Time for the 10s.

wstar · 08-11-2014, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GSS138

Phunk you are right as well. And maybe my model of the 4 guys holding the pallet is not good.

Instead. Let's image 4 girls from the Swedish Bikini team holding you up standing on top of the Ark Of The covenant from Raiders of the Lost Ark. IT IS THEIR JOB TO MAKE SURE THE ARK STAYS PERFECTLY LEVEL!

The swimsuit model on the front left corner, is getting tired,so she bends her knees just a little bit. She stops pushing up just a little bit. the weight on the other corners is going to increase a little bit.-but mostly is going to affect her cross weight-the rear right corner.

I really don't think so. I think as the front left girl bends her knees, a percentage of the total weight of the object (which was previously evenly split 4 ways) shifts from all of the other 3 (in varying amounts) to her. The lowest side/corner carries more static weight.

Rangerz · 08-11-2014, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GSS138

Phunk you are right as well. And maybe my model of the 4 guys holding the pallet is not good.

Instead. Let's image 4 girls from the Swedish Bikini team holding you up standing on top of the Ark Of The covenant from Raiders of the Lost Ark. IT IS THEIR JOB TO MAKE SURE THE ARK STAYS PERFECTLY LEVEL!

The swimsuit model on the front left corner, is getting tired,so she bends her knees just a little bit. She stops pushing up just a little bit. the weight on the other corners is going to increase a little bit.-but mostly is going to affect her cross weight-the rear right corner.

Now that is much different than if both of the two Bikine Models holding up the front, just let go completely. In that case-theoretically, all weight would have to be transferred to the two rear set of tits(if they don't want the friggin Ark to touch the ground).

However what could also happen, is that when the FL bikini model stops pushing up and bends over, the other girls sense this, and they stop pushing up too. Eventually they all just give up and the focking Ark of the Covenant is laying in the middle of the road.

Fortunately we have a frame on the car. So if the FL is lowered say 1/4" what really ends up happening is that corner sort of becomes a Bikini model and that 15-20 extra pounds gets distributed to the other 3 b1tches because they all are secured with metal beams to each other.

Damn I actually laughed out loud

that is some fun shik

Arrvaxx · 08-11-2014, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nomodsjk

One advantage the Er's will give you is the easy damper adjustments on the rear struts. All you have to do is pop the hatch and dial the nobs that come up through the rear plastics

Really? That easy? Win.

Arrvaxx · 08-11-2014, 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phunk

I ran a miserable 11.6 last year when I was at 525rwhp, I had 2.0 60's and one really high 1.9. Shifting into 5th at the very end sucks and hurts the ET a little because you dont really even get to use the gear, you just shift cause you are at redline.

I was set to 0.75* negative camber I believe at the time, lowered on H&R springs, factory shocks. 315 toyo drag radials on 18".

If you want to not worry about traction, put stock 350z non brembo (rear) brakes on and cut the dust shield... now you can fit 15" wheels and slicks. a bonus here is that you can run a 28" tire and this should prevent 5th gear from coming up before the 1/4

To do 10s on drag radials is going to mean raising the suspension to stock height or more to get out of the extreme compression camber swing, and stiffening the heck out of it. I would raise the front too... keeping the front low is going to take weight off the rear and you need any weight you can get since you need to stiffen out compression/squat

Any idea what the widest you can go without tsking off the stocks?

Also, you bring up another item i was wonering about...18 or 19s? I would think 19s are harder to spin but not sure if they hurt your time for other reasons.

GSS138 · 08-11-2014, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wstar

Just thinking about basic physics with simple objects (as in your earlier example with 4 guys), this doesn't seem right? I realize with a suspension system there's a lot more going on, but think of the extremes with a simple static object: if the rear two guys kept their end 2 feet off the ground, and the front guys raised their end way up in the air (so that the object is now getting close to vertical, but not quite), wouldn't almost all of the weight be in the rear guys' hands at that point?

Yes and I hope my previous post made you laugh hehe. Keep in mind the goal, the car stays perfectly level.

