VVEL control unlocked

O&G · 10-12-2012, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spikuh

dudes got choppers on his snake! fukyea LOL

SS_Firehawk · 10-07-2012, 01:17 PM

With VVEL being controlled by a separate ECU than the primary, it is definitely understandable why it took so long to get it to this point. Somehow these two ECU's work in sync to keep the motor running. I think it's downright amazing things have progressed to a point where we are using separate ECU's to handle the valve-train. If we ever get to the point where exhaust valves are controlled by the same system, there wouldn't be a need for cam upgrades, just some experience with a programming tool to make adjustments and the variables would be near limitless. I guarantee something like this will be done and implemented in this decade. With the downsizing and turbocharging of motors, valvetrain is the main culprit for losing efficiency. How easy would it be for manufacturers to use the same head design and just retune the ECU for what they need.

I feel this is the tip of the iceberg and any forward progress now will only pave the way for the future. We don't need cams to adjust our peak power higher or lower in the powerband, we will soon have the ability to do that with a computer. This is why I think even with NA, there are gains to be had, not with a stock car, but one running headers, manifold, exhaust, and CAI, we can tune the VVEL to take advantage of the much better breathing of those components, similiar to how every car manufacturer now is using variable valve timing to create a super scavanging effect with their turbo motors from the factory.

All in all, when this is publicly available, I'm all in.

G37Sam · 10-08-2012, 02:10 AM

I think most of the benefit in this would be retarding the timing for FI application to minimize boost leaking out during overlap. SC's will be able to run proper exhausts finally!

DIGItonium · 10-08-2012, 10:30 AM

This is nice... I'm hoping for a proper dyno tune next year. I want to induce whiplash.

edub370 · 10-08-2012, 10:32 AM

lets not trash this thread internet tough guys. go size up somewhere else.

back on topic, anyone have any idea of NA gains that could be seen with this. i mean 0hp? 20hp?

seymore4 · 10-09-2012, 04:12 PM

whelp looks like its official.

"There is a BETA version of the ROM editor in the pro download area that give access to the tables that we've found so far for VVEL control. One big piece that is still missing is the cam phasing. There are tables there for phasing, but they don't seem to work yet. Be VERY careful not to change the "Valve Clearance Limit" table as this is the table the keeps the pistons from hitting the valves. Here are the notes about what we know so far about these tables (this info can also be found in the text file inside the beta ZIP folder):

So far we know:
Valve clearence limit is the safety table that keeps the ECU from running too much lift and advance at the same time.

* Adjusting this table is DANGERUS. Too much lift and advance at the same time = piston crashing into the valves.

VVEL B seems to have the most effect on idle.

At WOT it seems take the max value from either B or C."

elperuano · 10-09-2012, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seymore4

whelp looks like its official.

"There is a BETA version of the ROM editor in the pro download area that give access to the tables that we've found so far for VVEL control. One big piece that is still missing is the cam phasing. There are tables there for phasing, but they don't seem to work yet. Be VERY careful not to change the "Valve Clearance Limit" table as this is the table the keeps the pistons from hitting the valves. Here are the notes about what we know so far about these tables (this info can also be found in the text file inside the beta ZIP folder):

So far we know:
Valve clearence limit is the safety table that keeps the ECU from running too much lift and advance at the same time.

* Adjusting this table is DANGERUS. Too much lift and advance at the same time = piston crashing into the valves.

VVEL B seems to have the most effect on idle.

At WOT it seems take the max value from either B or C."

Thanks for disproving this the other day and now confirming it! Lol

GaleForce · 10-09-2012, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seymore4

whelp looks like its official.

"There is a BETA version of the ROM editor in the pro download area that give access to the tables that we've found so far for VVEL control. One big piece that is still missing is the cam phasing. There are tables there for phasing, but they don't seem to work yet. Be VERY careful not to change the "Valve Clearance Limit" table as this is the table the keeps the pistons from hitting the valves. Here are the notes about what we know so far about these tables (this info can also be found in the text file inside the beta ZIP folder):

So far we know:
Valve clearence limit is the safety table that keeps the ECU from running too much lift and advance at the same time.

* Adjusting this table is DANGERUS. Too much lift and advance at the same time = piston crashing into the valves.

VVEL B seems to have the most effect on idle.

At WOT it seems take the max value from either B or C."

Looks like the OP is due for some apology reps from the naysayers.

elperuano · 10-09-2012, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GaleForce

Looks like the OP is due for some apology reps from the naysayers.

I can definitely think of 1 person for sure lol

Z_ealot · 10-10-2012, 02:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elperuano

I can definitely think of 1 person for sure lol

lol definitely....it's just like in the IT field, just because you've been in it for so many years doesnt mean you know everything and the field is always changing so anyone that comes on here saying they know more than anyone else just because they have been in the field longer i just take as pure arrogance and ignorance

O&G · 10-09-2012, 04:57 PM

I believe UpRev is increasing prices for licenses's as well. Not 100% sure but I did hear that through the grapevine.

O&G · 10-09-2012, 05:18 PM

Atleast we've started to turn the corner in cam tuning. It does wonders for other cars w/ and w/o FI!

I rarely start any threads because I hate dealing w/ all the haters but in this case I knew a bunch of you guys would appreciate the news. The next step is for our tuners to start exploring the software "safely"! Should be xciting!

johncy2000 · 10-09-2012, 05:22 PM

Subed!

