Karting 101

scottIN · 02-01-2012, 07:39 AM

Since I've had a few members contact me about karting & since a Z is pretty damn close to a kart compared to most cars, thought I'd do a little write up on it. I'll focus on sprint racing since that's what I do, but there is also dirt oval, oval and road race (long course).

Sprint karting is divided up into classes - usually by engine type (100 cc, 125 cc, shifter, etc.). Some engines have their own class (for example, Yamaha). The chassis are pretty much open, with most of them coming from Italy. Classes are further divided by age, with the youngest being kid karts (5-7 year olds) then juniors, seniors and masters. I race in the masters class (not a skill designation - just 35+). I actually didn't start racing until I was 35 (6 years ago).

First, let me say that these aren't toys - they're real racing machines. Being where I am just outside of Indy, I get the chance to race against IndyCar drivers like Ed Carpenter, Jay Howard, Tomas Scheckter, Scott Dixon and the late Dan Wheldon. These guys race karts on their off weekends. If you've ever gone to a kart rental place, most of those are 5 hp karts. The one I run is 26 hp. There's a difference...

And speaking of the type of kart, the class I run is TaG (which stands for Touch and Go). It's a 125 cc, water cooled single speed with an on-board starter. It's the second fastest class behind shifters (40+ hp and 5 gears). Here's a pic.

One of the first questions everyone asks is cost. You can get started with a used TaG kart for around $3,000 or so for something fairly current. If you want new, top of the line equipment, plan on spending north of $10,000. Then you've got fuel, tires, safety gear, etc. I know guys running karts that, with travel, are spending upwards of $100,000 / yr. And no matter how good you are, sponsorships are next to impossible to come by-maybe some free parts here & there or buying things at dealer cost, but you'll never make a living karting.

One of the biggest shocks for me was the working on them part. I figure it's about 3 hours work for every 1 hour of track time. You're pushing these things to the edge and crap breaks all the time. You have to love to wrench (or hire someone that does). It's not a 'get in and drive' type of deal. Here's a couple of photos of my garage at the track (our track has rental garages for the season) and my off-season shop where I an tear everything down over the winter. You'll notice two karts - one of them is my wife's.

I'll do a part two at some point covering things like the people, the exhilaration, safety and some other things, but if you have any questions, ask away...

GaleForce · 02-01-2012, 08:50 AM

This is a good thread. I considered getting into it myself, but I realized I'm too big to be competitive! I came to this conclusion from watching my buddy race his motorbikes in Vintage "senior class". So I'll wait until my son is at an age where he might want to do something like this, and I'll be the mechanic...

Love your garage...

Red__Zed · 02-01-2012, 08:55 AM

ChrisSlicks · 02-01-2012, 09:45 AM

Great info! I've always had an interest in karts, it's an exciting motorsport. Nothing quite like driving with your *** an inch of the asphalt at 70 mph! Haven't done it competitively though.

Do you just race at the one local track? How many configurations do they have for sprint races?

Bonzo · 02-01-2012, 09:54 AM

Thanks for the informative post Scott. Man would this be an awesome sport to get into. Those racing karts are incredible! I wish I had the time, the place, and more importantly, the money. And you're wife is into it too, which is a huge bonus. Sounds like you've got yourself a lucky set of circumstances all aligned. Very cool for you.

For those less able to do racing full out and living in the Cincinnati area, in case you haven't heard, we have a new fast kart rental place in town. It's called Full Throttle Indoor Karting and is located by the Tri-County mall off of I-275. From everyone I've talked to about comparisons, this place blows away the rental place in Richmond Indiana. From my own experience this track is really designed well for it's size (although I'm certainly no expert), and let me tell you, it's a total F-ing blast!!!! This is not the light hearted kart racing you might remember as a kid, it's balls to the wall jamming. You better be in shape and ready to rock. And I'd bring some good driving gloves if I were you.