Yes if you lower the front end 12" and raise the rear end 12", then all the weight is going to be on the front. It will be physically impossible for the two rear people to hold up the weight(unless there are giant springs back there with and incredibly stiff frame). This is why just a little bit of preload is good as well, allowing you to adjust corner weights without actually moving the ride height too much. With 50 lbs of preload on the spring when you load it on the perch, you can first set the ride height, then balance. Lot of guys will do the back first, and then tune in the front. The heavier side(our front) will make more dramatic changes throughout.

When you lower one end of the car too far, it's pretty obvious because an unusual amount of weight will be transferred. That's when your roll moment goes out of whack. so you can use that as a measurement or baseline point. It's just like when you take 400 lbs and don't bend your knees on a squat rack. Sure anyone can suspend 400 lbs on their shoulders if they don't dig too deep. Try doing it with with a full knee bend.

Think of the frame of a house, it's job is to distribute equal weight to all four corners. Even if the earth sinks 1" on one side, the frame transfers this weight around. Same with a car. However, if you completely knock out one corner of the house, then you have a real problem.

Super Werty · 08-11-2014, 07:07 PM

be careful...you might make all these changes to get it to hook, and when it does hook... something will break lol

GSS138 · 08-11-2014, 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wstar

I really don't think so. I think as the front left girl bends her knees, a percentage of the total weight of the object (which was previously evenly split 4 ways) shifts from all of the other 3 (in varying amounts) to her. The lowest side/corner carries more static weight.

If you lower the front left coil of your car, that "missing" 20 lbs of force, is going to get distributed to the other 3 points. Of course, this will end at some point(when your suspension geometry fails/springs give up). And then yes, what you are saying will be correct.

I hate to subject you to this level of nerd but this video is pretty solid: corner balance a car - Bing Videos

Arrvaxx · 08-11-2014, 07:23 PM

Haha. That's ok. She likes it rough. Besides scars make everything sexier.

But good thing to bring up. Luckily for me I would not be stck with a garage paperweight if something went wrong. But not everyone can afford to take risks with their cars so words of caution much appreciated.

phunk · 08-11-2014, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arrvaxx

Any idea what the widest you can go without tsking off the stocks?

Also, you bring up another item i was wonering about...18 or 19s? I would think 19s are harder to spin but not sure if they hurt your time for other reasons.

I am not sure how wide of tires the stock wheels fit. Just remember that with all the camber, the extra tire isnt on the pavement anyway. A car with a better suspension could go 9s on my 315 drag radials.

More sidewall is better for drag racing... that means smaller wheels or taller tires or ideally both. 19s will spin easier and also more likely to bust your axles.

FPenvy · 08-12-2014, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Super Werty

be careful...you might make all these changes to get it to hook, and when it does hook... something will break lol

agreed. this is one of my fears with going with sticky DR's on my car even being just N/A.

my luck the extra grip will end up blowing out my diff or a axle

FPenvy · 08-12-2014, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phunk

I am not sure how wide of tires the stock wheels fit. Just remember that with all the camber, the extra tire isnt on the pavement anyway. A car with a better suspension could go 9s on my 315 drag radials.

More sidewall is better for drag racing... that means smaller wheels or taller tires or ideally both. 19s will spin easier and also more likely to bust your axles.

i was at one point buying 315 19" mickey thompsons to go on my OEM rays but then thought about this exact thing lol

Rusty · 08-12-2014, 10:18 AM

What you want the car to do coming out of the hole is weight transfer to the rear. If you have adjustable shocks in the front. You want them set full soft on rebound, and full stiff on compression. What this does is let the front come up quicker, and keeps it from settling down too soon. And a stiff springs helps too.

On the Z. You want to have the compression full stiff. This keeps it from squating, and changing camber. Stiffer springs here too.

When I used to drag raced my 440 Dart. I ran 90/10 shocks in the front, and 50/50 shocks in the rear. The front would pop up like right now.

phunk · 08-12-2014, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPenvy

agreed. this is one of my fears with going with sticky DR's on my car even being just N/A.

my luck the extra grip will end up blowing out my diff or a axle

I honestly dont think you need to worry about anything except your axles and rear differential mount. The 3rd gear on some of the older trans used to separate but I have not not yet heard of that happening since the CD009 trans or any of the 370z trans (and it was only the high HP TT cars that I ever heard of it happen to). Our driveshaft and differential is in the category of "bulletproof" as in nearly unheard of failures.

