2021 Formula 1 Thread

[ZCanadian]

And yet, starting for Silverstone, Pirelli changed the construction of the 2021 tires yet again, this time particularly in response to the failures.
Dumb article about it here:
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/t...tyres/6613964/

And the change has been a big part of Mercedes' return to dominance as the tires seem to work better with their chassis than with the Red Bull.

I hate that the last 3 years of F1 have been mainly a competition as to who can get and keep the tires in their operating window the best, for the longest. That's always a part of racing, but it shouldn't be THE determining factor in almost every race for several seasons.

[Hotrodz]

I think it is one more thing to talk about. RB couldn't make an adjustment in three years that's on them no different than MB and others had to deal with the changes with chassis design this year. I do think there is too much drama around tires. Make the safest tire possible and be done. The teams are going to make complain regardless if they are not fast or the tire fails.

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[DLSTR]

Originally Posted by Hotrodz

I think it is one more thing to talk about. RB couldn't make an adjustment in three years that's on them no different than MB and others had to deal with the changes with chassis design this year. I do think there is too much drama around tires. Make the safest tire possible and be done. The teams are going to make complain regardless if they are not fast or the tire fails.

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This^^^^

Pirelli make the tires per the F1 contract. Use them, adapt and make your chassis work. That is a team problem. Just dont tell them that LOL! RB perhaps the whining-ist of all. They forget what its like to win and be a target. Grow up, shut up and compete. Thats for all teams.

[ZCanadian]

Originally Posted by DLSTR

This^^^^

Pirelli make the tires per the F1 contract. Use them, adapt and make your chassis work. That is a team problem. Just dont tell them that LOL! RB perhaps the whining-ist of all. They forget what its like to win and be a target. Grow up, shut up and compete. Thats for all teams.

But Red Bull did make the chassis work for the first half of this year. That, and whatever power improvements they may have made, paid off for 10 races. Mercedes wasn't the powerhouse that they were in the last two seasons. But for whatever reason (blame the Baku punctures), Pirelli has changed the design and it favours MB again. Not implying that this was intentional, but that is one change that I don't believe can be computer or wind tunnel modelled. And teams are trying to race and develop a whole new car under a cost cap this year.

Saying "make your chassis work" is oversimplifying things. Otherwise, all of the other teams would have been there already last year, with no cost cap to contend with. But nobody other than Mercedes really managed to in over 40 races until this year. IMHO.

[DLSTR]

Originally Posted by ZCanadian

But Red Bull did make the chassis work for the first half of this year. That, and whatever power improvements they may have made, paid off for 10 races. Mercedes wasn't the powerhouse that they were in the last two seasons. But for whatever reason (blame the Baku punctures), Pirelli has changed the design and it favours MB again. Not implying that this was intentional, but that is one change that I don't believe can be computer or wind tunnel modelled. And teams are trying to race and develop a whole new car under a cost cap this year.

Saying "make your chassis work" is oversimplifying things. Otherwise, all of the other teams would have been there already last year, with no cost cap to contend with. But nobody other than Mercedes really managed to in over 40 races until this year. IMHO.

The aero rules worked against low rake design. The cost cap and tire issue/redesign were pushed and agree'd by the teams. Yet they will bad mouth all of it lol. It is tiresome. Shut up and compete. Want to win develop now. They know what that means for 22.

I see Mercedes pushing and hoping RedBull throw lots of money to get this 1 title they promised Jos and Max. Its a game. Mercedes are long on the development and have no more updates in development per press yesterday. The real game is who does best next year early on.

For me this title is compromised given new rules next year. Sure Max can win it but its easily spun that real competition was ended due to rules change lol.

[ZCanadian]

Originally Posted by DLSTR

The aero rules worked against low rake design. The cost cap and tire issue/redesign were pushed and agree'd by the teams. Yet they will bad mouth all of it lol. It is tiresome. Shut up and compete. Want to win develop now. They know what that means for 22.

I see Mercedes pushing and hoping RedBull throw lots of money to get this 1 title they promised Jos and Max. Its a game. Mercedes are long on the development and have no more updates in development per press yesterday. The real game is who does best next year early on.

