Is using Nitrogen a bunch of hot air
 

I went to the local tire dealer with my dad to get new tires on his car and they were promoting having your tires filled with nitrogen vs. compressed air. Any truth to their claim?

Nitrogen is more stable than just putting air in your tires(In regards to different climate conditions). The GT-R showcases this from factory with Nitrogen filled tires.

The Truth About Filling Your Tires with Nitrogen | The Truth About Cars :tiphat:

Not worth the extra cost.

The only real advantage is that it leaks slightly less slowly. But because it leaks more slowly that leads you to be lazy in checking your tire pressure. Pressure change in response to ambient temperature is roughly the same. Interior oxidation is a non-issue, exterior UV is far more harmful than O2.

Just check your pressures once a month or more and you'll be fine. Wish they had left the tire pressure display screen, even a $20K Chevy has that now.

^^^ Check that link.

Btw composition of the earth's atmosphere:

Nitrogen (N2) 780,840 ppmv (78.084%)
Oxygen (O2) 209,460 ppmv (20.946%)
Argon (Ar) 9,340 ppmv (0.9340%)
Carbon dioxide (CO2) 387 ppmv (0.0387%)
Neon (Ne) 18.18 ppmv (0.001818%)
Helium (He) 5.24 ppmv (0.000524%)
Methane (CH4) 1.79 ppmv (0.000179%)
Krypton (Kr) 1.14 ppmv (0.000114%)
Hydrogen (H2) 0.55 ppmv (0.000055%)
Nitrous oxide (N2O) 0.3 ppmv (0.00003%)
Xenon (Xe) 0.09 ppmv (9 × 10−6%)
Ozone (O3) 0.0 to 0.07 ppmv (0% to 7 × 10−6%)
Nitrogen dioxide (NO2) 0.02 ppmv (2 × 10−6%)
Iodine (I) 0.01 ppmv (1 × 10−6%)
Carbon monoxide (CO) 0.1 ppmv (0.00001%)
Ammonia (NH3) trace

nitrogen is more stable under different temps... i dont use it though.

Stable how? As in less likely to burst into flames?

Scam scam scam.. Whats awesome is the "Discount Tire" and tire chain stores charge you for it..

oh and hahaha.. that .pdf you attached is painful to read..

"Nitrogen dissipates heat, reducing rolling resistance and therefore enhancing fuel economy."

What a crock..

Well, any time you have your tires properly inflated you will have reduced rolling resistance, I guess that is the point. But how it magically makes heat disappear (something the laws of physics says is impossible) I have no idea.

I use it. We have a Nitrogen machine at the dealership I work at. I thought it to be bull before I started using it. My Audi TT I had was the first car I tried it on and the first thing I noticed was the ride was slightly improved (Low profile tires). Then my TPMS warning stopped coming on due to ambient temp changes!!(happened monthly before) General pressures did not fluctuate as much. We charge $39.95 one time then free refills!
Now my wife's and my Z have it. Not going back!!
If you think it's to much money to have the service you shouldn't be in this hobby! ;)
I think we are priced higher then those tire chains also!
Also: For those who call it a scam...why does Nascar and F1 use it?? I guess those engineers are inferior to your wisdom!

At the price of having tires put on, it should be no charge if you wanted the nitrogen!

I only do 78% nitorogen

I think we are set at 95% or so!!

I agree! We do that with tire purchases!!

No, no, no, none of these reasons are why nitrogen is used. The real reason, although hidden from the public, is much more reasonable than these stupid performance claims. Nitrogen is used because of the new TPM systems used in new cars. These units are made of metal. Regular air contains a slight amount of water vapor, and more is created with the heating of the tire. This water eventually corrodes the sensor units and contributes to their failing, ala the reason so many cars all of a sudden develop TPMS problems. Nitrogen doesnt contain any water vapor and therefore cannot corrode the sensors over time. It is used as a convenient cover up for manufacturers botched TPMS sensor quality. New units are being made of plastic, so nitrogen may see its way into extinction. You won't find this info anywhere or hear it from any dealer, only technician magazines, etc. Just an FYI, so spread the word, more people need to know of this scam and demand better manufacturer quality, not costly cover ups.

I thought it was because Nitrogen molecules are larger than 'air' molecules (Yes I understand Nitrogen accounts for 78% of 'air' but since were talking about it). So that it takes less Nitrogen to fill your tire than compressed air, but that at the same time, it also fills your tires more effectively for even tire wear?

All that kind of information has so little bearing in real world settings and is used to market nitrogen and to cover up its true reason for being used.

Oxygen molecules are only roughly 3% smaller than Nitrogen molecules. The gases in their elementary form also expand and contract at the same rate which partially debunks the pressure change with temperature claim. I say partially because they will pick up some stability by using purified Nitrogen as it will be free of water vapor. You could essentially use any purified gas as a fill just Nitrogen happens to be the most plentiful and hence the cheapest. I should fill mine with Nitrous Oxide and sell people "hits" of my tires.

Oxygen also oxidizes the sensors. I do know that nitrogen is used in airplane tires.

