How much is TOO much?

osbornsm · 09-23-2015, 10:48 AM

Results from a recent 370z driving experience:

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Location: Joliet, IL
Venue: Autobahn Country Club - Full track
Lap Time: 2:52.65
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Vehicle Statistics

Oil temp = 250 F
Oil pressure @ wot = 80psi
Coolant Temp = 219 F
Average Engine RPM = 5297
Average Throttle position = 59%
Trans temp = you wish
Diff temp = in ur dreams

Also of note, that oil temp of "nearly limp mode" is with a 25-row Z1 oil cooler.

GPS Statistics

Max Speed = 113.3 mph
Avg Speed = 75.9 mph
Min Speed = 44.7 mpg (at "patience")
Track Elevation Change = 40 ft.
Distance = 3.56 Mi
Lap Time = 2:52.65

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In regards to the thread title... at what point does coolant no longer "cool"
I was under the impression that coolant boiling point was just a "skooch" higher than the boiling point of water.

Spooler · 09-23-2015, 11:26 AM

You would benefit from a triple pass radiator and a larger oil cooler. Radiator would help the most.

osbornsm · 09-23-2015, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spooler

You would benefit from a triple pass radiator and a larger oil cooler. Radiator would help the most.

Also of note, this car is my daily-driver in Chicago. So it gets snow tires in the winter. Also not sure if there's a way not to over-cool the motor for winter usage.

I realize lots of this can be solved with another car, but let's move past that for now...

ban25 · 09-23-2015, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by osbornsm

Also of note, this car is my daily-driver in Chicago. So it gets snow tires in the winter. Also not sure if there's a way not to over-cool the motor for winter usage.

I realize lots of this can be solved with another car, but let's move past that for now...

If you have a themostatic sandwich plate, the oil flow into the cooler will be reduced below 180F. Additionally, you can fashion a block-off plate to mount on the cooler to reduce airflow in winter.

gomer_110 · 09-23-2015, 01:36 PM

I've driven mine in the winter (sparingly) here in NW Ohio when it was below freezing outside with a 34 row oil cooler with a block off plate along with a CSF non-triple pass radiator. While it took 10-15 min for the oil to get to 180, it did get there.

MAMotorsports · 09-23-2015, 01:57 PM

Radiator and oil cooler as these guys said. As for driving in winter, the only real thing I ever noticed was I just had to let my car warm up a little longer than normal on real cold days.

As for coolant Vs water, pure water will have a boiling point of 212F, Pure ethylene glycol's boiling point is 387F. A 50/50 mix is normally around 230F.

osbornsm · 09-23-2015, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAMotorsports

As for coolant Vs water, pure water will have a boiling point of 212F, Pure ethylene glycol's boiling point is 387F. A 50/50 mix is normally around 230F.

Good info, thank you kindly.

gomer_110 · 09-23-2015, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAMotorsports

As for coolant Vs water, pure water will have a boiling point of 212F, Pure ethylene glycol's boiling point is 387F. A 50/50 mix is normally around 230F.

From a engineering standpoint I would think the boiling points would actually be some what higher as it's a pressurized system.

Higher pressure = Higher boiling point.

Pressure and Boiling Points of Water

MAMotorsports · 09-23-2015, 04:50 PM

You are correct on the pressure, most Z systems run about 15lbs and that will bump up the boiling point by a decent amount. Closer to 250-270ish.

SouthArk370Z · 09-23-2015, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by osbornsm

... In regards to the thread title... at what point does coolant no longer "cool"
I was under the impression that coolant boiling point was just a "skooch" higher than the boiling point of water.

The coolant will continue to work until it boils. Steam is still capable of removing heat but the density is much lower so it doesn't absorb as much as liquid water.

FWIW, the boiling point of water/antifreeze goes up about three degrees F per psig. Straight water is about 2 degF/psig. But those are just a rule-of-thumb numbers.

Rusty · 09-23-2015, 08:59 PM

At work. We heat water up to 1,100F @ 2,000psi. And It doesn't boil.

Zipper 104 · 09-24-2015, 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rusty

At work. We heat water up to 1,100F @ 2,000psi. And It doesn't boil.

I going to assume you're making power for someone.
How many megawatts are you guys putting out?
Whose turbines are you spinning?
The mothers of all feed pumps on those boilers, huh? Nice.
I'd like to see your setup.

104

2011 Nismo#91 · 09-24-2015, 10:15 AM

250 isn't nearly 280 (limp mode)
I think your fine with your oil cooler.
Switching to water and water wetter coolant for the track season it the only think I would say you might consider.
The 2011s don't have the same pressurized coolant system as the 2012+ models. Not sure what pressure each version works at.

abm89 · 09-24-2015, 12:46 PM

How humid was it during the day? That will really kill your cooling performance.

I plan on rigging a water spray system to my kit.

osbornsm · 09-24-2015, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by abm89

How humid was it during the day? That will really kill your cooling performance.

I plan on rigging a water spray system to my kit.

Was a 75 Degree day, and relatively not-humid.