For me this title is compromised given new rules next year. Sure Max can win it but its easily spun that real competition was ended due to rules change lol.

2019/2020 tires seemed to work against high rake designs like RBR and Ferrari, though.

[Hotrodz]

Originally Posted by ZCanadian

2019/2020 tires seemed to work against high rake designs like RBR and Ferrari, though.

RB has been chasing ever since the days Vettel. They won four championships and MB was chasing. MB developed a better car along with signing Lewis. RB has been slow to catch up. RB put all their eggs in the Max bucket which caused a riff between the up comer and a proven F1 winner. They lost again when Daniel left. RB problems started a long time ago. The discussion over tires is just a distraction and points out the lack of development and strategy to stay at the tip of the spear by RB. They also made a decision right or wrong to change engine manufacturers which cost them time and money.

I don't believe F1 and the FIA is purposely favoring one team over another otherwise we should all watch WWE (World Wrestling Entertainment).

This is their best chance to stop MB string of championships and for Max to win his first title. They have the superior car and the second best driver in the world and they are still whining about MB. To me it just shows how far behind the 8 ball they are.



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[DLSTR]

Originally Posted by Hotrodz

RB has been chasing ever since the days Vettel. They won four championships and MB was chasing. MB developed a better car along with signing Lewis. RB has been slow to catch up. RB put all their eggs in the Max bucket which caused a riff between the up comer and a proven F1 winner. They lost again when Daniel left. RB problems started a long time ago. The discussion over tires is just a distraction and points out the lack of development and strategy to stay at the tip of the spear by RB. They also made a decision right or wrong to change engine manufacturers which cost them time and money.

I don't believe F1 and the FIA is purposely favoring one team over another otherwise we should all watch WWE (World Wrestling Entertainment).

This is their best chance to stop MB string of championships and for Max to win his first title. They have the superior car and the second best driver in the world and they are still whining about MB. To me it just shows how far behind the 8 ball they are.



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They seem so unfocused in the past years. Make no friends and crap on Renault. They lack any tact or grace. Im happy we have competition but RedBull management are toxic. Max is just as bad being raised by a tool such as Jos. If he wins thats nice.

I think he will have very difficult times to match anyone like MS or LH. He lacks an appeal and any character. Rather boring to be honest he is to me. He is predictable on the track, weaves, uses the full limit but lacks a creative flow overall. He literally will risk the entire car and team's effort in one circumstance vs the larger picture. His lack of tact and the inability to UN-FOCUS on the now hurts him in my book.

His father's influence over him and the team is obvious. Enabled easily by Horner and the idiot Marko. Their efforts after UK GP were world class idiocy. As if no other had ever hit them ever lol. Ricci left for good reason. He has been very public about that BS there after his Baku mess Max caused. The team failed to move Max over and Ricci warned them it would end badly. Yea Max is just amazing.

Frankly - over rated in certain categories - like big picture thinking, maximizing results in the face of issues and maybe talking less and driving more.

[Hotrodz]

Originally Posted by DLSTR

They seem so unfocused in the past years. Make no friends and crap on Renault. They lack any tact or grace. Im happy we have competition but RedBull management are toxic. Max is just as bad being raised by a tool such as Jos. If he wins thats nice.



I think he will have very difficult times to match anyone like MS or LH. He lacks an appeal and any character. Rather boring to be honest he is to me. He is predictable on the track, weaves, uses the full limit but lacks a creative flow overall. He literally will risk the entire car and team's effort in one circumstance vs the larger picture. His lack of tact and the ability to UN-FOCUS on the now hurts him in my book.



His father's influence over him and the team is obvious. Enabled easily by Horner and the idiot Marko. Their efforts after UK GP were world class idiocy. As if no other had ever hit them ever lol. Ricci left for good reason. He has been very public about that BS there after his Baku mess Max caused. The team failed to move Max over and Ricci warned them it would end badly. Yea Max is just amazing.



Frankly - over rated in certain categories - like big picture thinking, maximizing results in the face of issues and maybe talking less and driving more.

I couldn't agree more!

