Steering wheel vibration 70-80 mph help?!
 

Okay posted in Wheel / tire even though it could very well be brakes as well...

So just a quick run down, my car has always had aftermarket 19” wheels, 10mm spacer (w/ extended studs) F and 25mm spacer R (bolt on) both Z1 and both hubcentric 66.1 for Nissan vehicles. I had a non hub centric spacer up front at one point and steering wheel vibrated from like 55-80mph. well ever since i got the Z1 hub centric it went away but now it’s coming back?!? Not sure why...

I have a steering wheel vibration on some roads it’s worse than others. Some roads it goes away completely for a little bit. It’s only from 70-80 and then goes way below 70 and above 80mph.

I definitely have warped rotors, at 60k miles idk how that’s possible, 1 owner (older lady) and then myself. I’ve never really done crazy driving b/c of how low I am. But when I brake medium to hard at highway speed 65-70+ I get a shake that is worse the faster I’m going. If I’m braking at 90-100 it’s a pretty bad shake / vibration. So I’ll definitely be replacing rotors to slotted rotors and pads when my brake pads wear out.

I’m pretty knowledgeable when it comes to the Z platform. This isn’t my first one or even my first modified one. I know the basics to look for, can anyone point me in the right direction?

I know it can be a # of things,
1) Wheel weights came off causing unbalanced wheels (very possible as the vibration comes and goes at speed)
2) wheels aren’t torqued properly (already checked and ruled this out)
3) Wheel hub centric Z1 spacers (not sure why it would just now start after being installed a little bit)
4) brake rotors being warped (?) not sure if it can cause the car to vibrate when NOT applying brakes
5) struts being blown I have seen vibrations (I have Tanabe coils and all 4 corners have upgraded stiffer springs and checked out) no fluids leaking from struts or seem soft or anything. Still stiff and new feeling.
6) tire issues (they’re new tires maybe 1-2k miles on them, but possible I guess)
7) alignment (I had an aftermarket camber arm fail less than a month ago and replaced with OEM and had an alignment less than a month ago) steering feels tight. Doesn’t walk either way (unless the road is angled toward one side) so I can pretty comfortably rule that out.
8) I’m not 100% sure what my Wheel hub bore is, or if it has hub rings on my aftermarket wheels, or if it’s not 66.1 I may need hub centric rings on the wheels paired with the hub centric spacers maybe?

Any other ideas or opinions on what of above it could be? Thanks in advance!!

Im lazy to read...have your 2 front wheels balanced problem solved hopefully.

Ok read some. #1 is your issue right there.

Wheels unbalanced? Correct?

Bingo! # 1!

I believe so. Sir
Have the wheels checked if it bent too. But with that speed you feel vibrations its the wheel balance is the issue.

Ok I’ll go ahead and have all 4 rebalanced! And see if that fixes it!
Just from about 65/70 to 80/85mph it does it, anything over or below and it stops. Some roads are worse than others. When braking it does it the worse especially at higher speed braking. So I know I have a rotor warp issue as well (that I’ll be replacing) just wasn’t sure if Wheel weights were the cause of it or rotors sticking from them being warped. But thanks guys!

If it was the rotors, it would just shake faster as your speed increased, and it would probably pull one way or the other at speed. I agree with everyone above, it's most likely a wheel balance issue.

Kirk B.

Thanks for that! My wheel / tire guy always hooks me up so shouldn’t cost me much to have them re balanced! And he wouldn’t of accidentally forgot any weights on mine. I believe he uses the high quality weights on mine as well. With the good sticky stuff that don’t come off. But upon inspection I noticed the front left wheel has NO weights on it at all. Which I know from past experiences that a wheel and tire can balance out with no weights but it’s very seldom.

So I’ll have them re balanced within a couple days and report back! I’ll be replacing rotors anyways just b/c I know they’re warped and it does have a tendency to pull one side (to the right) but I always assumed the road curves off that way for rain. So I’ll have to find a road I know is 100% straight and check. I’ll be replacing rotors probably spring time anyways! (Which is only Feb - March) for me. Im in the south we don’t have much of a winter. But thanks guys! I guess if I get rebalanced and it’s still doing it. I’ll replace rotors in spring and go from there.

