tuning gains

Kastley85891 · 11-18-2009, 07:09 PM

RCZ - Good breakdown
I suspect over the next 12 months all the tuning companies will develop more definitions and 'enable' more tables for our tuning pleasure.
Over time the roms being released for mods and stock equipped vehicles will get better,smoother,faster and more powerful.

oh yeh puckshaw - have not seen any Z's to test the scooby wave as yet ;-)

puckshaw · 11-18-2009, 07:12 PM

Well that makes more sense as to why the gains were so modest. Glad to hear there's more potential once the tuning is...well...fine tuned.

Quote:

Originally Posted by B1nks

car appeals to a larger, non enthusiast, crowd..it'll happen. Maybe this will make you feel better

!

lol

Zsteve · 11-18-2009, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RCZ

Let me rephrase.

If you are stock, tune will make good power. Probably as much as 15+ whp.

If you have full boltons, tune will make no power. 5whp or less.

Now thats how I like things broken down, simple and to the point. That actaully explains things alot better than the long paragraphs.

RCZ · 11-18-2009, 07:50 PM

^ well, Im glad I could help, but If I said those things and didnt explain why, then you would've thought my response was some sort of baseless guess.

I think you are mistaking the term rom with map kastley...they don't release roms, they release maps. Off the shelf maps are a bit of a waste of time/money if you ask me...

Also, a big suby wave from a two time STI owner

Kastley85891 · 11-18-2009, 08:30 PM

Termanology only, rom,map.hex.ptm ,reflash, ROM image
I understand that Roms have specific coding to match the ECU date,type, vehicle type, transmission , blah blah, and maps are variations of that original Rom image but its just a term, Im not being specific, I call em Roms, maps, crap flashes, rocket flashes, you get the picture.

e.g your comment on fuel trims a little up the post, its closed loop fuel targets, trims are automatic % of fuel pulled or added by the ECU to reach that target, no biggie, just termanology and I knew what you ment.

Agreed on the off the shelf jobs, but these can be good starting points for improvement

Two time STi owner also -- lol what made you change? me, I just needed a change and some rear wheel drive, not much snow in TX

G37Sam · 11-19-2009, 03:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RCZ

guys its simple. The only thing uprev and cobb can tune right now is fuel trims. If you have mods, you will already be running lean and you wont have much room for improvement. If you dont have mods, you will be running rich, therefore you can tune the car to run leaner and make power that way.

Let me rephrase.

If you are stock, tune will make good power. Probably as much as 15+ whp.

If you have full boltons, tune will make no power. 5whp or less.

When you say car running rich OEM, how rich are we talking here?

I've seen stock Gs dyno'd and their AF ranged in the high 12s @ WOT.. I don't think that's rich at all. Adding all the bolt ons ie increasing air flow => leaning out, is when you start hitting 14s AF and thats when you need the tune in order to bring the AF to the VQs optimum 12s

Rob@Altered · 12-03-2009, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mpp9

They're have been mixed reviews with tunes from uprev. RCZ didn't gain anything from a tune, semtex gained minimal while others gained 15 or more at the wheels with mods similar to each other and not. Technosquare reflash seemed to add power with its simple off the shelf reflash so what's the deal here? Logically one should do all the boltons and then do the reflash to get the most out of every part but it seems like there's nothing left to gain out of the car at least with some with the uprev tune after boltons. Can someone chime in here.

As other people have pointed out on this thread, every car responds differently to the same mods. That's just a simple fact...

But, what it really comes down to is the skill of the tuner. We've seen the Cobb Access Port do absolute wonders with 370Z's we've had on our dyno. The Cobb Access Port can be a Marvel of Modern Technology if you actually know how to use it.

semtex · 12-03-2009, 09:54 AM

How modded were the 370Zs you've tuned?

Rob@Altered · 12-03-2009, 10:16 AM

We've tuned the entire range of possible sets ups. We've done cars that were bone stock, mild bolt ons, all bolt ons, to twin turbo set ups, and we've seen gains that were beyond our best expectations.

Another thing to take into account is that Cobb is always coming out with new tuning programs which give the us more and more control over all the different aspects of the car. This gives us the ability to see better gains as time goes on.

1slow370 · 12-04-2009, 06:00 AM

I just wan't to throw something out there... Just connecting some dots here and what i'm seeing is 500+ hp turbo kits on an 11 to 1 compression ratio engine, with nothing but fuel tunes as the timing does its own thing right now for both cobb and uprev... does that sound right?

G37Sam · 12-04-2009, 06:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AAM_COMP

We've tuned the entire range of possible sets ups. We've done cars that were bone stock, mild bolt ons, all bolt ons, to twin turbo set ups, and we've seen gains that were beyond our best expectations.

Another thing to take into account is that Cobb is always coming out with new tuning programs which give the us more and more control over all the different aspects of the car. This gives us the ability to see better gains as time goes on.

Can we see dyno sheets please of the setups you're talking about (I've seen the TT one, any ones available for the other setups?)

drZ · 12-04-2009, 06:56 PM

got around 8whp with the up rev thats with all bolt on dones

Nixlimited · 12-05-2009, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AAM_COMP

We've tuned the entire range of possible sets ups. We've done cars that were bone stock, mild bolt ons, all bolt ons, to twin turbo set ups, and we've seen gains that were beyond our best expectations.

Another thing to take into account is that Cobb is always coming out with new tuning programs which give the us more and more control over all the different aspects of the car. This gives us the ability to see better gains as time goes on.