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[DLSTR]

Japanese F1 GP cancelled due to rising COVID cases
By:
Adam Cooper
Aug 18, 2021, 4:00 AM
Formula 1 has announced that the Japanese Grand Prix has been cancelled at the request of the government due to ongoing COVID-19 issues.
Japanese F1 GP cancelled due to rising COVID cases

The race was due to take place on 10 October, as the third leg of a triple header after Russia and Turkey.

A decision on whether or not the race would go ahead was expected in August after all parties were able to review how the Olympic Games unfolded in Tokyo.

No further updates have been given on possible changes to the 2021 F1 calendar, which is understood to be very flexible at this stage, with various permutations under consideration.

However, F1 has options to keep up the numbers and will provide further news in the coming weeks.

An F1 statement said: “Following ongoing discussions with the promoter and authorities in Japan the decision has been taken by the Japanese government to cancel the race this season due to ongoing complexities of the pandemic in the country.

“Formula 1 is now working on the details of the revised calendar and will announce the final details in the coming weeks. Formula 1 has proven this year, and in 2020, that we can adapt and find solutions to the ongoing uncertainties and is excited by the level of interest from locations to host Formula 1 events this year and beyond.”

Honda also issued a statement expressing its disappointment that the Japanese Grand Prix would not feature in its final season with Red Bull before departing ahead of the 2022 season.

"As Honda, we are particularly disappointed, because this is the final year of our Formula 1 project and we know that so many fans were looking forward to attending the event.

Qatar is one of the new events on standby, while a second race in Bahrain is also a possibility, and if they join Saudi Arabia and Abu Dhabi that would mean four events being run in the Middle East in the last part of season.

One of the big issues is that Turkey, Mexico and Brazil are all currently on the UK red list, and anyone returning within 10 days of being in one of those countries faces a 10-day quarantine in a government-approved hotel.

At the moment F1 does not have an exemption, and thus around 1000 UK-based team, F1, FIA, Pirelli, Honda and media staff members would be impacted by the rule.

The plan was the trip to Japan would take up a week of the 10-day window after Turkey, and that personnel would remain there for a few extra days before returning to the UK.

It’s understood it should not be assumed that Turkey is now in trouble without the buffer of the Japanese GP, so presumably efforts are underway either to re-jig the calendar so that another race falls after Turkey.

F1 hopes to run two races in Austin, with the second under the Texas GP name.

Although the USA is not a red zone for the UK matters have been complicated the city becoming a COVID hot spot, with hospitals reported to be full.

The Suzuka cancellation comes despite F1 promising to impose special conditions on all personnel travelling to Japan, including compulsory use of charter flights from Istanbul with testing on arrival, travel only between hotels and the circuits with no restaurants or shopping, security in each hotel to ensure that people could not leave, and eating only at the circuit in the evenings.

[ZCanadian]

Originally Posted by DLSTR

They seem so unfocused in the past years. Make no friends and crap on Renault. They lack any tact or grace. Im happy we have competition but RedBull management are toxic. Max is just as bad being raised by a tool such as Jos. If he wins thats nice.

I think he will have very difficult times to match anyone like MS or LH. He lacks an appeal and any character. Rather boring to be honest he is to me. He is predictable on the track, weaves, uses the full limit but lacks a creative flow overall. He literally will risk the entire car and team's effort in one circumstance vs the larger picture. His lack of tact and the inability to UN-FOCUS on the now hurts him in my book.

His father's influence over him and the team is obvious. Enabled easily by Horner and the idiot Marko. Their efforts after UK GP were world class idiocy. As if no other had ever hit them ever lol. Ricci left for good reason. He has been very public about that BS there after his Baku mess Max caused. The team failed to move Max over and Ricci warned them it would end badly. Yea Max is just amazing.

Frankly - over rated in certain categories - like big picture thinking, maximizing results in the face of issues and maybe talking less and driving more.

Although I agree with the idea, and especially the colossal incompetence at Red Bull, keep in mind that Max is barely out of diapers really. What is he, 23? You and I were still making bad choices about what courses to take at university at that age. He's responsible for million dollar decisions at 300km/hr, and the face of a huge organization. I think that he has matured tremendously over the past three seasons both as a driver and as an adult. For sure, he is still being manipulated (and probably prevented from seeing "the big picture". I cannot really fault him much for the things he has said. Horner, is another story. And Marko, well, he's off on some other planet altogether.

