Uprev Locks own e-tune maps

flashgordon · 07-18-2013, 12:27 PM

ATTENTION! From this year Uprev protect the e-tune ROMs by a password.

In the site there is no information about, I found this surprise after my last buy!

What's means this for all:
For an Osiris Standard user:
It's impossible to go to another tuner if he don't like the current settings of the e-tune ROM. Or if they would make a definitive Map on a Dyno with has Osiris Tuner.
He can not purchase Osiris Tuner, because cannot edit own Map!

For Osiris Tuner users:
They can not look whats there is in the bought etune Map, so they can not check if there is something wrong.
They can not made minor modification to our Map (i.e. Fan duty cycle or Throttle response)
They can not upgrade the actual Map using a dyno, but it's necessary to start from Zero (or the last unlocked Rom)

I think that "Lock" is the opposite word of "Tuning".
I like to have a full access to MY car, this is because I bought UpRev! With this policy is the same as using Consult3 with a Map made by Nissan dealer.
I pay for my e-tune + $700 for Osiris Tuner and I want to see what it does. Are too few 50$ for an open e-tune Map? Well increase the price!

I don't understand the necessity to lock my ROM when my ROM function great only on my car!

I wrote to Uprev, but I haven't a reply, I hope that this public post moves somethings in a better service.

Chuck33079 · 07-18-2013, 12:44 PM

I've seen a lot of tuners lock their maps. I'm not a fan of it personally, but its not unheard of.

fairlady_z34 · 07-18-2013, 12:54 PM

let me get this straight if im reading it correctly. so in order to get a tune you will have to go straight to uprev or pay extra $$$ for a better package?

Chuck33079 · 07-18-2013, 12:56 PM

From my understanding of his post, it's saying Uprev locks their E-tune map they send you and aren't allowing changes to that map. If you've bought the license I can't imagine not being able to take it to another tuner for a new map. They just wouldn't be able to tweak the map from Uprev.

theDreamer · 07-18-2013, 12:59 PM

You can still take your car and have it tuned by another shop.
They will not be able to modify the tune on the car most likely, though a pro tuner might be able to call Uprev and request the password to tweak it. This is not new, a lot of pro tuners put locks on the tune so others cannot access it and copy what they are doing.

Chuck33079 · 07-18-2013, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theDreamer

This is not new, a lot of pro tuners put locks on the tune so others cannot access it and copy what they are doing.

Exactly. The tune is basically the tuner's IP, and letting someone else have access isn't a great business practice.

flashgordon · 07-18-2013, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck33079

From my understanding of his post, it's saying Uprev locks their E-tune map they send you and aren't allowing changes to that map. If you've bought the license I can't imagine not being able to take it to another tuner for a new map. They just wouldn't be able to tweak the map from Uprev.

Yes!
I bought a license of Tuner to see the map! And Uprev is the seller!!!

And....

Why when I bought the Map there aren't any explanations that my e-map NOW is locked!?

Finally WHY protect a Map that works only on my car...

flashgordon · 07-18-2013, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck33079

Exactly. The tune is basically the tuner's IP, and letting someone else have access isn't a great business practice.

I don't understand why....

Example:
I add HFC. Then I go to a very good tuner that Maps the car very well.

After a year I add Headers.... ....but I go to another BAD tuner with the previous map made by a GOOD tuner...

The result I am expecting is BAD.... ....what do you think?

Chuck33079 · 07-18-2013, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flashgordon

Finally WHY protect a Map that works only on my car...

Because the data contained within the map is the intellectual property of the tuner. You're free to go have another tuner create a new map, or datalog and email Uprev for an updated map when you add mods.

From their point of view, leaving the map unlocked can only cause problems. You could change something that shouldn't be changed and break something, and complain "Uprev's E-tune destroyed my motor". You could take that data, copy it down and charge someone else with a tuner license to put that data on their car, regardless of whether it's optimized for that car or even safe to run on that car. You could take any competitive advantages or unique strategies they employ and offer them up to anyone.

I'm always surprised when a tuner doesn't lock their tunes. It's not an open source product.

Chuck33079 · 07-18-2013, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flashgordon

I don't understand why....

Example:
I add HFC. Then I go to a very good tuner that Maps the car very well.

