Cobb vs UpRev

FricFrac · 07-05-2009, 01:46 AM

Ok so from what I can tell these are the two systems we can use to load our own Maps and mod our ECU. From the sounds of it the UpRev binds to the first ECU you use it on and that's it - you're done. Does anyone know if the Cobb unit is based on a licence system as well so that you can only use it on one vehicle? Seems very costly for what is basically an EEPROM programmer for your ECU.... especially if they are only allowing you to program a single vehicle with it.

Other than that what are the differences between these two systems?

One_Quick_Z · 07-05-2009, 08:05 AM

Yes it is based on a "one car one handheld" Basis

And with my experience with the Access port on my 350Z dont get it use the Uprev

DAN

shabarivas · 07-05-2009, 11:58 AM

APs are super common in the stock boosted car world - like Evos and Stis have great success with em. I have one from my Evo that im waiting to get reprogrammed for the Z. It is much easier to use than the uprev and a lot of vendors are using it now.

FricFrac · 07-05-2009, 12:03 PM

So the Cobb system is for only one vehicle as well? If my friend has a CEL on his car I can't use my AP to clear it because its linked to my car?

import111 · 07-05-2009, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FricFrac

So the Cobb system is for only one vehicle as well? If my friend has a CEL on his car I can't use my AP to clear it because its linked to my car?

Yes, the Cobb AP gets "married" to the vehicle and can't be used on another until it is "un-married" from the original vehicle.

NIZMOZ · 07-05-2009, 01:12 PM

UPREV you can tune the car yourself. Cobb you can not and must take it to a tuner.

drisko · 07-17-2009, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NIZMOZ

UPREV you can tune the car yourself. Cobb you can not and must take it to a tuner.

Not sure if this was already mentioned...but you can download the AccessTUNER Race version of the software for free and tune your vehicle by yourself (or take it to someone else). The AcessTUNER Pro version is the only version you pay for, and it is designed for shops that want to use it to tune multiple vehicles (it is a multi-user, multi-vehicle software license).

1slow370 · 08-22-2009, 08:12 AM

Cobb exists for the 370, Uprev does not. Also UpRev "will be released shorty we're just finishing some things up" since early june and they've acquired a car to work with months ago. I can't see a reason why they didn't release it for the 370 yet other than they can't get something big to work on the 370(I don't care about the 350z results as it's a totally different car). Especialy since they could label it beta, collect input on the issues from users, and release a software update for it later. If the missing map switching light is the hold up It's a foolish mistake to not release it without that capability and get your product to market if it functions fine otherwise. I have hands on experience in tunning cars from hexidecimal bin code back since OBD I, and i understand that the major factors involved in making tunning software are: the connection with the ecm and control software, creating a program to physically read/write that control software/building a GUI to work from, and reverse engineering the factory software so a vehicle definition that says where certian data/maps are in the code and how to change the values in those maps/flags can be created. This concept is shared by virtually every ecu tunning program ever made since in the end you aren't changing any of the vehicles circuitry and the vast majority of the code in the ecm is not altered at all, only the values you want to change to affect how the engine runs. This is how Cobb does it and probably how UpRev does it on other vehicles. The only alternatives are piggybacks which go in between the ecu and the devices it controls and alters the end signal like a sound system amplifier, stand alones which offer there own processors and circuitry to completely ignore the factory ecu and can do w/e the company wants it to do but rarely work with the integrated systems like the electronic dash and focus only on the motor. The generic nature of piggybacks and stand-alones is why we turn to altering the factory code via Cobb and UpRev. The problem with this is that often the companies making the software to alter the factory code can't account for changes in hardware beyond what is done already by nissan. Nissan writes a value for injector size into the code so you can change it. If nissan's electronics don't accept a MAP or BARO sensor you can't add one or sometimes change the size of the one on the car. Does UpRev reprogram the way the ecu reads the voltage from the sensor, or change the scale of the tables to go from 1bar to being able to actually read pressure? This is what defines a tunning programs power, ADAPTABILITY AND FEATURES. Map switching with the cruise control is something Cobb doesn't have, Cobb doesn't require you to have a laptop to run their software UpRev does. In the end if the values the programs change are the same it comes down to cost. If UpRev lets me switch to speed density and lets the car actually adjust for FI, I'll buy it. Otherwise both options are the same except for map switching, and laptop requirments and will do the EXACT SAME THING.

