Basic but mandatory track mods help needed.
 

Ok, I just bought a 09 SP MT with 15K in Chicane Yellow. It will be going to the track BUT I am not trying to turn this car into a track monster as it is my weekend car and I have another dedicated track car project in the works. I have alot of track time and I am fast, here is the rub. I am going to be letting my wife take this car to the track. SOoooo... I need to make the car capable enough to keep me happy for a season or two without making it so on edge that my wife puts it into a wall. Also safety is a priority, I won't put my wife in a car that has any chance of fuel starving, cooking brakes and does not have proper harnesses. She's hot and I can't damage her :)

So I am looking for solutions to known problems- I have read alot on this board but I still can't find an actual solution to fuel starvation. This car will be double stinted so filling up before run groups would be a problem.

Brake cooling- I know I need new pads, fluid and cooling, What pads are guys using who switch pads for the track? Does anyone have a good method for getting air in there yet?

I can't find a harness guide bar for the car. Someone has gotta make one right?

What is the most recommended oil cooler out there?

Am I missing anything? Weakness' I know about are brake temp, oil temp, fuel starvation. What else can I expect? Oh and what size tires are guys running on stock wheels? I'm planning on different street wheels so I'll use the stockers for the track.

Thanks for reading and the help if you have it, I am looking forward to getting on the track with the car, and getting the misses out there. I hope I don't regret that one.

I advise the both of you to take classes together on racing techniques. As for brakes, tires, and cooler: upgrade brakes, I'm still on my stock ones. Tires, wide grips, but those are kinda expensive, and cooling; since its only a weekend warrior, maybe a stillen for ya sir.

Thanks for the input. I have about 150 track days and no time for a school at the moment. I work about 90 hours a week all summer so just getting to the track is going to be tough. That is part of the reason I am only concentrating on reliability/safety mods.

See sig for a good idea for brake/oil cooling mods. Basically run a 25 or 34row oil cooler, brake fluid, lines, and pads and you're all set.

As far as fuel starve, you're just gonna have to top off the tank after every session. You could try bringing a big ol gas can wiht you if you don't have time to actually go and fill up. There's a solution being worked on by a vendor on here but it's not ready for prime time yet.

Tires, stock nismo sizes but running PS2s. Will be switching to PSS's once they become available (and these wear out) hopefully by the summer/fall. BIG improvement over the stock Advans btw.

How are the Carbotech brake pads? The car will be trailered to the track so it doesnt matter if they are streetable. You didn't feel it is needed to add brake cooling? Bringing gas isn't a problem I was just hoping to not miss 5 minutes of track time pulling into the pits and filling up. Its times like that when you are in a hurry and dumb things happen.

The xp8's, IMO, are fine both on track and streetable as well. My wife is actually the track rat, I'm just the "crew chief" (cervical & lumbar spinal injuries and a TBI etc etc). She's been doing HPDEs for a few years now and her feedback is the xp8s are fine on track with her braking style. We're considering moving up the xp10s at some point but I'd rather add brake ducting first. Unfortunately, there's no "off the shelf" solution yet, if there was, it'd be on our car already.

The carbotechs have been wearing extremely well and while they dust, it's non corrosive so our wheels still look brand new after a nice wash. We both have a very high tolerance for brake squeal etc, so I consider them total fine for daily driving etc.

They make Hoosiers in stock sizes, if you want a dual purpose tire, the AD08 is almost as fast as an R compound and behaves a lot like one.

With street tires, I'd go XP8 pads, AD08s, XP10s and R compounds, XP12. The only problem with the Carbotechs is wear. I got a day and a half at Road Atlanta out of my current set of XP12s and they are over halfway worn. The last set lasted 5 days at various tracks in the area.

For fuel, if the track doesn't have it, I have been bringing a 15 gallon can and topping up every time.

For a harness bar, noone makes one. Its gonna have to be custom. Autopower makes a weld in rear cage.

I recently upgraded to the Z1 race cooler, I love it.

I appreciate the input. This gives me a place to start. On one of my past track cars I did DIY brake cooling front and rear. I think this car is going to get that treatment. My thinking isn't really that it is 100% needed but I want the brakes to be as consistent as possible for the wife. I am used to recognizing and managing fade. The wife is not. If I can take that out of the equation it will be a good thing.

