my car will cut out at *every* track day if i dont keep it at least 75% full. at first i thought it was limp mode kicking on too early (260 degrees), but it's the fuel starvation. it's a hassle to always have to keep it close to full, but as long as i do that, no problems.

cant wait for someone to come up with a real fix.

Oh man...I haven't had this happen to me yet since the track i usually run goes ccw, but Im thinking about PBIR and the back corner, its a very long banked right hander. When I looked at it the other day I thought "fuel starvation city" and didnt put that thought and my car together till right now. Someone please figure this out.

We have been working on a prototype for an in-tank surge can / fuel pump assembly that is specifically intended for road racing.

We are in Chicago, so there is no way for us to do any field testing. However, if there is a reputable member here that is actively taking their 370z to track days and experiencing the fuel starvation issue, and has the means to install a new fuel pump assembly on their own.. I would be interested in sending a prototype to test in roughly 2 weeks. PM me if so.

I'm your man! Next event is march 6/7

Travisjb@gmail.com

^ haha, he's definitely the man for you.

If you need a non race car for testing stuff out, let me know. I go on the track too :)

Its currently looking like the first one might head out to Sharif at Forged to get his feedback with his race car... that car will hold some good G's and is possibly the best test to run this thing thru.

I will start a thread here as soon as the prototype has fully materialized... a week or two at best guess. We have focused a lot of energy into performance fuel systems for a long time now, and I would love for us to be the guys to solve this annoying problem for you guys in a cost effective way!

ok no prob. hope it goes well, we need to test different alternatives so thanks for your work. I'll stick with my plan to fab and test a basic $10 perforated 'coffee can' solution and will also come back here and post results.

possible solution.
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f1...n/e6ffecec.jpghttp://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f1...n/b45be2b7.jpg
Sard - Fuel Collector Tank - Nengun Performance

swirl pot

yea but i rememberd that you guys said it would be in the 2k range for one(i think). this is much cheaper.

price? thx

the external swirl pot is nice and all, but I really dont like the idea of a pot of gasoline being in the interior of my car in the event of a collision. especially when there is a pump constantly pumping into that pot... and if the pot were to rupture.. hopefully someone is conscious to shut off the in-tank pump that is pumping gasoline into the interior. I look at it sorta like trying to put a mechanical fuel pressure gauge in interior... just cant say that im a fan of pressurized fuel lines feeding the cabin. maybe in a race car with an added rear fire-wall, but not a street car on the track. IMHO anyways.

If it were UNDER the car somehow, I'd like that idea. In-car...no way for me...might as well stick some dynamite under my driver seat...I'd be just as comfortable...

Yes, for many states having fuel lines running inside the car is illegal and you will fail a safety inspection if they see it. This includes mechanical fuel pressure gauges, etc. If it's a race car then the sanctioning bodies have their own rules on how and where this can be done.

this is definitely a possibility but unfortunately you will most likely end up with a pot using more horizontal real estate rather than vertical, and adequate displacement will be an issue.

now take that thing you see there, and throw it inside the gas tank. thats the idea we are working with right now.

Now were talking :tup:

unfortunately this week we were really busy between machining parts that need to ship out next week and dealing with a bad sensor on one of the CNCs causing annoyances. next week we should have time to make more progress with our in-tank project... and possibly get a prototype or two shipped out for testing.

I'm curious about fuel starvation off the track. Has anyone experienced the issue on a steep incline? I live in SF, so I'm a little concerned about the engine cutting out on me on a steep hill...

No

None here and I drive Hwy 49 near Foresthill, CA which has a steep incline and switchbacks.

Yes. I've had it occur on the street with 1/4 tank on an uphill right hander driven aggressively. On a flat auto-x circuit it happens fairly consistently at 1/2 tank with long radius right handlers.

The combination of turning right and climbing seems to be the worst for pushing fuel away from the pick-up. Not very common on the street as it requires sustained lateral G's and heavy throttle.