FricFrac · 08-22-2009, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1slow370

Cobb exists for the 370, Uprev does not. Also UpRev "will be released shorty we're just finishing some things up" since early june and they've acquired a car to work with months ago. I can't see a reason why they didn't release it for the 370 yet other than they can't get something big to work on the 370(I don't care about the 350z results as it's a totally different car). Especialy since they could label it beta, collect input on the issues from users, and release a software update for it later. If the missing map switching light is the hold up It's a foolish mistake to not release it without that capability and get your product to market if it functions fine otherwise. I have hands on experience in tunning cars from hexidecimal bin code back since OBD I, and i understand that the major factors involved in making tunning software are: the connection with the ecm and control software, creating a program to physically read/write that control software/building a GUI to work from, and reverse engineering the factory software so a vehicle definition that says where certian data/maps are in the code and how to change the values in those maps/flags. This concept is shared by virtually every ecu tunning program ever made since in the end you aren't changing any of the vehicles circuitry and the vast majority of the code in the ecm is not altered at all, only the values you want to change to affect how the engine runs. This is how Cobb does it and probably how UpRev does it on other vehicles. The only alternatives are piggybacks which go in between the ecu and the devices it controls and alters the end signal like a sound system amplifier, stand alones which offer there own processors and circuitry to completely ignore the factory ecu and can do w/e the company wants it to do but rarely work with the integrated systems like the electronic dash and focus only on the motor. The generic nature of piggybacks and stand-alones is why we turn to altering the factory code via Cobb and UpRev. The problem with this is that often the companies making the software to alter the factory code can't account for changes in hardware beyond what is done already by nissan. Nissan writes a value for injector size into the code so you can change it. If nissan's electronics don't accept a MAP or BARO sensor you can't add one or sometimes change the size of the one on the car. Does UpRev reprogram the way the ecu reads the voltage from the sensor, or change the scale of the tables to go from 1bar to being able to actually read pressure? This is what defines a tunning programs power ADAPTABILITY AND FEATURES. Map switching with the cruise control is something Cobb doesn't have, Cobb doesn't require you to have a laptop to run their software UpRev does. In the end if the values the programs change are the same it comes down to cost. If UpRev lets me switch to speed density and lets the car actually adjust for FI, I'll buy it. Otherwise both options are the same except for map switching, and laptop requirments and will do the EXACT SAME THING.

My understanding is that UpRev actually runs their own OS on the Nissan hardware rather than just putting a new map in. Pretty sure that's what was said earlier in this thread....

wstar · 08-24-2009, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FricFrac

My understanding is that UpRev actually runs their own OS on the Nissan hardware rather than just putting a new map in. Pretty sure that's what was said earlier in this thread....

Yes, this is effectively what they're doing. They're replacing the factory software with their own replacement software. The biggest advantage they derive from this: if you just "change maps" the simpler way, any time you want to swap maps you have to reflash the map. In their version of the software, you can flash multiple maps into the car at once, and then their software can pick and choose which to load into working memory and use at any given time on the fly, which allows the cruise-control map-switching on their previous generation efforts. Sounds like they may be doing the map-switching differently for the VQ37 though, perhaps by using our left-side info display.

FricFrac · 07-05-2009, 03:18 PM

NIzmoz isn't the AP tuneable?

CobbTuning.com - AccessTUNER Pro - Public Release

NIZMOZ · 07-05-2009, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FricFrac

NIzmoz isn't the AP tuneable?

CobbTuning.com - AccessTUNER Pro - Public Release

Again, YOU do not have access to the tuning software yourself. You must have a Pro Tuner do it for you. UPREV sells you the tuning software so you can do it yourself.

And UPREV tuning is way more powerful than Cobbs will ever be.

semtex · 07-05-2009, 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NIZMOZ

And UPREV tuning is way more powerful than Cobbs will ever be.

Can you elaborate on this? In what way is it more "powerful"?

NIZMOZ · 07-06-2009, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by semtex

Can you elaborate on this? In what way is it more "powerful"?

Search the other 350Z site and you will see the break down. Cobb can't adjust cam timings, UPREV can. There are many other things. There is a reason many big tuners are using UPREV now and not COBB and why many are switching from COBB to UPREV on the other site.

Uprev · 07-13-2009, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by semtex

Can you elaborate on this? In what way is it more "powerful"?

The capabilities of our system are far superior. We also add features continuously. We were the first to offer true forced induction support in the Nissan/Infiniti market. Technosquare had a very limited support for forced induction and it never really took off, most people used the Utec instead.

With our software people replace their piggyback/standalone unit and use the stock ECU because we have more reliability and better driveability.

When our software is released for the G37/370Z/GTR it will be the most powerful software available for tuning on these vehicles. We won't be the first to market on these vehicles but we'll be the replacement for whatever is available at the time.

07-05-2009, 01:46 AM	#1 (permalink)
FricFrac A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Victoria, BC Posts: 1,481 Drives: 370Z 300ZX 280ZX 240 Rep Power: 229	Cobb vs UpRev Ok so from what I can tell these are the two systems we can use to load our own Maps and mod our ECU. From the sounds of it the UpRev binds to the first ECU you use it on and that's it - you're done. Does anyone know if the Cobb unit is based on a licence system as well so that you can only use it on one vehicle? Seems very costly for what is basically an EEPROM programmer for your ECU.... especially if they are only allowing you to program a single vehicle with it. Other than that what are the differences between these two systems? __________________ '09 370Z - '93 300ZX Vert - '83 280ZX - '83 280ZXT -'81 280ZXT stroker - '72 240Z - Stillen CBE, HFC, G3, Grounding Kit, Sways // Swift Spring // H&R 15mm // 5% Tint // Clear Bra //

