Does aluminum match up well with steel?

flashburn · 04-20-2011, 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phunk

VERY few auto parts can be returned after installation. its life. its like that because 99% of the time, a failed auto part is caused by installation or misuse/abuse.

there is no expressed warrenty because most people will try and screw them over. however, just because there is no guarentee on the part, doesnt mean they wont replace it for you or help you.

have you actually contacted H&R regarding this? since you are bashing them for this and all, without even knowing why it failed and it could very well be your own fault... perhaps you should ask them for their take on it? it seems logical.

you gotta think man, that is an aluminum part, and its inside diameter must be what it is, and its outside diameter must be what it is. those dimensions cannot change or it will not fit the car/wheel. so you can call it a design error all you want, but the design is the only way it can be. therefore, the only way to make it stronger would be to use a stronger material, such as STEEL, which is what your OEM hub is made of.

I wouldnt be surprised at all if H&R says that these spacers are not meant for use with hubcentric wheels due to the loads it will transfer to that thin *** aluminum lip. what do you expect? i can only assume that the removable KICS ones are removeable because they are steel inserts? i dont know.

Actually, any "warranty" type service for H&R goes through where you bought the parts from. For me, that was Stillen, who did contact H&R and said exactly what I already stated "No warranty since it's been installed", end of story.

I hardly see how I am "bashing" them, I'm only stating the facts and what I know, nothing more or less. Granted I didn't install them myself, but from what I've seen, I don't see how there could of been any sort of "installation error", it seemed pretty straight forward, and I didn't see anything obviously wrong.

Also, why else would a spacer have a hubcentric lip (as advertised) if it wasn't meant for hubcentric wheels?

flashburn · 04-20-2011, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZForce

That sux...mine held up on both 350z's for well over 20k miles and no issues. Have about 10k miles on both 370Z's and no issues. Hopefully the mfg will want to inspect the spacer for the cause of failure.

Did the front wheel ever take an impact that would cause it to weaken and eventually break? Is tracking the car gonna gonna play a role in the failure? Josh@Stilen comes thru again! It's not often a vendor steps up to plate to take care of a member when the mfg will not. g\l on finding the root cause. Does aluminum match up well with steel?

From what Stillen said, it didn't sound like H&R was interested in inspecting the spacers at all, but I'll contact them directly to see what they say. I'm not expecting much though.

Nope, no impacts or anything like that. I think it happened before the car even hit the track.

kenchan · 04-20-2011, 08:22 AM

Yah, I agree again that the manufacture needs to analyse this and find root cause. The lip should not break off. Completely defeats the purpose and a false sense of security. If this was a bad lot they need to recall and purge their stock, but atleast then they will gain user confidence.

fuct · 04-20-2011, 09:43 AM

could you possibly be over tightening your lug nuts causing added stress on the spacers????

Red__Zed · 04-20-2011, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fuct

could you possibly be over tightening your lug nuts causing added stress on the spacers????

That shouldn't put extra stress on the lip.

04-19-2011, 03:25 PM	#34 (permalink)
flashburn A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2009 Location: Central Florida Posts: 1,884 Drives: '12 Corvette GS 6M Rep Power: 19	Stupid spacers! I definitely like the idea of the ring just being removable, as long as it doesn't cause vibrations. __________________ Current Ride: 2012 Chevrolet Corvette Grand Sport Centennial Edition Carbon Flash 6M Previous Ride: 2009 Nissan 370Z Sport Platinum Graphite 7AT

04-19-2011, 10:08 PM	#39 (permalink)
phunk A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Chicago Posts: 3,668 Drives: 370 Rep Power: 974723	VERY few auto parts can be returned after installation. its life. its like that because 99% of the time, a failed auto part is caused by installation or misuse/abuse. there is no expressed warrenty because most people will try and screw them over. however, just because there is no guarentee on the part, doesnt mean they wont replace it for you or help you. have you actually contacted H&R regarding this? since you are bashing them for this and all, without even knowing why it failed and it could very well be your own fault... perhaps you should ask them for their take on it? it seems logical. you gotta think man, that is an aluminum part, and its inside diameter must be what it is, and its outside diameter must be what it is. those dimensions cannot change or it will not fit the car/wheel. so you can call it a design error all you want, but the design is the only way it can be. therefore, the only way to make it stronger would be to use a stronger material, such as STEEL, which is what your OEM hub is made of. I wouldnt be surprised at all if H&R says that these spacers are not meant for use with hubcentric wheels due to the loads it will transfer to that thin * aluminum lip. what do you expect? i can only assume that the removable KICS ones are removeable because they are steel inserts? i dont know. __________________ Charles @ CJ Motorsports : Website \| Facebook \| Instagram \| YouTube Home of the 9 second, stock longblock, stock drivetrain 6MT 370z. 9.91 @ 142mph** Last edited by phunk; 04-19-2011 at 10:12 PM.

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04-19-2011, 03:55 PM	#35 (permalink)
kenchan A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: N/A Posts: 76,801 Drives: N/A Rep Power: 141521	i think in HR's case they make their spacers with tight tolerances and with the wheel and spacer metals flexing at a different rate it's bound to snap. perhaps unless you're using heavy materials (something stronger than the wheel's metal) you need some level of 'give' and that's achieved with different materials such as the rings Kics use. again, im no metal expert and im sure there's a better explanation which HR should provide after doing an full analysis on your failed spacer.

04-19-2011, 07:08 PM	#36 (permalink)
cheshirecat A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 1,428 Drives: N54 135i Rep Power: 293	To be fair to HR, it does say via a sticker on the spacer packaging that the warranty is voided if they are installed.

04-20-2011, 12:43 AM	#40 (permalink)
ZForce A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Roseville, CA Posts: 2,359 Drives: 09 370Z Tour + Sport Rep Power: 21	That sux...mine held up on both 350z's for well over 20k miles and no issues. Have about 10k miles on both 370Z's and no issues. Hopefully the mfg will want to inspect the spacer for the cause of failure. Did the front wheel ever take an impact that would cause it to weaken and eventually break? Is tracking the car gonna gonna play a role in the failure? Josh@Stilen comes thru again! It's not often a vendor steps up to plate to take care of a member when the mfg will not. g\l on finding the root cause. Does aluminum match up well with steel?

04-20-2011, 08:22 AM	#43 (permalink)
kenchan A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: N/A Posts: 76,801 Drives: N/A Rep Power: 141521	Yah, I agree again that the manufacture needs to analyse this and find root cause. The lip should not break off. Completely defeats the purpose and a false sense of security. If this was a bad lot they need to recall and purge their stock, but atleast then they will gain user confidence.

04-20-2011, 09:43 AM	#44 (permalink)
fuct A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2009 Location: Sugar Land Posts: 3,692 Drives: 97' Ranger :) Rep Power: 24	could you possibly be over tightening your lug nuts causing added stress on the spacers????