At my home track I was a spectator for a number of years before I got my own car, I would hang out in the corner that got people in trouble and watch the drivers when things went bad. What I found was when something unexpected happens a large number of people would just freeze up and quit driving. They would take no action and ride the car into the tire wall. If I do everything possible to keep things like fuel starvation from happening hopefully the wife won't ride the car into something.

Mike, cooler brakes last alot longer. I only mention it because pads are expensive when they only last a couple of days!

The brakes on the Z can get really hot towards the end of a session, if you want your pads to last I would suggest using some form of brake ducting. I ran sintered pads to deal with the heat, nothing else could take it without either fading or wearing quickly. The sintered pads are more expensive but I got 5 weekends (11 days) out of a set before they were 2/3rds warn and relegated to the spares bin.

Don't know of a bolt in harness bar, doesn't seem to be many of us tracking the Z so not a high demand I guess. A custom harness bar might be the way to go in your case.

Oil cooler, go with the Z1 34 row Setrab setup. My setup blocks too much air to the radiator and is not ideal.

Fuel starvation will be an issue. You can go 1, maybe 1.5 20 minute sessions before having problems. At NHMS you'll get it at T4 going up the hill. A novice isn't going to encounter it as quickly as they are pulling less lateral G and not as heavy on the throttle mid corner.

What compound are you going to run on the stock wheels? You can fit up to a 275 front, 305 rear ideally.

Chris,
I plan on cooling the brakes and running sintered pads. I used to run Pagid Black and Hawk blues which are both very agressive. I was going to ask about the uphill at NHMS as it is the perfect storm for starvation coupled with a bad place to have the motor cut out. I have seen some bad spins there. I don't think the first set of tires will be Hoosiers as they are not a good choice for the novice wife. What do you recommend for a tire that is grippy when cool and has forgiving characteristic at low slip angles? I still have yet to really look at the car for a custom Harness guide bar. Holidays and all. Chances are I'll just make one as I am not in a hurry to put in a cage. This season I plan on SSGT with COMSCC and ST1 next year. After that The wife can stick in ST1 forever and I'll be in PA with the completed project car.

James, the fuel cut at the uphill in NH usually happens after you've straightened out, so no risk of spin. Very annoying though.

I tried the Hawk DTC-70 for WGI when I couldn't get hold of a set of sintered pads in time. The feel was good but they did overheat a bit towards the end, without ducting anyway. That will be one of my projects this winter. I would recommend that you try the CL Brakes RC6 compound front, RC5+ rear. Essex Racing carries them.

Are you looking for a tire that is going to make a bit of noise, i.e. a sticky street tire? I would probably recommend the RE-11's or Yoko AD08. The NT01 is a good intermediate tire but Hoosiers there isn't any grip for the first lap until things get warmed up a little - not available in 19" sizes anyway.

What is the project car? Sounds like a bit of a track monster if it is going to run in PA!

I'm used to Hoosiers but they would be a poor choice for the wife. I want a tire that isn't an on/off switch at the limits and isn't skating all over the place cold. I am willing to give up some all out speed so long as it is more predictable for the wife. I just don't see myself having much fun on street tires so they have to be R compound.

The track car is a 944 Turbo that is gutted and caged through the firewall to the suspension. I have the widebody fit for it, the whole car (basically)will be fiberglass. 11" front wheels and 13" rears, it should weigh about 2400#'s. I had planned on a hot 3L 968 Turbo motor but after blowing up a few porsche turbo motors I think this car is getting a Z06 motor. That outta get a few peoples attention. In COM the only place it will fit is PA which is fine because there are a few other cars there anyway.

Yeah, I know. I have been foolishly awaiting stillen's brake cooling kit for their bumper that I have. Now I have been thinking of some type of duct coming through the lower corners of the hood and down into the wheel well. My bumper design doesn't leave a lot of room to work with. FWIW, I run stoptech trophy brake system, and since the upgrade the only downside is the rapid pad wear in front.

Also, unlike most cars, when the stockers start to fade, you. Have very little warning, it's almost instantaneous. When I first got the car, I was on a 1.4 mile course and got a tiny hint of fade halfway around the track and immediately backed off and cooled down, barely touching the brakes til I entered the pits. Took about 30 yards to stop from 15mph, very scary.