Probably they use it to prevent the water vapor from freezing inside the tire, would create a horrible imbalance on landing.

i leave my front tires alone and have it filled with nitrogen, my rear tires i fill with air due to me lowering the psi every week when i race and refilling soon as i leave the track.

Nitrogen is not required. This is probably due to the valve stem sensor battery life failing before any corrosion issues. They claim 8 to 10 yrs but I've seen 3 to 5 yrs.
I work for Audi and it is not required to have Nitrogen and all dealerships do not offer it! End of conspiracy!

Just an FYI! The new TPMS systems are not going to require sensors in the valve stems anymore. Indirect TPMS is going to be the future for all vehicles.
This system uses the wheel speed sensors to monitor any change in radius/rotation speed characteristics. No sensors, transmitters, or receivers needed so swapping out wheels and tires doesn't require all the expense.

Audi is the first vehicle manufacturer that is standardizing on this indirect TPMS system right now. Like FSI, CVT and DSG, other manufacturers will follow with their versions. ;)

As far as the Nitrogen goes, Those who have used it should be who chimes in. I thought it was bull untill I started using it. Simple as that. I have customers who deny and tell us it's bogus and throw all their knowledge on why, and that's fine. First hand experience doesn't lie. Definately coming from a sceptic!

Whats happening is a reversion back to the way old low tire monitoring worked, using wheel speed sensors instead of in-wheel sensors.

As far as the conspiracy is concerned, manu's didnt start using nitrogen until they found out regular air was causing sensors to fail. Dealers could either choose to use nitrogen, and profit immensely off of it by selling hyped-up performance BS, or not and make immense profits off of replacing sensors and reprogramming them. Rip off central either way you see it. Not all manu's do this, but the ones that do, shame shame.

I like the old system of using a wheel speed sensor better, like the old buick/cadillac types.

We really don't make a huge profit, generally give it away anyway.

Read this article: (esp. last paragraphs) Audi is currently the first user. ;) Buick?? LOL
Feature Article - Audi Rolls With Indirect TPMS - 04/08

PS: Try it first...

that's exactly why :tiphat:

I live in Canada, when I had my 07 Nismo frontier in the winter, temps would drop to -30C at times. With air in the tires, they would leak on every cold day to the point of becoming totally flat. After a -35C tire change at night, I said no more and filled them with nitrogen, after that they stayed filled through the rest of winter.

yes, buick, and cadillac, among others. this new audi thing imo is just another overblown euro designed gadget thats too expensive and fancy for its own good. quick question too, are you gonna fight me on everything I say like it holds no merit at all?

It has its good sides and bad sides... I've used it and you really can't tell the difference. Its suppose to make your tires wear evenly. IMO its not worth it. I believe I paid $50 for all for tires and unlimited refills. Bad thing is that if you have a leak, you can't fill it with air at your local gas station. I'll wait until it's available everywhere including gas stations.. ;):driving:

you can top off with regular air if you want.

:iagree:

I guess many of these folks have forgotten how air has sufficed for inflating tires for over a 100 years now. And to anyone thinking that use of nitrogen will save folks from having to make weekly trips to the air pump for tire pressure checks....I challenge everyone here in all truthfulness how many folks actually make religiously regular weekly checks of their tires other than a quick glance at them when getting into the car to see if any "look" low or who just plain waits until the indicators trip???

Nitrogen is a sham...and at $40 for all four to be filled up its just another way the vendors look to mind-f*ck the patrons by taking advantage of their youthful naivity knowing these folks haven't been around the railroad tracks enough yet to know a scam when they see or hear one.

As I stated before on many posting occassions:

Balance, alignment, the proper inflation of tires, and how you drive, are the determining factor on tire wear.

great pic:tup:

Just provide a source seperate from you is all. There is a lot of garbage on forums!! :tiphat:
Usually from folks who don't work in the industry.

nitrogen hasnt really helped my tires wear evenly lol



http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/4828/img0286ry.jpg

:iagree:

FTW!!!

Nitrogen does nothing for tire wear!! :shakes head:

it was..... a joke

I could go scourer the internet for a source, but youll just have to take my word, I am a mechanic after all and have no reason to deceive you. Ive fixed many a wheel speed sensor because of the low tire light. The system isnt nearly as technical as your audi system, but it has been around for a while.

For that matter of fact..!! Here are a few other benefits of using Nitrogen in tires:

[1] Nitrogen is denser than Oxygen: This means the larger molecules escape less easily from tires resulting in a more gradual loss of pressure over time. According to the Michelin Tire Manual, a tire that is inflated with Nitrogen loses its pressure 3 times slower than if it were inflated with air.

[2] Nitrogen is moisture free: Pure Nitrogen inflated tires experience less steel belt and rubber degradation. Nitrogen use also reduces valve and wheel corrosion.

[3] Nitrogen provides longer tire life: Nitrogen inflated tire run cooler and require less maintenance according to the Goodyear application bulletin.

[4] Nitrogen is non-flammable: Nitrogen technology has been used in aircraft, military and race car technology for over thirty years.

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I cant decide if that is spam or not^^ usually the users with links like those in the sig are spam.

btw, all been mentioned already.