Rotors seldom warp. If you still have some vibration on braking after balancing, you more than likely have some deposits on the rotor. Going through the bedding procedure will probably fix it.

The whole 3-4 , 45-10mph brakes , then 5-10 , 60-15mph in succession stops?

Yup. Just make sure you don't stand on the brakes while stopped at any point during the bedding process or the 15 minute cool down period after.

That's probably overkill, but, yeah. The few times I've needed to do it, 3 or 4 60ish-10 runs fixed the problem. Let brakes cool before coming to a full stop.

Okay got it 60-10mph 3-4 times and. Then drive it for 15 mins and let them cool. Got it. When I get off I have an industrial road by my work I can do 3-4 60-10 brakes and then get on the interstate to my house 10-15 mins drive at about 65-70mph so should be plenty of time for it to cool down and i won’t be on my brakes. This just burns off the built up deposits correct? Then why couldn’t I use a brake cleaner? Doesn’t properly clean off the burnt on deposits or what? Sorry never really had issues with brakes before and I have the sport package.

Also for an update, I went and had all 4 wheels re balanced only ONE (front) wheel was out. By a good bit. So I was like okay perfect, that’s the problem. Got on interstate. From 65-80 and it’s still doing it. About a 5-7 mile trip on interstate some parts of interstate was worse judder and some of it went away almost completely. And when applying brakes at 75-80mph it still judders until I get below 65mph and then it stops juddering.

So checked / rebalanced all wheels, still a judder just enough to be annoying, from 65-80mph anything 90+ it goes away. Anything below 60/65 ish it also goes away. Any braking above 70mph + also still causes steering wheel to judder / shake a little worse. Still doesn’t pull either direction, no burnt pad smell, so don’t think it’s a stuck caliper/pad. Rotors definitely seemed warped but gonna try the bedding method first. Any thing else it could be?

Ruled out unbalanced wheels , torque on lug nuts, going to try bedding process for rotors to see if that helps my judder when braking at least. If not still gonna go ahead and order new rotors + pads in Feb/March. Ruled out strut / coilover issues as they’re riding perfect and upon inspection with wheels off they appear just fine. I guess my spacers are a possibility but the fact I’ve had spacers installed theyre Z1 66.1mm hub bore made for Nissan front & rear and it didn’t start doing it (or got worse) within the last week or 2. Seems to me that’s not it either.

Not sure what else to look for or why the rotors being warped (if they really are) would cause it to do it when not applying brakes. But car definitely judders when NO brake pressure is applied and gets worse when brakes are applied.

2 questions:
Have you run thru any deep water recently, as in deep enough to reach your rotors? It would have to be after getting the brakes really good and hot. That and braking like crazy and then parking it are the only easy way to warp rotors. They have to cool unevenly from damn near red for it to be a problem.
If you can (no clearance issues) have you tried running without the spacers to see if the problem goes away? Like you, I'm doubtful it's your problem, but anything you can totally eliminate is a plus.
Good luck!

Kirk B.

No! My cars way too low. I won’t drive it if it’s raining hard enough to flood. And I don’t drive hard in the rain my hatch area is gutted and with my camber and stance driving in the rain is sketchy enough lol but I have driven car (not too hard) then washed it. But I don’t think the brakes went from really hot to cold water. But I guess it’s possible.
But I have to admit I have driven it pretty hard and done some pretty tough braking and parked it. So it wouldn’t surprise me if they were warped. Again, I’ll try the bedding process but unsure if that’ll help if they’re truly warped. Just not sure how warped rotors would cause the judder while driving w/ NO brake pressure applied. But suppose it’s possible.

Yes I can pull front spacers off and check to see if it helps! To rule it completely out that was going to be my next thing on the list to rule out.