If I am reading all of this correctly, you guys aren't able to tune timing tables yet, right? How safe is a N/A car that has been converted to FI without adjusted timing? I saw that your kit got good numbers, but that just seems to be a really sub-optimal set-up. On my old Suby, timing was what we spent the most time tuning.

1slow370 · 12-05-2009, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nixlimited

If I am reading all of this correctly, you guys aren't able to tune timing tables yet, right? How safe is a N/A car that has been converted to FI without adjusted timing? I saw that your kit got good numbers, but that just seems to be a really sub-optimal set-up. On my old Suby, timing was what we spent the most time tuning.

asked that already seems ludacris

Clint@Altered · 12-07-2009, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1slow370

I just wan't to throw something out there... Just connecting some dots here and what i'm seeing is 500+ hp turbo kits on an 11 to 1 compression ratio engine, with nothing but fuel tunes as the timing does its own thing right now for both cobb and uprev... does that sound right?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nixlimited

If I am reading all of this correctly, you guys aren't able to tune timing tables yet, right? How safe is a N/A car that has been converted to FI without adjusted timing? I saw that your kit got good numbers, but that just seems to be a really sub-optimal set-up. On my old Suby, timing was what we spent the most time tuning.

I've seen this question thrown around a lot lately. From the post I made in the 370ZTT Thread:

We had great success working with the COBB AP (and COBB directly) with this 370ZTT. With the MAFS, the car drives flawlessly. The cobb software can drop the timing curve, but the ECU has a lot of logic that modifies the curve to be what is optimal for the car at any give time.
So timing changes must be well matched - say if the curve that you've put in is too aggressive, at points the ECU may adjust. We tested the COBB AP extensively with the 370Ztt and experienced no knock, no limp modes, no codes (HFCs work wonders) and the car simply runs perfect (and moves out!)

I am not sure about the G37 however as it is different and we have not yet (but soon) tuned a twin turbo g37 with the COBB. The only way we could control the G37 required hard-wiring f-cons in the past.

11-18-2009, 07:09 PM	#16 (permalink)
Kastley85891 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: ATX 370 - Sold Posts: 1,149 Drives: 2003 Wagon Rep Power: 18	RCZ - Good breakdown I suspect over the next 12 months all the tuning companies will develop more definitions and 'enable' more tables for our tuning pleasure. Over time the roms being released for mods and stock equipped vehicles will get better,smoother,faster and more powerful. oh yeh puckshaw - have not seen any Z's to test the scooby wave as yet ;-) Last edited by Kastley85891; 11-18-2009 at 07:14 PM.

11-18-2009, 08:30 PM	#20 (permalink)
Kastley85891 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: ATX 370 - Sold Posts: 1,149 Drives: 2003 Wagon Rep Power: 18	Termanology only, rom,map.hex.ptm ,reflash, ROM image I understand that Roms have specific coding to match the ECU date,type, vehicle type, transmission , blah blah, and maps are variations of that original Rom image but its just a term, Im not being specific, I call em Roms, maps, crap flashes, rocket flashes, you get the picture. e.g your comment on fuel trims a little up the post, its closed loop fuel targets, trims are automatic % of fuel pulled or added by the ECU to reach that target, no biggie, just termanology and I knew what you ment. Agreed on the off the shelf jobs, but these can be good starting points for improvement Two time STi owner also -- lol what made you change? me, I just needed a change and some rear wheel drive, not much snow in TX Last edited by Kastley85891; 11-18-2009 at 08:40 PM.

12-03-2009, 09:54 AM	#23 (permalink)
semtex A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Behind enemy lines Age: 54 Posts: 5,995 Drives: People to drink Rep Power: 32	How modded were the 370Zs you've tuned? __________________ "There are no small accidents on this circuit." -- Ayrton Senna 316.8whp & 248 ft/lbs (Dyno Dynamics) \| 319whp & 256 ft/lbs (DynoJet) (04/23/10) Stillen G3 CAI, CBE, Pulley / F.I. LTH / GTSpec Ladder Brace / Setrab Oil Cooler / UpRev-tuned by Forged Perf.

12-03-2009, 10:16 AM	#24 (permalink)
Rob@Altered Enthusiast Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Gaithersburg Posts: 282 Drives: 350Z/370Z/GTR/G35 Rep Power: 369	We've tuned the entire range of possible sets ups. We've done cars that were bone stock, mild bolt ons, all bolt ons, to twin turbo set ups, and we've seen gains that were beyond our best expectations. Another thing to take into account is that Cobb is always coming out with new tuning programs which give the us more and more control over all the different aspects of the car. This gives us the ability to see better gains as time goes on. __________________ Altered Atmosphere Motorsports RobS@alteredatmosphere.com

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11-18-2009, 07:50 PM	#19 (permalink)
RCZ A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Miami Posts: 6,403 Drives: '09 370Z Rep Power: 1119	^ well, Im glad I could help, but If I said those things and didnt explain why, then you would've thought my response was some sort of baseless guess. I think you are mistaking the term rom with map kastley...they don't release roms, they release maps. Off the shelf maps are a bit of a waste of time/money if you ask me... Also, a big suby wave from a two time STI owner

12-04-2009, 06:00 AM	#25 (permalink)
1slow370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: In the D Posts: 3,732 Drives: v8 74 260z ;) Rep Power: 7251	I just wan't to throw something out there... Just connecting some dots here and what i'm seeing is 500+ hp turbo kits on an 11 to 1 compression ratio engine, with nothing but fuel tunes as the timing does its own thing right now for both cobb and uprev... does that sound right?

12-04-2009, 06:56 PM	#27 (permalink)
drZ Base Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Long Island Posts: 59 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 0	got around 8whp with the up rev thats with all bolt on dones