Track pad recommendations
 

hello everyone! first post, but i've been lurking for a while. Looking for opinions from the track folks here to guide me in the right direction.

I've recently installed the akebono brakes on my g35 coupe and I am in search for a set of track pads. After a bit of searching I am seeing a lot of people running the XP10/XP8 combo front and rear on their Z's.

However, my vehicle packs quite a bit more weight, coming in at 3600lbs I'm not sure whether I should shell out the extra bit and step it up to XP12 and XP10 front/rear. what do you all think?

Anyone have experience with winmax pads? I'm also looking into those as an option other than carbotech.

winmax is really good but I haven't ran it on the Z, a lot of S2K guys run winmax w5/w6 with good success but that's a much lighter car

I run xp10/8 on the Z and sometimes I get brake fade, mostly because of shitty cooling I suppose, and for some reason there's always a bunch of debris left on my rotors every session. I'm stepping up to 12/10 and see if that helps



side note: looks like you're in the bay area, hope to see you around the tracks here! I rarely ever see Zs and Gs at track days

Great to hear that winmax pads are good. I'll definitely look into them more.

Sounds like I might just make the jump and go straight for the xp12/10 combo or the winmax equivalent if you're also experiencing some brake fade (considering my car is ~300lbs heavier).

While my stock calipers were on, I had XP10s in front and they were smearing on my rotor towards the end of the session at t-hill west, but i also had tiny 12" rotors prior to the akebonos.

You're right, there aren't very many of us out in the norcal tracks!
I'll definitely come say hi if I run into you...or will you be at the svzg summit run? :driving:

Have you try same compound front and rear?

I am in the Bay as well, probably do a few track days this year. I mostly autox with SCCA and AAS in a BRZ, but probably bring the Z out more this year

yeah looks like carbotech smearing is common? i end up getting hella vibrations when i brake and I checked my rotors, they're not warped or anything.

I think W6 is the equivalent

I want to come to the summit event but last time I was there I almost lost my bumper because of scraping, but I will try to make it out to Livermore for food after

I haven't tried using the same compound front and rear. Previously, my pad setup was XP10 in front and P.mu HC+ in the rear, I keep the p.mu on even for street driving and would just swap front pads after track days. I do have a 2.5" duct going to each front wheel to help cool things down, but even with that sometimes the fade is still a little scary.

There are a number of threads on bake pads for the street and track. I would make sure that you check all the braking to due list before jumping to a real aggressive track only pad. I run x10 front and x8 rear. My Z weighs 3450 with a full tank of fuel and me in it. I have brake cooling ducts, ss brake lines, z1 two piece rotors and use Castro SRF racing brake fluid. I have yet to have any brake fade. I am not the fastest in the advanced group but I am not the slowest. Having an over aggressive pad can lead to ice mode which is every bit as scary as having no brake or fade and they will eat your rotors in one or two track days. I'm not saying x12/10 or 12/8 will not work for you just that when all the boxes are checked with the right upgrades it may not be necessary.

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I ran Winmax W6.5 F/R on my z with re71r, they were fantastic, bites hard, works well with little heat, and didn't fade.

Currently I use XP10/8 combo as well, very great pads and they are quieter than winmax.

Now, I am between getting XP12 F/R, MX72 F/R or winmax again. I am looking for better initial bite, and I feel it will be better for trail-braking if I got the same compound for fronts and rears. ;)

Got a Deja Vu after reading that :rofl2:

I got ice mode in street with W6.5, as I use the car with all assets, which resulted in an accident before two years. In track, I didn't experience it with Yaw sensor mod.

Ice mode applies to g35 as well?

I appreciate the pointers, you're definitely right. There's a lot more to the equation than just the pads. The reason I put up a thread was to get more opinions and insight from drivers due to my car being a G and packing an additional 300lbs over the z34.

I'll do some more reading before I place an order. wouldn't want to buy track pads twice lol.

Yes, nothing different about the braking systems!

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I have only heard good things about Endless brakes other than the cost lol.

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Oh yeah, I remember that! Track pads need heat in them and driving with them on the street can lead to big trouble as you found out. Hopefully we have someone from doing the same thing after read our posts.

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I use XP8's all around. You do have to pay attention while driving on the interstate in the cold or rain. All I do is just tap the brakes from time to time. More so if cold and raining. The XP10's up front may be fine for street driving. Not sure. It is easy to make a blunder, you have to be on your game.

Your brake pads should be as aggressive as the tire you're running. The closer matched they are, the less prone to ice mode you'll be.

Agreed, very good point!

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As a great budget option, the Powerstop Track Day Spec Pads (PSA part numbers) work well in the Akebono calipers for track day and time attack duty. You'll certainly still need some brake cooling if you lapping hard, but these pads work very well and put up with the abuse.

I picked a set of these up from Rock Auto at the beginning of the 2018 season, after talking with some technical resources at Powerstop. They compared them very closely in their development testing to the Hawk DTC 60. I swapped them in for track days and time attack events and was able to run 3 lapping days and 2 time attack events with plenty of meat left. All events run on RE71R tires. In most cases, I'd drive to the track with the Powerstop pads and then daily drive the car with them still in for a week or so after the event. The pads performed great on the street as well, without excessive dusting or noise.