How do you think it would react to driving up or down a street with a grade between 25 and 30%?

As long as you're not trying to re-create any movie scenes by accelerating full throttle up the hill as you fly over the cross roads I think you'll be just fine. And just to be safe fill the tank before it reaches 1/4.

Nah, wrong car for that. :) Ok, thanks!

This happend to me at the track when I was drifting. BAM the car shuts off with about a quarter tank. It happend to me on a left turn. The car started right back up. Scared th holly hell outa me. What can I buy to fix this issue??

Saw this problem at Willow Springs (Big Track) after the #2 sweeper. The throttle would not respond, started happening when I had less then 3/5 of a tank.

Anyone know if someone is working on a replacement tank with better baffling or something for this issue ?

fuel system upgrades

it's been 20 days since he last updated his thread.

I would give him another 10 days before asking for updates, and maybe pictures (if possible).

this is a big priority and I'm surprised we don't have a vendor stepping up yet... four options

1. traditional external swirl pot
2. 'internal swirl pot' that was discussed here a couple mos ago
3. internal baffling
4. complete fuel system replacement, ie fuel cell, new pumps lines, etc

Option 4 may be necessary for those doing real racing or TT setups . Option 3 should be the cheapest but no idea how effective this will be when the tank gets low. I'm planning to give this a try. Basically a coffee can with holes that surrounds the fuel pump in the tank and partially resists flow away from the pump in corners. Option 2 should be the effective but more expensive and would require some engineering specific to this car.

darn, hadn't even seen that... will follow along, sounds like he's on the right track

I have plans for TT, though a full build will take some time, so I hope my only option is #4 but for #1, would it fit in my spare tire area ? I don't plan on putting a sub in so that's a possibility. I wish #3 would work and the thing with the coffee can would it resist both ways really ? What I mean is, if it kept the fuel from flowing away from the pump wouldn't it also partially resist flow to the pump as well ?

PS: Thanks for the link Valentino !

yes, but the idea is that there are extended periods of time between lateral loading where it could fill back up... and you could also pattern the holes so that it resists flow out more than flow in... imagine the angle of the fuel in a hard right hand corner vs straight line braking / accel

I think I experienced this for the first time this weekend at an autox. Oil temps were starting off at 220 before my run, but were 245 at the end of the run. I was getting some momentary "cut outs" mid way through the course and was thinking it was limp mode, but having read this post this morning, pretty sure I was getting fuel starvation. The point of cutout was at the turn around of the course, a sweeping uphill right hander...and it cut out on two separate runs in the same place. I was running about 1/2 tank of fuel so looks like people are getting starvation even between 1/2 and 3/4 so looks like I'll need to run 3/4 to full to be safe.

That's a fair amount of extra weight to have though...

exactly... this will be the best weight reduction mod we can make, once we solve it

Anyone have new news on this subject?

Did Monticello yesterday- last session died on right hander- clearly fuel starvation- could not re-start- course red flagged and I towed off- disconnected battery and restarted fine- like nothing ever happened- about 1-2 dots below half tank. Oddly 2010 Nismo was in group after me he had exact same problem but managed to get off track - we each had about same # laps and both gauges just about half full- other than fuel starvation all else good- great track

It depends where the fuel cut hits that determines whether it will pick up again or stall out. If you are accelerating up hill when you get the cut you will stall out if you don't make it to a crest quickly.

Monticello is a very nice track, some others in our Boston group were there a few weeks ago. Hoping to get there myself sometime soon.

Any updates?

reportedly (check my journal) nissan mo sports is working on an in tank setup where there will be a fuel pickup point on each side of the tank... will be offered as a retrofit where you send them your tank then retrofit and send back... they have a partner helping with this that i have contacted via email but i haven't heard back... i think perhaps stan is the test car

UPDATE: out of pure coincidence, Richard from no hot wire racing just called me... I'm the new guinea pig! will update on my journal

Awesome! I'm subscribed in your thread already. About time someone takes the lead on this!