[abm89]

I think i've mentioned it before, but i'm pretty indifferent to Max. I'd be a hypocrite criticizing his behavior when my favorite drivers where the same way at that age.

I have no respect for Horner and Marko. They've always been twats.

[DLSTR]

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/al...ting-/6650308/

Alpine calls on FIA "to be all over" rival F1 teams collaborating
By: Filip Cleeren
Co-author: Jonathan Noble
Aug 19, 2021, 9:31 AM
Alpine Formula 1 executive director Marcin Budkowski says his team expects the FIA "to be all over" rival teams collaborating on their 2022 car designs.

Last season Racing Point caused a stir when it arrived in winter testing in Barcelona with a car that looked a lot like the Mercedes from 2019, the team it bought a gearbox, power unit and other unlisted parts from.


Its midfield rivals were alarmed about the design of the RP20, with Alpine - then called Renault - leading the charge against the Silverstone outfit by filing protests after the Styrian, Hungarian and British Grands Prix, arguing Racing Point's rear brake ducts were illegally copied from Mercedes.

The protest was upheld, and Racing Point was docked 15 constructors' points and fined €400,000 after Silverstone. Renault initially appealed the decision before drawing a line under the matter.

In the wake of the Racing Point controversy, F1 tightened its rules on reverse engineering, banning the use of 3D cameras and complex software systems to copy rival designs.

But Alpine has called on the FIA to remain vigilant ahead of the massive 2022 regulation changes, which provide a lot of scope for teams to benefit from collaborating with their partner teams.

"Clearly going into 2022, a massive change in regulations, big development slope, lots of performance being gained on these cars, very green fresh set of regulations, the benefits you can get from collaboration, whether it's legal or less so, are massive," Budkowski said.

"And if there's a year where these kinds of collaborations can pay off, it's this year, for 2022.


"So clearly, if there's a year where we expect the FIA to be really all over it, it's this year."

When asked if he was concerned a repeat of the Racing Point saga was possible or if he believed the FIA was now policing the matter sufficiently, Budkowski said it was a "difficult question" but admitted there was some concern.

"I don't know what's going on in other people's factories, and I don't know what level of scrutiny the FIA is putting on this," he explained.

"Us as an independent team, obviously we don't come under scrutiny of sharing anything with our competitors, because it would be against our own interests.

"The Formula 1 I think we'd all like to see is 10 teams or 11, or 12, in the future, that just fight each other mercilessly and are just there for their own sporting success.

"And from the moment that teams have a common interest in exchanging information, that's a problem, because it shouldn't be the case, you shouldn't be helping your competitors.

"So, there's a concern there but I can't say how much, I'm not going to accuse people because effectively I don't know. And I hope that there is nothing happening."

[ZCanadian]

In other words: "We're Alpine. We have no friends who will share with us. So we'll raise a stink if other teams do. Not that we know it's happening but we're paranoid. Which doesn't mean it's not happening,".

It's not Mercedes' fault, or Ferrari's or Honda's, that Cyril lost all of Renault's customer teams. Of course there will be some technology trading. Well, "sales" actually. It won't be as blatant as Tracing Point, but it'll be there. Who honestly believes that Alpha Tauri won't benefit from developments at Red Bull. Or that in order to fit the mechanicals from Mercedes into their own cars, customer teams won't be let in on some of the magic that Merc has come up with.

The FIA needs to understand that their cost cap does not exist in a vacuum, and teams agreed to it based on their own understandings of what they could and could not get away with. Renault/Alpine have to get over themselves, and just develop a very good car for next year. They have done a decent job this far in 2021. Even the engines have been decently reliable for the first time in years.

[DLSTR]

Progress LOL

Ferrari gained less than 0.1 second from extra F1 windtunnel boost
By:
Pablo Elizalde
Co-author:
Jonathan Noble
Aug 20, 2021, 10:11 AM
Ferrari gained less than a tenth of a second from having extra time to develop its 2021 Formula 1 car in the windtunnel, according to team boss Mattia Binotto.