07-05-2009, 08:05 AM	#2 (permalink)
One_Quick_Z A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2009 Location: Seneca Il Posts: 1,374 Drives: 10 Civic EX Sedan Rep Power: 219	Yes it is based on a "one car one handheld" Basis And with my experience with the Access port on my 350Z dont get it use the Uprev DAN __________________ -My BRZ with exhaust will decimate all if we overnight parts from Japan- 10 Civic EX Sedan- Current Daily

07-05-2009, 12:03 PM	#4 (permalink)
FricFrac A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Victoria, BC Posts: 1,481 Drives: 370Z 300ZX 280ZX 240 Rep Power: 229	So the Cobb system is for only one vehicle as well? If my friend has a CEL on his car I can't use my AP to clear it because its linked to my car? __________________ '09 370Z - '93 300ZX Vert - '83 280ZX - '83 280ZXT -'81 280ZXT stroker - '72 240Z - Stillen CBE, HFC, G3, Grounding Kit, Sways // Swift Spring // H&R 15mm // 5% Tint // Clear Bra //

07-05-2009, 01:12 PM	#6 (permalink)
NIZMOZ Track Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 634 Drives: 07 NISMO 350Z SA M6 Rep Power: 491	UPREV you can tune the car yourself. Cobb you can not and must take it to a tuner. __________________ SOLD: 2007 NISMO 350Z #0044 Silver Alloy New DD: 2010 Titan Pro4X CC

08-22-2009, 08:12 AM	#8 (permalink)
1slow370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: In the D Posts: 3,732 Drives: v8 74 260z ;) Rep Power: 7251	Cobb exists for the 370, Uprev does not. Also UpRev "will be released shorty we're just finishing some things up" since early june and they've acquired a car to work with months ago. I can't see a reason why they didn't release it for the 370 yet other than they can't get something big to work on the 370(I don't care about the 350z results as it's a totally different car). Especialy since they could label it beta, collect input on the issues from users, and release a software update for it later. If the missing map switching light is the hold up It's a foolish mistake to not release it without that capability and get your product to market if it functions fine otherwise. I have hands on experience in tunning cars from hexidecimal bin code back since OBD I, and i understand that the major factors involved in making tunning software are: the connection with the ecm and control software, creating a program to physically read/write that control software/building a GUI to work from, and reverse engineering the factory software so a vehicle definition that says where certian data/maps are in the code and how to change the values in those maps/flags can be created. This concept is shared by virtually every ecu tunning program ever made since in the end you aren't changing any of the vehicles circuitry and the vast majority of the code in the ecm is not altered at all, only the values you want to change to affect how the engine runs. This is how Cobb does it and probably how UpRev does it on other vehicles. The only alternatives are piggybacks which go in between the ecu and the devices it controls and alters the end signal like a sound system amplifier, stand alones which offer there own processors and circuitry to completely ignore the factory ecu and can do w/e the company wants it to do but rarely work with the integrated systems like the electronic dash and focus only on the motor. The generic nature of piggybacks and stand-alones is why we turn to altering the factory code via Cobb and UpRev. The problem with this is that often the companies making the software to alter the factory code can't account for changes in hardware beyond what is done already by nissan. Nissan writes a value for injector size into the code so you can change it. If nissan's electronics don't accept a MAP or BARO sensor you can't add one or sometimes change the size of the one on the car. Does UpRev reprogram the way the ecu reads the voltage from the sensor, or change the scale of the tables to go from 1bar to being able to actually read pressure? This is what defines a tunning programs power, ADAPTABILITY AND FEATURES. Map switching with the cruise control is something Cobb doesn't have, Cobb doesn't require you to have a laptop to run their software UpRev does. In the end if the values the programs change are the same it comes down to cost. If UpRev lets me switch to speed density and lets the car actually adjust for FI, I'll buy it. Otherwise both options are the same except for map switching, and laptop requirments and will do the EXACT SAME THING. Last edited by 1slow370; 08-28-2009 at 03:08 AM.

07-05-2009, 11:58 AM	#3 (permalink)
shabarivas A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 2,188 Drives: 370z MB 6mt Rep Power: 914	APs are super common in the stock boosted car world - like Evos and Stis have great success with em. I have one from my Evo that im waiting to get reprogrammed for the Z. It is much easier to use than the uprev and a lot of vendors are using it now.

07-05-2009, 03:18 PM	#11 (permalink)
FricFrac A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Victoria, BC Posts: 1,481 Drives: 370Z 300ZX 280ZX 240 Rep Power: 229	NIzmoz isn't the AP tuneable? CobbTuning.com - AccessTUNER Pro - Public Release __________________ '09 370Z - '93 300ZX Vert - '83 280ZX - '83 280ZXT -'81 280ZXT stroker - '72 240Z - Stillen CBE, HFC, G3, Grounding Kit, Sways // Swift Spring // H&R 15mm // 5% Tint // Clear Bra //

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