The diff mounts are cheap and a couple hours of work to change out. The axles arent hard but expensive if you replace with upgraded ones. Just preload the drivetrain before launch and dont stay in it during wheel hop and you probably wont break an axle.

FPenvy · 08-12-2014, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phunk

I honestly dont think you need to worry about anything except your axles and rear differential mount. The 3rd gear on some of the older trans used to separate but I have not not yet heard of that happening since the CD009 trans or any of the 370z trans. Our driveshaft and differential is in the category of "bulletproof" as in nearly unheard of failures.

The diff mounts are cheap and a couple hours of work to change out. The axles arent hard but expensive if you replace with upgraded ones. Just preload the drivetrain before launch and dont stay in it during wheel hop and you probably wont break an axle.

solid info.

sadly i will not tell you how i ran my fastest 2 ET's and other 1/4 mile runs then lol my technique probably wouldnt fall into ideal for most.

also idk if it's the 7AT but i'm never had any wheel hop issues ever. i've spun on lesser prepped tracks, bald tires, or airport run ways but never any hop.

plus i think i have the only Z that will left me light up the rearsfor full burnouts with just VDC off and none of that pulling the brake fuse stuff that i see everyone say you "need" to do lol

Arrvaxx · 08-12-2014, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phunk

I honestly dont think you need to worry about anything except your axles and rear differential mount. The 3rd gear on some of the older trans used to separate but I have not not yet heard of that happening since the CD009 trans or any of the 370z trans (and it was only the high HP TT cars that I ever heard of it happen to). Our driveshaft and differential is in the category of "bulletproof" as in nearly unheard of failures.

The diff mounts are cheap and a couple hours of work to change out. The axles arent hard but expensive if you replace with upgraded ones. Just preload the drivetrain before launch and dont stay in it during wheel hop and you probably wont break an axle.

I had Fast Intentions put in Whiteline diff bushings after they tore theirs up during their test runs (video's on youtube).

08-11-2014, 07:07 PM	#51 (permalink)
Super Werty Track Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: AZ Posts: 668 Drives: '13 Sport Rep Power: 13	be careful...you might make all these changes to get it to hook, and when it does hook... something will break lol FPenvy and GSS138 like this. __________________ The Build

08-11-2014, 07:23 PM	#53 (permalink)
Arrvaxx A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Whore Island, MN Posts: 1,243 Drives: 40th F.I. Twin Turbo Rep Power: 18	Haha. That's ok. She likes it rough. Besides scars make everything sexier. But good thing to bring up. Luckily for me I would not be stck with a garage paperweight if something went wrong. But not everyone can afford to take risks with their cars so words of caution much appreciated. __________________ 2010 370Z 40th Anniversary (#480 born 1/19/2010) Fast Intentions Twin Turbo \| Varis Arising II \| Limited Edition Recaro Sportster \| Tuned by Specialty Z \| 604hp 525 torque @14lbs boost on 100 octane

08-12-2014, 10:18 AM	#57 (permalink)
Rusty Ronin Samurai - Assassin Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Fayettenam,Pennsyltucky Age: 68 Posts: 35,191 Drives: 2011 Nismo GM 6M Rep Power: 2684437	What you want the car to do coming out of the hole is weight transfer to the rear. If you have adjustable shocks in the front. You want them set full soft on rebound, and full stiff on compression. What this does is let the front come up quicker, and keeps it from settling down too soon. And a stiff springs helps too. On the Z. You want to have the compression full stiff. This keeps it from squating, and changing camber. Stiffer springs here too. When I used to drag raced my 440 Dart. I ran 90/10 shocks in the front, and 50/50 shocks in the rear. The front would pop up like right now. __________________ 浪人 - 殺し屋 "The Difficult Anytime, The Impossible By Appointment Only" http://www.the370z.com/members-370z-...o-journal.html

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