Is that the "ice mode" I hear about? I can't really believe the car got out of the factory like that. Was that on stock pads?

Mike,
What did you do about harness'? Chris you have a cage correct?

Still running regular belts. Have seats and rails, but not putting them in until I can at least get a harness bar, but income tax is my primary financial concern at the moment.

As for the brakes, it was hp+ pads which I had successfully run on my 350 and my c6. They were worn to the backing plates in a twenty minute session. It wasn't ice mode, just boiled fluid. It was at znats two years ago, my first outing with the car

No cage. That is going in this winter along with proper seats and harnesses. Last year it was stock seats and belts, but given how fast I was going that really wasn't a great idea. After seeing one of the other very experienced drivers crash his Cayman into the pit wall at 80 mph with stock belts I knew it was time for a safety upgrade.

As for the "Ice-mode" it occurs when you get front pad fade, causing the brake balance to go wildly rearwards and totally freaks out the ABS system. This is the reason I run the sintered pads and a biased front/rear setup. Running the same compound front and rear you have to be very careful to not apply full brake pressure until most of the forward weight transfer has occurred.

Chris,
After watching your Glen vids I can believe you drive like that with no harnesses! Not simply for safety but just staying in place must be pretty tough. Are you going for a cage or just a bar? If you want we can put our heads together and come up with a harness bar that goes in using the stock top anchor points and maybe one hole in the car. Its just as easy to build 2 as one. I think we are about 1/2 hour from each other.

LOL, I know right? The stock seats aren't awful but you do get thrown around a bit and you end up spending way too much effort trying to brace your body rather than drive.

I was hoping to do at least a rear 4-point for some rollover protection. I don't really drive on the street anymore so I'm not worried about the diagonals taking up trunk space.

If you come up with a jig for the bar I'm sure you could sell at least 10 of them right now to the folks on this site. But with the sponsorship requirement and all that it could be too much of a hassle.

/\ first thing that ran thru my mind as well. Well that and whoever comes up with a good brake ducting kit will sell a few of those as well.

I /REALLY/ want a harness bar. I'm looking at having one custom built this winter myself. I would do the 4 point but I was talked out of it by the local cage builder.

I have a harness bar fitted and have found the jig used to construct it this morning (the engineer who fabricated it has only just return from his summer holiday).

You can see the bar fitted - search for my 201 posts - this post has a series of photo's following the install.

http://www.the370z.com/exterior-inte...rness-bar.html

I have checked with the engineer and he has 3 bars available (powder-coated in black). I have put my foot on all three, pending confirmation of interested parties on the forum.

I have firm interest in one bar and would like to place the other 2 as well - any further bars can be made to order by PM to me. Price for any new-build bars will have to be established.

The 3 existing bars are US$220 each, plus postage (Air Parcel Post International from Australia to the continental US "should" be around A$100, so max cost will not be more than US$375 delivered to your door. If the postage is more than A$100 then the overall price will rise on a dollar for dollar basis (postage of A$110 says total is $385 and so on)

I am not doing this for profit - merely me helping forum members out - I'm only hoping to cover my costs in sourcing and shipping the bars.

Fitting needs to be arranged by the purchaser - it is not difficult if you know your way around a tool chest, but if the last spanner you used (wrench for you guys in the US) was to assemble LEGO, you may wish to seek assistance from your go-to wrench guy.

Given that the US viewed by us in the antipodes as the land of litigation - it goes without saying that these units are fitted and used at your own risk.

Any interested parties - please PM me.

RB

Harness Bar
 

Check out MotoIQ's article on Robispec. The gentleman that runs this shop (Robi) has a very cool replacement for the rear strut bar that serves as a harness bar also. It also stiffens the chasis considerably. Check this out:

[IMG]****************************370Z/Feature-Photos/Robispec-Time-Attack-370Z/JEF9450/718459214_bkKXu-L.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]****************************370Z/Feature-Photos/Robispec-Time-Attack-370Z/JEF9446/718459187_qEev2-L.jpg[/IMG]

I love the approach he has to suspension tuning. I plan on copying his setup if possible. I have not been successful getting intouch with him but I wonder if he will consider a group buy. I will try again but let me know if you guys are interested.