For around $160 US for a full set, these pads are certainly worth a shot.

oh wow, never knew power stop makes a pad comparable to the DTC60. I'll look into those too, $160 for a set is too attractive not to check out. I'm currently on Federal 595 RS-RR's, although they're not quite RE71R in terms of grip, it's still a 200tw tire.

Sounds too good to be true. Perforce good, long life, no excessive dust or noise, and cheap.

I agree!!! I'm not sure I would put my safety and others on the line with a product that is not a known source for the track. At least to me when it comes to track cars...you generally get what you pay for. Yes there are exceptions but there is a reason most proven track parts cost more than street use parts.

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Trust me, I had my doubts as well.

I should probably clarify a bit, on the track my white wheels turn to grey in something less than 2 laps. On the street, the pads only dust slightly more than my Stoptech Sport Compound pads I run normally, but not to the point I'd call it excessive. I am probably more acceptable to dust than others as I know it's a by-product of a good pad.

FWIW, I'm pretty newish to the 370z and this forums, but have competitively campaigned Subarus in rally for several years. On that car I've tried many many pads (Hawk DTC 60, Carbotech 10/12, Cobalt ZR2, Carbone Lorrane CL-6/8, and some Performance Friction). I have no problems ranking the Powerstop Track Day Specs solidly among those other products which cost significantly more. As a matter of fact, if Powerstop had the fitment for my rally car available, there would be a set of the track day spec pads in there to try further. Yes, my favorite pads still carry a hefty price tag (CL Brakes) but sometimes throwing ~$500 for a full set isn't in the cards for a consumable item on a street driven car which sees lapping or time attack.

Just like wine, spending big dollars does not always guarantee something exceptional. I'm sure we've all enjoyed excellent bottles for $8. Sometimes big dollar price tags are very much a part of marketing strategies. The same way that providing good parts at fair prices can be a strategy. We usually find the good, bad, and hidden gems by way of reviews and recommendations from family, friends, competitors, or sometimes forums ;)

I have done a bit of research on these"track day SPEC" pads with the PSA part numbers these past couple days. They seem to be very well liked by the Vette community who tracks their cars and also has a few threads with great feedback from s2ki and f80 m3 forums. Will from THmotorsport even made a post stating that the fade resistance and pedal feel is very similar to an xp10 in his own experience. Seems to be a pretty solid product from what I can tell. I've actually reached out to powerstop and asked for a mu vs temperature chart to see the characteristics of this compound. The rep told me my email has been forwarded to the product manager so I'm still waiting for that to come in. $165 for four corners is a crazy price. I'm 80% sure I'll end up buying these, I'll be sure to report back after tracking them.

Sport calipers part numbers.

Front Only PST-1346. Amazon $98.57

Rear Only PST-1347. Amazon $84.42

That's going to save a few hundred a year.:tup:

Just to make sure, the Track Day SPEC pads are the "PSA" part numbers. PST-1346 Front and PSA-1347 Rear

Pricing is just about identical tho.

Yup! placed my order for the PSA 1346/1347 combo. Pretty excited to see how these perform on track!

Side note
****LONG POST WARNING****

I got a reply back from Powerstop in regards to my request for a "mu vs temperature" graph on the PSA pad compound.

"This is the response from our Product Manager

The chart that the customer referenced was something that was fabricated by Hawk’s marketing department. Real friction readings do not follow nice pretty curves like that and there are many more factors than temperature and friction coefficient. In addition to temperature, factors like vehicle weight, vehicle speed, pedal pressure, stop duration, brake system design, etc. all play into how a pad is going to perform.

Brake system design consists of the following:

Master cylinder diameter
Brake pedal lever
Booster type
ABS System
VSC System
Brake Bias
Caliper Piston diameter
Caliper design
Pad shape
Brake hoses
Brake fluid type

Power Stop does not create graphs like this because there is no such graph in real life."

Now, I'm not claiming to be a materials engineer. However, I don't see how such a chart can't exist. Under lab conditions, it should be possible to calculate mu with all other variables known and controlled. Their response does seem to be have misinterpreted my intentions though. The product manager seems to think I am looking for a chart that graphs FRICTION (which would have to factor in many variables that differ based on the vehicle), but I am merely looking for a MU graph which should translate to the real world as "pad bite" and when the mu drops off aka when "brake fade" comes in.

Do we have any materials people in here that can enlighten me? I'm sure real world materials testing is way more complex than just F =μN. Would love to learn something new.

The chart I attached below is the Hawk graph in question.

https://www.focusst.org/forum/attach...20graph-3-.jpg

One other thing. Rotor material. Different companies use different grades of cast iron. Also powdered iron. Each has different friction coefficients. ;)

I’ll stick to what works, considering I burn through xp10’s in two track days

Do you have brake ducts for cooling, if not you should get them as I get 6 to 8 weekends out mine. I seem to be light on the brakes compared to others though and I am not that fast!:tup:

The fastest slow turtle out there. :driving:

Yes. My previous tracks I guess I wasn’t pushing as hard.

Haha, Sebring is a long fast track and those type of tracks are hard on brakes. I don't run to many like that!

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