Here is a link to their website.....
Indoor Go-Karting in Cincinnati, Ohio - Full Throttle Indoor Karting

These are by no means on the same level that Scott drives, but these are still very nice karts. They are not toys, they are true racing machines. They are Sodi RX-7 carts with Honda GX 270cc engines. They go about 40 mph and go from 0-40 in like, "right now." They are basically geared to sh*t 'n' git around this tight track. Geared higher and they would go much faster top end, but for this short track they rock. They are very adjustable so take advantage of that. I learned the hard way on my second go that not having everything adjusted properly makes a huge difference in performance.

I've attached a picture of the Sodi RX-7 below.

Here is a link to read more about the karts themselves....
RX 7 - Sodikart

If you live in Southwest Ohio, Northern Kentucky, or South East Indiana, I strongly recommend trying this place out. If you live farther away, then I'd make plans to come visit Cincinnati for a weekend. I guarantee you will have a blast.

Thanks again Scott, and I think we are all looking forward to part 2 of your post.

Cheers --- Bonzo

erkthejerk73 · 02-01-2012, 09:56 AM

how much of your time is invested in a karting event on the weekend, do you only race in the Indy area or travel quite a bit?

erkthejerk73 · 02-01-2012, 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bonzo

Thanks for the informative post Scott. Man would this be an awesome sport to get into. Those racing karts are incredible! I wish I had the time, the place, and more importantly, the money. And you're wife is into it too, which is a huge bonus. Sounds like you've got yourself a lucky set of circumstances all aligned. Very cool for you.

For those less able to do racing full out and living in the Cincinnati area, in case you haven't heard, we have a new fast kart rental place in town. It's called Full Throttle Indoor Karting and is located by the Tri-County mall off of I-275. From everyone I've talked to about comparisons, this place blows away the rental place in Richmond Indiana. From my own experience this track is really designed well for it's size (although I'm certainly no expert), and let me tell you, it's a total F-ing blast!!!! This is not the light hearted kart racing you might remember as a kid, it's balls to the wall jamming. You better be in shape and ready to rock. And I'd bring some good driving gloves if I were you.

Here is a link to their website.....
Indoor Go-Karting in Cincinnati, Ohio - Full Throttle Indoor Karting

These are by no means on the same level that Scott drives, but these are still very nice karts. They are not toys, they are true racing machines. They are Sodi RX-7 carts with Honda GX 270cc engines. They go about 40 mph and go from 0-40 in like, "right now." They are basically geared to sh*t 'n' git around this tight track. Geared higher and they would go much faster top end, but for this short track they rock. They are very adjustable so take advantage of that. I learned the hard way on my second go that not having everything adjusted properly makes a huge difference in performance.

I've attached a picture of the Sodi RX-7 below.

Here is a link to read more about the karts themselves....
RX 7 - Sodikart

If you live in Southwest Ohio, Northern Kentucky, or South East Indiana, I strongly recommend trying this place out. If you live farther away, then I'd make plans to come visit Cincinnati for a weekend. I guarantee you will have a blast.

Thanks again Scott, and I think we are all looking forward to part 2 of your post.

Cheers --- Bonzo

been there before, ran some good laps.

scottIN · 02-01-2012, 10:35 AM

Let's see...

I just race here locally. I'm fortunate to have one of the top tracks in the country about 5 minutes from my house. It's New Castle Motorsports Park, owned by former Indy Car driver (and Daytona 24 Hour winner) Mark Dismore. We run a 15 race club season so it's close to every weekend, plus there are a few special races I might enter throughout the year. Being one of the top tracks, it hosts a number of national and international events as well.

Time commitment is whatever you want to make it really. Some guys just show up on Saturday & race, some practice 3 or 4 times a week, some guys don't race-just enjoy driving them. I know one karting dad (he's also an announcer for ABC) that is there pretty much every day working on his son's karts. But he's looking to go pro - it's more than a hobby for him. Race day usually starts early, and is pretty much a full day. Crazy thing is, you've got two 7 minute practice sessions, a 7 minute qualifier and then the race, which takes about 12 minutes. That's really about all the driving most people can take. It's extremely physical. You gain a new respect for race car drivers after driving a kart.