After a year I add Headers.... ....but I go to another BAD tuner with the previous map made by a GOOD tuner...

The result I am expecting is BAD.... ....what do you think?

This is why, in your scenario, you would datalog the car, send the data to Uprev and they would send you a new tune optimized for your new mods.

flashgordon · 07-18-2013, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck33079

Because the data contained within the map is the intellectual property of the tuner. You're free to go have another tuner create a new map, or datalog and email Uprev for an updated map when you add mods.

From their point of view, leaving the map unlocked can only cause problems. You could change something that shouldn't be changed and break something, and complain "Uprev's E-tune destroyed my motor". You could take that data, copy it down and charge someone else with a tuner license to put that data on their car, regardless of whether it's optimized for that car or even safe to run on that car. You could take any competitive advantages or unique strategies they employ and offer them up to anyone.

I'm always surprised when a tuner doesn't lock their tunes. It's not an open source product.

Ok, but....

If I want stay secure that my car does not crack, I don't make any mods!! I do not tune my car!

And then: Open Source means Freeware. I pay the Osiris Tuner and I pay the e-tune.

The question is only How Much you Would I pay your service.

Chuck33079 · 07-18-2013, 02:32 PM

Well, you've got the software that allows you to create your own maps. We're just discussing whether the actual map sent by Uprev should be editable by the end user. I like the ability to change small things without an entire new tune, but I understand why they lock them. It's not ideal, but it's the easiest way to ensure the end user doesn't hurt their vehicle inadvertantly or share IP/ trade secrets.

Uprev's maps are far cheaper than the competition's maps. Are you willing to pay 4-5 times the cost of the map for the ability to tweak it? For $50, I'd just email new data logs to uprev and have them update my map. You can do that multiple times before you have spent as much as some others charge for a single map.

flashgordon · 07-18-2013, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck33079

Well, you've got the software that allows you to create your own maps. We're just discussing whether the actual map sent by Uprev should be editable by the end user. I like the ability to change small things without an entire new tune, but I understand why they lock them. It's not ideal, but it's the easiest way to ensure the end user doesn't hurt their vehicle inadvertantly or share IP/ trade secrets.

Uprev's maps are far cheaper than the competition's maps. Are you willing to pay 4-5 times the cost of the map for the ability to tweak it? For $50, I'd just email new data logs to uprev and have them update my map. You can do that multiple times before you have spent as much as some others charge for a single map.

I know that, and if the maps leaves from my car 500Hp I do you quite right.
But I know also that uprev via e-tune adjust AFR and a little bit Time Advance.
For a real tune it's necessary a dyno... ..and a good tuner, nothing else...
(think about that the nearest Uprev Pro Tuner near me is at 2000Km!)

I am able to adjust AFR, but require me a lot of time and it's not my work. I pay (payed for the "surprise") willingly 50$ to do that.
As change Oil: is quite simple, but tiring me. So I do it to my mechanician.
Now: Is right that my mechanic changes the oil bolt to an Anti Theft bolt to ensure that I will go only to he?

chrischhorn · 07-18-2013, 02:51 PM

Sorry I agree with most the people in this thread. You still have full access to tune your car to the full extent. You have ZERO limitations on tuning your car. Only the tune that UpRev has provided to you. It's basically a copyright. I bet companies like Z1 do the same thing.

Chuck33079 · 07-18-2013, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flashgordon

Now: Is right that my mechanic changes the oil bolt to an Anti Theft bolt to ensure that I will go only to he?

This isn't a good analogy. The mechanic didn't design anything. Uprev's map is their intellectual property, and they have the final say whether it is end user editable. You're not held captive. You can have anyone you want tune your car. They just can't start with Uprev's map.