You mention that you have after-market 19" wheels ... but no hub rings. If all else fails, you may want to consider purchasing a set of hubcentric rings and then install the wheels with the rings in place and check for vibrations ... perhaps first with the spacers removed, and then with the spacers installed. Although not always necessary, the rings can help center the wheels during install. Also, I assume that you have the correct type of lug nuts for your wheels.

Yeah, I don't think you could drive it spirited enough on the streets (without getting arrested ) to get them that hot. Maybe something like the Tail of the Dragon.
Not saying they may not be warped, just that it would more likely be a direct than something you did.
I'm just all caught up in this, like, "Enquiring minds want to know!". Lol.

Kirk B.

Yes

Brake cleaner is for removing oil and grease, not baked on deposits.

I've heard of people using sandpaper to get rid of the glaze but padding is easier (and more fun).

That was something else I thought of! Only thing I was thinking... was if it was hub rings it would do it with or without the HC spacers. And I don't remember my car juddering a month ago when I installed spacers or before. Just within the last couple weeks. Seeing as how the spacers are hub centric 66.1 just like the OEM Nissan hub (bore). But for like $10 a set, it wouldn’t hurt to try. Most I can rule out right now is wheels are balanced issue, struts / coil overs check out fine and alignment is good since it was done maybe a month ago and I've not hit any big bumps or done anything to knock it out of whack. I did brake bedding process and will report back tomorrow to see if braking judder has gone away, got better / worse ! Then I’ll pull spacers off front , see if that helps. Maybe try the hub rings see if it works. And if all that doesn’t work I’m gonna get new rotors in a few months and go over braking system, stuck pads, kinked brake lines something. That's about all I know of honestly... :(

I agree! I’ve never had warped rotors. Not even on my sport bikes. And that thing I got way faster on and slowed down a lot faster too. So :tup: The Z should be good but idk. I’m not gonna rule out warped rotors just yet. I did do the 60-10 , 5 Times though! Read my below post to @SouthArk!


Gotcha! Well okay I did about 5 , 60-10mph brakes on the last one they started to skip while stopping, like ABS was about to kick in so I stopped, got on interstate and drove home 10 or so mins. I had to touch my brakes lightly a couple times but NEVER completely stopped and let the pads sit on rotor. Even when I got home I coasted in driveway and pulled e-brake. I put my hand to rotor on the cooling fin area and it was warm but cool enough to touch so I’m assuming it got it’s good 60-10mph brakes in and properly cooled. So we shall see tomorrow if judder while braking has stopped, got better / worse, etc. Vibration from 65-80 are still there after bedding though just for the record.

Get your front rotors cut. Rotors do warp. Put a dial indicator on them and watch the runout. :shakes head: You already tried to bed the pads and that didn't work.

The vibrations that you are feeling that come and go is from the road surface. Different type of surfaces will produce different vibrations. Mine on grooved concrete is terrible. Smooth concrete is better. Fresh blacktop is great.

Maybe it isn't rotor deposits. It's a common cause of vibration but not the only one. If you still think a rotor may be warped, check run-out, as per Rusty.

But it didn’t do it before, same roads / interstate I drive everyday to / from work. Only started doing it recently.

I will check run-out when I can! But if it is a warped rotor I’m not getting them cut or anything. Just deal with it for a couple more months and get new rotors + pads!

I also went ahead and got some hub rings (aluminum) heard they’re better than the poly carb kind due to poly carbs melting. Not to say that’s it but figured it’s worth a shot. My aftermarket wheels don’t have them and it definitely doesn’t sit properly when the wheel is just sitting on lugs. It fixes a little but no way it can be 100% perfect even when torqued with that gap there. So I will see if that helps. Wheels are 73.1 and hub is 66.1 so I got the 73.1 to 66.1 should be here this weekend / Monday! If that doesn’t help. Then I’ll go into checking rotors / brake system more !

Sounds like you are checking out all the usual suspects and have a pretty good plan. Keep us updated, please.