RB,
I'll take one! And thank you for sourcing these.

All 3 bars are now spoken for. Expecting to ship on Friday this week. PM sent to all interested parties.

Keeping the tank full will alleviate all fuel starvation issues on stock tires at most tracks in an unprepared car such as yours.

Overall, this is not a great car for the track if you're not willing to make a few mods... sounds like you are, so here's what I'd recommend in order

1. high temp brake fluid... ate blue/gold is fine for casual track days... you might consider swapping some of the other fluids as well... I use Motul for pretty much everything
2. single-core oil cooler... in your northern climate and given it sounds like you will be doing fairly tame 20 min session DE's, you don't need to get too crazy with big oil coolers
3. basic weight reduction... remove spare, etc
4. basic changes to make the car more fun to drive and control... my order: a) anti-sway bars, b) your preferred brake friction compound - Chris had good suggestions, c) upgrade the rear diff - I use and like Carbonetics, d) extra set of wheels and tires dedicated for the track

Do the things above and monitor tire pressure and temps across the tire surface of each tire in between runs and you'll both be safe and have a blast.

Your idea to add front brake cooling is a good one.

Further down the list... coilovers and other suspension parts... footnote: I've been running rear spring rates ~85% of front spring rate... thinking about altering this to ~65% of front spring rates, which has apparently worked well for the GrandAm race team running their 370Z

Further down the list... power mods
Further down the list... extreme weight reduction
Further down the list... more power mods

If you have to pick a couple power mods, I would buy used stillen g3 intakes with new filters, then buy a used cat-back, then uprev tune. Those will get you 3/4 of the way to easy NA power gains.

Keep in mind, none of these things fixes the issue of "brake ice mode" that has been attributed to the ABS computer on this car... most argue that it is caused by the computer picking up "significant" differential wheel spin rates... make sure you read about this before going to the track and understand and practice how you will respond if it happens... you can in fact learn to induce it in practice and then practice modulating (slowly) the brake pedal to reset the computer but it requires patience under difficult conditions

damn, how did I miss this?

I hope you got my PM 'cause I never heard back and now I'm nervous. :P

Got the PM and replied ... I pick all three bars up tonite and will box up ready for shipping pending payment - on Friday.

Mike - if you want one, PM me - I have the jig and can get more made but will need to get a quote for a one-off.

Robin Bailey

pm sent!

I got in touch w the guys at Robispec (regarding a replacement rear strut bar). Their racing Z was destroyed on Button Willow. They are willing to fabricate a bar just like the one they had in the MotoIQ article. The problem is he needs a Z to reproduce the master bar before making more. Apparently the one they had was a prototype. They are located between LA and Vegas.

The reason I am interested in this setup is that it replaces the factory bar with a much stiffer one, fits a harness, and doesn't obstruct my rear view (daily driver car). Plus it just looks badass! They will powder coat it too.

Any interested parties?

^ one thing to consider is that some sanction bodies (like NASA) assign points to a rear strut bar replacement and even more if it has 3 or more connect points (which a truly strong bar would). If you plan to TT or race, something to consider. Also, IMHO the OEM setup is pretty stiff already.

One final point re oil temps .... I fitted a sump extender and carry 6.5 litres of oil in the sump as a consequence, together with a 19 row oil cooler. Even in 38 DecC ambient temps, oil temp never goes above 115 Dec C. I also like the idea of a deeper sump/increased oil capacity to avoid oil surge ... in the very early days, my race car was a wet sump and after losing 2 cranks with oil surge, we had no option but to go to a dry-sump, but this car is running 290/625R16 slicks so it has "lots" of lateral grip.

Now that I have a Motec dash logger - I'll plug that into the Z and be able to monitor lateral G's which is the best indicator of propensity for oil surge - it also samples oil pressure 200 times per seconds - another good reason for for a modern logger (have used a DL-1 for 10 years, but only a basic system).

So, I also suggest a sump extender but it does mean that oil temps in colder weather require the oil cooler to be partially blocked off (I use an aluminium foil wrapper), or an oil themrostat be used.