I also got a spongy pedal after the 4th run, so i packed it up after nearly-boiling the Motul i'm running.
Didn't want to flush a brake system that was still 300F.

09-23-2015, 10:48 AM	#1 (permalink)
osbornsm A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: WHAT Posts: 2,551 Drives: 2018 Camaro SS 1LE Rep Power: 424	How much is TOO much? Results from a recent 370z driving experience: -------------------------------------------- Location: Joliet, IL Venue: Autobahn Country Club - Full track Lap Time: 2:52.65 -------------------------------------------- Vehicle Statistics Oil temp = 250 F Oil pressure @ wot = 80psi Coolant Temp = 219 F Average Engine RPM = 5297 Average Throttle position = 59% Trans temp = you wish Diff temp = in ur dreams Also of note, that oil temp of "nearly limp mode" is with a 25-row Z1 oil cooler. GPS Statistics Max Speed = 113.3 mph Avg Speed = 75.9 mph Min Speed = 44.7 mpg (at "patience") Track Elevation Change = 40 ft. Distance = 3.56 Mi Lap Time = 2:52.65 -------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------- In regards to the thread title... at what point does coolant no longer "cool" I was under the impression that coolant boiling point was just a "skooch" higher than the boiling point of water. __________________ 2018 Camaro SS 1LE (455hp) - 2011 Nissan 370z (333hp) - 2004 VW R32 (240hp) - 2000 Civic Si (160hp) Last edited by osbornsm; 09-27-2015 at 01:12 PM.

09-23-2015, 01:36 PM	#5 (permalink)
gomer_110 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Perrysburg, OH Posts: 17,992 Drives: '11 Nismo #528 GM Rep Power: 36941	I've driven mine in the winter (sparingly) here in NW Ohio when it was below freezing outside with a 34 row oil cooler with a block off plate along with a CSF non-triple pass radiator. While it took 10-15 min for the oil to get to 180, it did get there. __________________ '11 370Z Nismo #528 Fast Intentions \| Stillen \| Motordyne \| Uprev \| CSF \| Zspeed \| Z1 Motorsports \| AST \| Swift \| SPC \| SPL \| Whiteline \| Hotchkis \| Bride \| Schroth \| Robispec \| Cusco \| Nismo \| Volk \| Forgestar \| Hoosier \| RJM '17 Titan Bone Stock

09-23-2015, 01:57 PM	#6 (permalink)
MAMotorsports Track Member Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: Glen Arm, MD Posts: 872 Drives: 370Z Rep Power: 17	Radiator and oil cooler as these guys said. As for driving in winter, the only real thing I ever noticed was I just had to let my car warm up a little longer than normal on real cold days. As for coolant Vs water, pure water will have a boiling point of 212F, Pure ethylene glycol's boiling point is 387F. A 50/50 mix is normally around 230F. onzedge likes this. __________________ Daelen @ MA Motorsports MA-Motorsports.com https://www.facebook.com/pages/MA-Mo...C/125379858828

09-23-2015, 04:50 PM	#9 (permalink)
MAMotorsports Track Member Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: Glen Arm, MD Posts: 872 Drives: 370Z Rep Power: 17	You are correct on the pressure, most Z systems run about 15lbs and that will bump up the boiling point by a decent amount. Closer to 250-270ish. __________________ Daelen @ MA Motorsports MA-Motorsports.com https://www.facebook.com/pages/MA-Mo...C/125379858828

09-23-2015, 08:59 PM	#11 (permalink)
Rusty Ronin Samurai - Assassin Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Fayettenam,Pennsyltucky Age: 68 Posts: 35,217 Drives: 2011 Nismo GM 6M Rep Power: 2684438	At work. We heat water up to 1,100F @ 2,000psi. And It doesn't boil. __________________ 浪人 - 殺し屋 "The Difficult Anytime, The Impossible By Appointment Only" http://www.the370z.com/members-370z-...o-journal.html

09-23-2015, 11:26 AM	#2 (permalink)
Spooler A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Ga Posts: 13,830 Drives: 2013 Nismo 370z Rep Power: 2684392	You would benefit from a triple pass radiator and a larger oil cooler. Radiator would help the most.

09-24-2015, 10:15 AM	#13 (permalink)
2011 Nismo#91 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: NJ Posts: 2,401 Drives: slowly Rep Power: 40569	250 isn't nearly 280 (limp mode) I think your fine with your oil cooler. Switching to water and water wetter coolant for the track season it the only think I would say you might consider. The 2011s don't have the same pressurized coolant system as the 2012+ models. Not sure what pressure each version works at. Last edited by 2011 Nismo#91; 09-24-2015 at 10:18 AM.

09-24-2015, 12:46 PM	#14 (permalink)
abm89 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Austin, Texas Posts: 1,386 Drives: 11 370Z \| 24 EL450 Rep Power: 64763	How humid was it during the day? That will really kill your cooling performance. I plan on rigging a water spray system to my kit. __________________ Complete Parts List: https://github.com/abm89/ztouge-build