.

Maybe I'm grasping at straws here. But could this be a wheel bearing issue? Spacers i've heard put extra stress on wheel bearings. Don't know if thats actually true or not but was one of the downsides i've always heard mentioned.
Since you've had wheels balanced already, and since this happening on braking and off braking (just at speed) Wondering if it could be bearing play?

Thought of that but no weird noises or humming like when wheel bearings go bad! That’s true right? There’s normally a humming noise and weird vibration that starts at a lower speed that just the 65-85mph zone I’m feeling. I wanna say my moms car had a bad wheel bearing / hub at one point and I drove it. Like anything about 35mph and it had a vibration and got worse as you went faster. Also a loud humming noise that also got worse as speed increased.

UPDATE:

Got aluminum hub rings installed on wheels. No more vibration from 65-80. No more vibrations at all. 40, 65, 85 , 100+ it’s gone! Not sure why it did it all of a sudden I never had hub rings with or without my spacers. Just came up this past couple weeks or maybe i didn’t notice it. Who knows. But the vibration is gone. I mean normal road vibrations just from crappy roads. That’s all. Vibration is still there when I brake at higher speeds so I will be doing new rotors and pads in spring! But thanks guys!

Glad to hear you got it fixed and thanks for the update.

Good deal! Glad we were able to fix it for you! (Tongue-in-cheek attempt at humor, lol)
Mine threw a weight the other week, and I had to get them rebalanced. It's annoying to not be able to use the car's full potential.

Kirk B.

... well sir you were right! I had an assumption. I have no clue why it just randomly started doing it. Maybe the last couple times I mounted wheels it didn’t seat right causing me to just notice it. The first couple times after spacer install I may of just got lucky and they seated fine. But now with aluminum hub rings. No more vibrations. Only at high speed 75/80+ braking from slight rotor warpage.


To everyone else, thanks guys! I’m pretty mechanically inclined. But I like to have opinions from others! Love this forum with my old Z and my current Z. Always helpful! Wheels are re balanced. Hub rings got my wheels centered. Alignment is good. And only vibrations I have is from my rotors being warped. But the vibration is a lot less when I brake. So I’ll be replacing those in spring! Stay tuned for the install as well. It’ll be posted on here as well! :tup:

Glad to be of help.

The day I put spacers on at 81k miles mine started just as the OP describes. So I guess it can be either it made wheel bearing issue more pronounced or the spacers are unbalanced from the get go. If it's the latter I guess there isn't a solution.

What style of spacers are you running? I am on generic 25mm hubcentric bolt-ons and I have no ill effects.

Same as you but +20's off amazon that others have used. Even ground all the lattice off the brake rotor hub from the wheel so they're perfectly flat.

Stupid question - do you have any interference from the OEM wheel studs on the back of your wheels?

On my 2011 I had bolt on 20's and in the front the OEM wheel studs just barely touched the back of the sport rays and created about 1-2mm of interference keeping everything from fitting flush. This is partly why I am running 25mm all around.... (because lazy)

I got Z1 10mm up front with extended studs. And Z1 25mm in rear with stock size studs. No interferences with studs/wheels in rear. All I did was add aluminum hub rings on the hub centric spacers and my issues are resolved! :tup:

Good thought, I'll check thanks.

i have the same issue at 70-80mph any other speed it doesnt happen, its really annoying , i tried new tires, balance, alignment . =\

I had this issue since the day I bought my car a few months ago but for some reason didn't bother taking it back to the dealer. I assumed it was tires out of balance until I started reading threads on here including this one. Which caused me to overthink it. It did it from about 68mph-80+. Got an oil change today and on an impulse told them to balance my tires too. Turns out the rear two tires had thrown their weights and were out of balance. She's smooth as anything now. The tech at the stealership also reset my TPMS sensor which had been on since I bought it. Cost me about $160 total with Mobil 1 synthetic oil. Pretty high but worth it to me. So if you're having this issue start with a tire balance then go from there!