Everyone always asks: How fast do you go? Well, top speed down the straight is about 75 mph in my class. But that's not what gets you. It's a 1.1 mile, 16 turn track (most common layout) and average speed is 62 mph. So your average turn speed is somewhere around 50 mph. The two hairpins, you go thorugh at 35. Here's a little video (i'm in the silver kart / helmet) from a couple years ago. Watch about 1:20 in. That's about a 68 mph turn, and I never got on the brakes - I really thought I was going to clear him. I don't even remember the wreck-it was that hard of a hit. They brought my kart back to my garage and I was like 'WTF happened to it?'

KRA #14 Spec TAG Masters wreck - YouTube

The guy running with the flag? That's Mark Dismore.

Bonzo · 02-01-2012, 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottIN

Let's see...

I just race here locally. I'm fortunate to have one of the top tracks in the country about 5 minutes from my house. It's New Castle Motorsports Park, owned by former Indy Car driver (and Daytona 24 Hour winner) Mark Dismore. We run a 15 race club season so it's close to every weekend, plus there are a few special races I might enter throughout the year. Being one of the top tracks, it hosts a number of national and international events as well.

Time commitment is whatever you want to make it really. Some guys just show up on Saturday & race, some practice 3 or 4 times a week, some guys don't race-just enjoy driving them. I know one karting dad (he's also an announcer for ABC) that is there pretty much every day working on his son's karts. But he's looking to go pro - it's more than a hobby for him. Race day usually starts early, and is pretty much a full day. Crazy thing is, you've got two 7 minute practice sessions, a 7 minute qualifier and then the race, which takes about 12 minutes. That's really about all the driving most people can take. It's extremely physical. You gain a new respect for race car drivers after driving a kart.

Everyone always asks: How fast do you go? Well, top speed down the straight is about 75 mph in my class. But that's not what gets you. It's a 1.1 mile, 16 turn track (most common layout) and average speed is 62 mph. So your average turn speed is somewhere around 50 mph. The two hairpins, you go thorugh at 35. Here's a little video (i'm in the silver kart / helmet) from a couple years ago. Watch about 1:20 in. That's about a 68 mph turn, and I never got on the brakes - I really thought I was going to clear him. I don't even remember the wreck-it was that hard of a hit. They brought my kart back to my garage and I was like 'WTF happened to it?'

KRA #14 Spec TAG Masters wreck - YouTube

The guy running with the flag? That's Mark Dismore.

OUCH!!!!!!

TreeSemdyZee · 02-01-2012, 12:28 PM

Awesome thread. You'll have to post a schedule of your races. I'd love to bop up one weekend to watch and take pics. One of my college roommates is from New Castle.

scottIN · 02-02-2012, 09:12 AM

I thought it might be fun to have a meet there this spring summer for the Indiana (guess we could let Ohio & Ky in) guys. The rental karts they have are pretty nice. They're actual racing chassis with a 5 hp Honda. They'll run about 50 mph down the straight. And anyone who wanted to - after proving their proficiency in a rental kart - is welcome to jump in my kart. I had one friend - who considered himself a good driver - try to go straight to driving my kart. After about 2 laps of not being able to keep it on the track, he pulled in and we put him in a rental for 10 minutes. After that, he was fine in a real kart. As someone once said 'Trying to learn to drive a kart in a TaG is like taking driver's training in an IndyCar.'

One interesting thing about karts that most people don't know is that to turn them, you have to be on 3 wheels. Because it's a live axle set up, you have to lift the inside rear going through a turn to keep from scrubbing your tires. The chassis has a lot of flex and the front geometry a lot of Ackerman so it twists when you turn.

One day I asked Dismore about speed perception in a kart vs. an Indycar: He said that a kart at 75 mph feels about like an IndyCar at 220. Things happen so fast it's incredible. You're so close to the ground everything feels sped up.