O&G · 10-10-2012, 11:40 AM

This thread is going to poop!

FPenvy · 10-10-2012, 12:26 PM

anyone wanna get back on topic? just a thought lol

10-07-2012, 01:17 PM	#2 (permalink)
SS_Firehawk Premium Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Tampa Posts: 4,142 Drives: 13' Magma Red Nismo Rep Power: 7335	With VVEL being controlled by a separate ECU than the primary, it is definitely understandable why it took so long to get it to this point. Somehow these two ECU's work in sync to keep the motor running. I think it's downright amazing things have progressed to a point where we are using separate ECU's to handle the valve-train. If we ever get to the point where exhaust valves are controlled by the same system, there wouldn't be a need for cam upgrades, just some experience with a programming tool to make adjustments and the variables would be near limitless. I guarantee something like this will be done and implemented in this decade. With the downsizing and turbocharging of motors, valvetrain is the main culprit for losing efficiency. How easy would it be for manufacturers to use the same head design and just retune the ECU for what they need. I feel this is the tip of the iceberg and any forward progress now will only pave the way for the future. We don't need cams to adjust our peak power higher or lower in the powerband, we will soon have the ability to do that with a computer. This is why I think even with NA, there are gains to be had, not with a stock car, but one running headers, manifold, exhaust, and CAI, we can tune the VVEL to take advantage of the much better breathing of those components, similiar to how every car manufacturer now is using variable valve timing to create a super scavanging effect with their turbo motors from the factory. All in all, when this is publicly available, I'm all in. __________________ Old Car:GTM TSC'd 550whp / 410lbft tq @ 11.88PSI New Car: Under Construction

10-08-2012, 02:10 AM	#3 (permalink)
G37Sam A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Dubai, UAE Posts: 1,507 Drives: RB'd G37 Rep Power: 21	I think most of the benefit in this would be retarding the timing for FI application to minimize boost leaking out during overlap. SC's will be able to run proper exhausts finally! __________________ '14 Viper GTS '08 RB'd G37S - Sold

10-08-2012, 10:30 AM	#4 (permalink)
DIGItonium A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 3,800 Drives: 09 Z34-TT 6MT Rep Power: 43	This is nice... I'm hoping for a proper dyno tune next year. I want to induce whiplash. __________________

10-08-2012, 10:32 AM	#5 (permalink)
edub370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2011 Location: KCMO Posts: 3,458 Drives: 09 370z S/T 6MT Rep Power: 20	lets not trash this thread internet tough guys. go size up somewhere else. back on topic, anyone have any idea of NA gains that could be seen with this. i mean 0hp? 20hp? __________________ 09 370Z ST 6MT//Injen CAI//Greddy CBE//TP//TSW's//Swifts//Stillen lip//Whiteline sways 326whp/268tq

10-09-2012, 04:57 PM	#11 (permalink)
O&G A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Lone Star State Age: 42 Posts: 1,212 Drives: 40th Anv. Rep Power: 23	I believe UpRev is increasing prices for licenses's as well. Not 100% sure but I did hear that through the grapevine. __________________ O&G's Build/Journal <---(1st lowmount single turbo treeseventy) Built Engine Thread 2011 F-250 Build/Journal

10-09-2012, 04:12 PM	#6 (permalink)
seymore4 Track Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: West coast Age: 42 Posts: 560 Drives: 2010 nismo Rep Power: 6727	whelp looks like its official. "There is a BETA version of the ROM editor in the pro download area that give access to the tables that we've found so far for VVEL control. One big piece that is still missing is the cam phasing. There are tables there for phasing, but they don't seem to work yet. Be VERY careful not to change the "Valve Clearance Limit" table as this is the table the keeps the pistons from hitting the valves. Here are the notes about what we know so far about these tables (this info can also be found in the text file inside the beta ZIP folder): So far we know: Valve clearence limit is the safety table that keeps the ECU from running too much lift and advance at the same time. * Adjusting this table is DANGERUS. Too much lift and advance at the same time = piston crashing into the valves. VVEL B seems to have the most effect on idle. At WOT it seems take the max value from either B or C."

10-09-2012, 05:18 PM	#12 (permalink)
O&G A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Lone Star State Age: 42 Posts: 1,212 Drives: 40th Anv. Rep Power: 23	Atleast we've started to turn the corner in cam tuning. It does wonders for other cars w/ and w/o FI! I rarely start any threads because I hate dealing w/ all the haters but in this case I knew a bunch of you guys would appreciate the news. The next step is for our tuners to start exploring the software "safely"! Should be xciting! 370Z Purist, GaleForce and Rusty like this. __________________ O&G's Build/Journal <---(1st lowmount single turbo treeseventy) Built Engine Thread 2011 F-250 Build/Journal

10-09-2012, 05:22 PM	#13 (permalink)
johncy2000 Enthusiast Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Redwood City SVBAZ, CA Posts: 461 Drives: Autohaus Progressive Rep Power: 13	Subed! __________________ 2011 Gun Metallic Nismo 370Z 6MT #435 Autohaus Progressive @johanncarlow autohausp@icloud.com

10-10-2012, 11:40 AM	#14 (permalink)
O&G A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Lone Star State Age: 42 Posts: 1,212 Drives: 40th Anv. Rep Power: 23	This thread is going to poop! __________________ O&G's Build/Journal <---(1st lowmount single turbo treeseventy) Built Engine Thread 2011 F-250 Build/Journal

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