07-18-2013, 12:27 PM	#1 (permalink)
flashgordon Premium Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Italy Posts: 146 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 16	Uprev Locks own e-tune maps ATTENTION! From this year Uprev protect the e-tune ROMs by a password. In the site there is no information about, I found this surprise after my last buy! What's means this for all: For an Osiris Standard user: It's impossible to go to another tuner if he don't like the current settings of the e-tune ROM. Or if they would make a definitive Map on a Dyno with has Osiris Tuner. He can not purchase Osiris Tuner, because cannot edit own Map! For Osiris Tuner users: They can not look whats there is in the bought etune Map, so they can not check if there is something wrong. They can not made minor modification to our Map (i.e. Fan duty cycle or Throttle response) They can not upgrade the actual Map using a dyno, but it's necessary to start from Zero (or the last unlocked Rom) I think that "Lock" is the opposite word of "Tuning". I like to have a full access to MY car, this is because I bought UpRev! With this policy is the same as using Consult3 with a Map made by Nissan dealer. I pay for my e-tune + $700 for Osiris Tuner and I want to see what it does. Are too few 50$ for an open e-tune Map? Well increase the price! I don't understand the necessity to lock my ROM when my ROM function great only on my car! I wrote to Uprev, but I haven't a reply, I hope that this public post moves somethings in a better service.

07-18-2013, 12:44 PM	#2 (permalink)
Chuck33079 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Houston Posts: 12,265 Drives: 2011 370ztt Rep Power: 29539	I've seen a lot of tuners lock their maps. I'm not a fan of it personally, but its not unheard of. __________________ 2011 MB Touring-Sport-6sp-Nav/GTM TT/FI TT TDX/JTran/Kosmic/Eibach/Hotchkis/SPC/CSF/RPS/SoThatsWhereAllMyMoneyWent

07-18-2013, 12:56 PM	#4 (permalink)
Chuck33079 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Houston Posts: 12,265 Drives: 2011 370ztt Rep Power: 29539	From my understanding of his post, it's saying Uprev locks their E-tune map they send you and aren't allowing changes to that map. If you've bought the license I can't imagine not being able to take it to another tuner for a new map. They just wouldn't be able to tweak the map from Uprev. flashgordon, 370Zsteve and SPOHN like this. __________________ 2011 MB Touring-Sport-6sp-Nav/GTM TT/FI TT TDX/JTran/Kosmic/Eibach/Hotchkis/SPC/CSF/RPS/SoThatsWhereAllMyMoneyWent

07-18-2013, 12:59 PM	#5 (permalink)
theDreamer A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 30,879 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 4210	You can still take your car and have it tuned by another shop. They will not be able to modify the tune on the car most likely, though a pro tuner might be able to call Uprev and request the password to tweak it. This is not new, a lot of pro tuners put locks on the tune so others cannot access it and copy what they are doing. Megan370z likes this. __________________ theDreamer's Z // Fast Intentions // Uprev // GTM // HKS // TEIN theDreamer's Silvia // URAS // GREDDY Houston Zs // Facebook // Twitter // Instagram

07-18-2013, 02:32 PM	#12 (permalink)
Chuck33079 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Houston Posts: 12,265 Drives: 2011 370ztt Rep Power: 29539	Well, you've got the software that allows you to create your own maps. We're just discussing whether the actual map sent by Uprev should be editable by the end user. I like the ability to change small things without an entire new tune, but I understand why they lock them. It's not ideal, but it's the easiest way to ensure the end user doesn't hurt their vehicle inadvertantly or share IP/ trade secrets. Uprev's maps are far cheaper than the competition's maps. Are you willing to pay 4-5 times the cost of the map for the ability to tweak it? For $50, I'd just email new data logs to uprev and have them update my map. You can do that multiple times before you have spent as much as some others charge for a single map. flashgordon and chrischhorn like this. __________________ 2011 MB Touring-Sport-6sp-Nav/GTM TT/FI TT TDX/JTran/Kosmic/Eibach/Hotchkis/SPC/CSF/RPS/SoThatsWhereAllMyMoneyWent

07-18-2013, 12:54 PM	#3 (permalink)
fairlady_z34 Track Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: socal Posts: 568 Drives: 09 370z touring Rep Power: 13	let me get this straight if im reading it correctly. so in order to get a tune you will have to go straight to uprev or pay extra $$$ for a better package?

07-18-2013, 02:51 PM	#14 (permalink)
chrischhorn A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Mililani, HI Posts: 1,566 Drives: 2014 Juke Nismo RS Rep Power: 16	Sorry I agree with most the people in this thread. You still have full access to tune your car to the full extent. You have ZERO limitations on tuning your car. Only the tune that UpRev has provided to you. It's basically a copyright. I bet companies like Z1 do the same thing. __________________ R.I.P. 8/01/13 1SlowZ One day I'll have another....

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