The whole speed thing is cool, but the best part of karting are the people. Everyone is so nice and helpful - which you need when you first start out. And if you're an ***, you won't be around next year becasue nobody will help you. It's a pretty cool system becasue it keeps all the problem people away. And it's not unusual to have your competitors help you between races if you've got a problem. Sometimes you just don't have time to do it all yourself and the guys in your class are always the first to offer a hand. It definitely attracts a certain type of person (and drives away others).

Here's a few more pics...

Me & Milka Duno - I crewed for her at a race a couple years ago.

This is the start of a big endurance race held here every year. #4 in the middle is Dan Wheldon and there are about a dozen other IndyCar & Nascar drivers in the field.

My kart after the wreck

The wife & I and Eddie Cheever on a race day. Few years ago, I had Tomas Scheckter in the garage to my right, and Eddie Cheever in the garage to my left. Kind of funny since Tomas used to drive for Eddie.

m4a1mustang · 02-02-2012, 10:36 AM

Stumbled across this on Facebook today.

Pit crew? I don't need no stinkin' pit crew!

shaun66 · 02-02-2012, 11:07 PM

I race karts too! First race of the season this Saturday can't wait. I'm in S4 senior shifter.

gomer_110 · 02-02-2012, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottIN

I thought it might be fun to have a meet there this spring summer for the Indiana (guess we could let Ohio & Ky in) guys. The rental karts they have are pretty nice. They're actual racing chassis with a 5 hp Honda. They'll run about 50 mph down the straight. And anyone who wanted to - after proving their proficiency in a rental kart - is welcome to jump in my kart. I had one friend - who considered himself a good driver - try to go straight to driving my kart. After about 2 laps of not being able to keep it on the track, he pulled in and we put him in a rental for 10 minutes. After that, he was fine in a real kart. As someone once said 'Trying to learn to drive a kart in a TaG is like taking driver's training in an IndyCar.'

Sounds like fun. I'd definitely be interested just wondering what kind of $$$ were talking about here.

ChrisSlicks · 02-03-2012, 07:22 AM

Great pics Scott. How long do those sticky tires last before you have to swap them out?

02-01-2012, 07:39 AM	#1 (permalink)
scottIN Track Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: New Castle, Indiana Posts: 764 Drives: '12 370Z Rep Power: 55	Karting 101 Since I've had a few members contact me about karting & since a Z is pretty damn close to a kart compared to most cars, thought I'd do a little write up on it. I'll focus on sprint racing since that's what I do, but there is also dirt oval, oval and road race (long course). Sprint karting is divided up into classes - usually by engine type (100 cc, 125 cc, shifter, etc.). Some engines have their own class (for example, Yamaha). The chassis are pretty much open, with most of them coming from Italy. Classes are further divided by age, with the youngest being kid karts (5-7 year olds) then juniors, seniors and masters. I race in the masters class (not a skill designation - just 35+). I actually didn't start racing until I was 35 (6 years ago). First, let me say that these aren't toys - they're real racing machines. Being where I am just outside of Indy, I get the chance to race against IndyCar drivers like Ed Carpenter, Jay Howard, Tomas Scheckter, Scott Dixon and the late Dan Wheldon. These guys race karts on their off weekends. If you've ever gone to a kart rental place, most of those are 5 hp karts. The one I run is 26 hp. There's a difference... And speaking of the type of kart, the class I run is TaG (which stands for Touch and Go). It's a 125 cc, water cooled single speed with an on-board starter. It's the second fastest class behind shifters (40+ hp and 5 gears). Here's a pic. One of the first questions everyone asks is cost. You can get started with a used TaG kart for around $3,000 or so for something fairly current. If you want new, top of the line equipment, plan on spending north of $10,000. Then you've got fuel, tires, safety gear, etc. I know guys running karts that, with travel, are spending upwards of $100,000 / yr. And no matter how good you are, sponsorships are next to impossible to come by-maybe some free parts here & there or buying things at dealer cost, but you'll never make a living karting. One of the biggest shocks for me was the working on them part. I figure it's about 3 hours work for every 1 hour of track time. You're pushing these things to the edge and crap breaks all the time. You have to love to wrench (or hire someone that does). It's not a 'get in and drive' type of deal. Here's a couple of photos of my garage at the track (our track has rental garages for the season) and my off-season shop where I an tear everything down over the winter. You'll notice two karts - one of them is my wife's. I'll do a part two at some point covering things like the people, the exhilaration, safety and some other things, but if you have any questions, ask away...

02-01-2012, 08:50 AM	#2 (permalink)
GaleForce A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 21,749 Drives: Varis Arising II Rep Power: 51865	This is a good thread. I considered getting into it myself, but I realized I'm too big to be competitive! I came to this conclusion from watching my buddy race his motorbikes in Vintage "senior class". So I'll wait until my son is at an age where he might want to do something like this, and I'll be the mechanic... Love your garage... __________________ >>>GaleForce's Build<<< >>>FaceBook @3GsCustoms<<<>>>Instagram @GaleForce370z<<< Varis Kamikaze-Z

02-01-2012, 09:45 AM	#4 (permalink)
ChrisSlicks A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: North East Posts: 6,203 Drives: 09 370Z Sport M6 Rep Power: 653	Great info! I've always had an interest in karts, it's an exciting motorsport. Nothing quite like driving with your *** an inch of the asphalt at 70 mph! Haven't done it competitively though. Do you just race at the one local track? How many configurations do they have for sprint races? __________________ Hotchkis ARB \| Stillen CAI \| Art Pipes \| Berk CBE \| Stillen AP Racing Brakes \| AE Performance Oil Cooler \| BC Racing ER Coilovers \| Doran Control Arms

02-01-2012, 10:35 AM	#8 (permalink)
scottIN Track Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: New Castle, Indiana Posts: 764 Drives: '12 370Z Rep Power: 55	Let's see... I just race here locally. I'm fortunate to have one of the top tracks in the country about 5 minutes from my house. It's New Castle Motorsports Park, owned by former Indy Car driver (and Daytona 24 Hour winner) Mark Dismore. We run a 15 race club season so it's close to every weekend, plus there are a few special races I might enter throughout the year. Being one of the top tracks, it hosts a number of national and international events as well. Time commitment is whatever you want to make it really. Some guys just show up on Saturday & race, some practice 3 or 4 times a week, some guys don't race-just enjoy driving them. I know one karting dad (he's also an announcer for ABC) that is there pretty much every day working on his son's karts. But he's looking to go pro - it's more than a hobby for him. Race day usually starts early, and is pretty much a full day. Crazy thing is, you've got two 7 minute practice sessions, a 7 minute qualifier and then the race, which takes about 12 minutes. That's really about all the driving most people can take. It's extremely physical. You gain a new respect for race car drivers after driving a kart. Everyone always asks: How fast do you go? Well, top speed down the straight is about 75 mph in my class. But that's not what gets you. It's a 1.1 mile, 16 turn track (most common layout) and average speed is 62 mph. So your average turn speed is somewhere around 50 mph. The two hairpins, you go thorugh at 35. Here's a little video (i'm in the silver kart / helmet) from a couple years ago. Watch about 1:20 in. That's about a 68 mph turn, and I never got on the brakes - I really thought I was going to clear him. I don't even remember the wreck-it was that hard of a hit. They brought my kart back to my garage and I was like 'WTF happened to it?' KRA #14 Spec TAG Masters wreck - YouTube The guy running with the flag? That's Mark Dismore. Last edited by scottIN; 02-01-2012 at 10:39 AM.

02-02-2012, 10:36 AM	#12 (permalink)
m4a1mustang A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Northern VA Posts: 55,385 Drives: on two wheels Rep Power: 6962	Stumbled across this on Facebook today. Pit crew? I don't need no stinkin' pit crew! __________________ - Steve Zs & Coffee - Saturdays at 10AM in Fairfax, VA and Columbia, MD (Click the banner!) LIKE us on Facebook!

02-01-2012, 08:55 AM	#3 (permalink)
Red__Zed A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: window seat Posts: 28,940 Drives: Mostly on two wheels Rep Power: 120

02-01-2012, 09:56 AM	#6 (permalink)
erkthejerk73 Track Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: cincinnati Posts: 927 Drives: 13 F150 FX4 eb Rep Power: 15	how much of your time is invested in a karting event on the weekend, do you only race in the Indy area or travel quite a bit?

02-01-2012, 12:28 PM	#10 (permalink)
TreeSemdyZee Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Kentuck-IANA Age: 60 Posts: 4,885 Drives: '09 370 & ‘14 Juke Rep Power: 27408	Awesome thread. You'll have to post a schedule of your races. I'd love to bop up one weekend to watch and take pics. One of my college roommates is from New Castle.

02-02-2012, 09:12 AM	#11 (permalink)
scottIN Track Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: New Castle, Indiana Posts: 764 Drives: '12 370Z Rep Power: 55	I thought it might be fun to have a meet there this spring summer for the Indiana (guess we could let Ohio & Ky in) guys. The rental karts they have are pretty nice. They're actual racing chassis with a 5 hp Honda. They'll run about 50 mph down the straight. And anyone who wanted to - after proving their proficiency in a rental kart - is welcome to jump in my kart. I had one friend - who considered himself a good driver - try to go straight to driving my kart. After about 2 laps of not being able to keep it on the track, he pulled in and we put him in a rental for 10 minutes. After that, he was fine in a real kart. As someone once said 'Trying to learn to drive a kart in a TaG is like taking driver's training in an IndyCar.' One interesting thing about karts that most people don't know is that to turn them, you have to be on 3 wheels. Because it's a live axle set up, you have to lift the inside rear going through a turn to keep from scrubbing your tires. The chassis has a lot of flex and the front geometry a lot of Ackerman so it twists when you turn. One day I asked Dismore about speed perception in a kart vs. an Indycar: He said that a kart at 75 mph feels about like an IndyCar at 220. Things happen so fast it's incredible. You're so close to the ground everything feels sped up. The whole speed thing is cool, but the best part of karting are the people. Everyone is so nice and helpful - which you need when you first start out. And if you're an ***, you won't be around next year becasue nobody will help you. It's a pretty cool system becasue it keeps all the problem people away. And it's not unusual to have your competitors help you between races if you've got a problem. Sometimes you just don't have time to do it all yourself and the guys in your class are always the first to offer a hand. It definitely attracts a certain type of person (and drives away others). Here's a few more pics... Me & Milka Duno - I crewed for her at a race a couple years ago. This is the start of a big endurance race held here every year. #4 in the middle is Dan Wheldon and there are about a dozen other IndyCar & Nascar drivers in the field. My kart after the wreck The wife & I and Eddie Cheever on a race day. Few years ago, I had Tomas Scheckter in the garage to my right, and Eddie Cheever in the garage to my left. Kind of funny since Tomas used to drive for Eddie.

02-02-2012, 11:07 PM	#13 (permalink)
shaun66 Track Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: n Posts: 837 Drives: MB 370z 7AT Rep Power: 16	I race karts too! First race of the season this Saturday can't wait. I'm in S4 senior shifter.

02-03-2012, 07:22 AM	#15 (permalink)
ChrisSlicks A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: North East Posts: 6,203 Drives: 09 370Z Sport M6 Rep Power: 653	Great pics Scott. How long do those sticky tires last before you have to swap them out? __________________ Hotchkis ARB \| Stillen CAI \| Art Pipes \| Berk CBE \| Stillen AP Racing Brakes \| AE Performance Oil Cooler \| BC Racing ER Coilovers \| Doran Control Arms

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