Subaru powered Toyota FT-86 Concept

FL 4Motion

I don't know if it's your intention or not, but you are coming off in this thread as so defenisve of the frs/brz that it's almost angry.

Bottom line is some folks will want more power out of a car and some will be happy with less.

I think the brz/frs is nice, but it would be perfect with 250hp imo. I feel it's a bit underpowered.

Before you slam me for making that assumption w/o having driven one. The wife and i have previously owned 2 miatas, a 99 and on 03 shinsen ed. Referring to the 03 shinsen, I will say it had the BEST clutch/shifter feel etc of ANY car I've ever driven, the balance etc was spot on and it was a hoot to drive around even if I didn't fit in it for sh!t.

Now, having said that, after a while, you quickly realize that the miata could use another 60-100 horses. That was my takeaway from it. great car, but underpowered. Trying to merge in with traffic was an exercise in frustration.

The truth is, you can't drive even a miata as aggressively as you'd like to on the street b/c squealing tires around the corners in your neighborhood tends to be frowned upon. The only safe place to explore the limits of your car regardless of what it is is the track. And the miata is underpowered for anything more than autox and I suspect the BRZ/FRS will be too. That's not to say they won't be fun but for folks who have owned many different sports cars, I think it will be disapointing.

The 370Z is def not perfect, lord knows folks on here have seen me b1tch about it's many shortcomings, but the aftermarket has good solutions for almost all of them. Hell, a simple tire size adjustment (wider fronts) will help make the Z less prone to understeer and that is a very simple fix/improvement.

For a 3300lb car like the Z, 300-350 hp is a good starting place powerwise imo.

For a 2700-2800lb car like the brz, 250ish hp is a good spot powerwise imo.

To each his own, I think it's a nice car, but def not for me, too much $$ for too little power, regardless of the handling characteristics. Been there, done that, got the T shirt.

vo2max99

No, I'm simply pointing out how ridiculous to assume the BRZ / FR-S are somehow not worth it due to their straight line acceleration.

Again, if the BRZ / FR-S are indeed in the same ball park with the MX-5 as 99^ of the reviews have suggested it makes no sense to assume the cars won't be worth the price or be under-powered.

Also to assume more power would somehow make the BRZ / FR-S better is a fallacy unless your main thing is #'s. As is with 200hp the BRZ / FR-S will likely finish far above any car 40K and under and in the same ball park vs. the EVO X / MX-5 in terms of being fun to drive / handling dynamics.

So of this happens to be the case (likely IMO) how does it make any sense to suggest the car is somehow too under-powered / not worth it, etc? So a car costing ~25-28K is rated among the best drivers cars yet somehow it's not worth it? I don't follow the logic.

Why would the car need more than 200hp if by most accounts it doesn't and places among the very best in terms of being a fun to drive driver's car? Is it the #'s your worried about?

But again, I haven't driven the BRZ / FR-S but judging on 99% of the reviews thus far there's not much reason to believe the BRZ / FR-S won't be well worth the price.

If you're happy with your Z that's great nobody is forcing anybody to trade in. There's no need to take offense. I know people feel they need to defend their purchase but it's not the end of the World. There's always going to be better cars coming out.


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FL 4Motion

I have owned very similar cars to the brz, as I stated above, and I found them to be wanting, even in daily driving around town, for power. Based on my personal experience with two miatas, IF, the brz is similar to those cars, and I think we can all agree that is the case, then FOR ME, it is underpowered. It didn't say it wouldn't be fun to drive, have great dynamics etc but a good sports car needs both handling AND power. Most cars have some compromises with those two things. The Brz would seem ot ahve a big compromise with one (power).

I don't need to defend my Z purchase, anyone here who has seen my posts knows I have some serious bones to pick with nissan for some inane cost cutting BUT what I don't understand is your die hard obsession with defending the honor of a car you've never driven on a car forum that is dedicated to a different make?? I like the Z but I"m not on a brz/frs forum trying to convince them that the Z is the better car. I don't get that part of it.

flashburn

Is this car out now? I swear I drove past one going the opposite direction on the highway yesterday.

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Current Ride: 2012 Chevrolet Corvette Grand Sport Centennial Edition Carbon Flash 6M
Previous Ride: 2009 Nissan 370Z Sport Platinum Graphite 7AT

Pauly

it looks cool. too much $ for too little power for me personally. even if it took a hairpin at 100mph. yea, light and fun and whatever, all that jazz, but since we are guessing, and cant drive one, from what i see its not a satisfying balance at 200 hp. i see it selling well regardless. different folks will love it, and it looks sweet.

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Gun Metallic 2012 370 Z 7AT

Sibze

I think most people are upset about the power because straight line acceleration is fun and really, were normal people feel power the most. Out of 100 of these sold how many are really going to go on a track??? 1?

It's a great feeling being able to feel the power in the pedal

Spikuh

Easy killer, don't use logic here. Numbers are bad and you used twosome of them. I would suggest deleting them and let your feelings drive the argument instead because again, logic is a fallacy that we cannot abide.

NeoSHNIK

vo2max99, I just traded my Z for an used Smart. I test drove BRZ, Miata, and Smart... gotta say - Smart is the best of them all. I'm appologize, but your sorry *** Miata doesn't stand a chance against my Smart! What can you say to this, huh? And don't you even try to reason with me using logic or numbers, because it ain't gonna work here. Best car, evar made! Go buy one if you are Smart!

Vertigo

Shamu

Im waiting for Nissan Silvia replacement. Should be a more fun version of BRZ from all rumors floating around. Nissan will want to strike a blow to the BRZ so I would expect base car to be turbocharged. Watch Mazda as well they will likely one up Toyota as they usually do.

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Grant

Pauly

i would be happy to see honda answer to this thing. they need to do something. closest thing they have to a sports car is the accord coupe? fail

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Gun Metallic 2012 370 Z 7AT

DJ-of-E

But this Silvia replacement will not occur until there is accounted reasoning for sales based on the BRZ/FRS.

Basically, if BRZ/FRS is a flop, there will be no S16 or AP3.

Is that how you feel about your Subbie? I didn't like the interior because it felt cheap to me.

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phelan

the WRX interior is pretty cheap, i'll give you that. exterior wise, i'm perfectly fine with it though. it's a car that makes me happy lol

still wouldn't trade the WRX for any other car right now.

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凛 ('Rin') - 2009 Nissan 370Z
With silence comes peace. With peace comes freedom. With freedom comes silence.

Spikuh

The new Silvia has been rumored for what......50 years now...

I wouldn't put any stock in any of the rumors currently out there.

And as much as I want a new Silvia, I won't buy the hype and won't believe it until I test drive it at a Nissan lot.

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phelan

after all the anticipation for the frs/brz, after seeing one on the 91 freeway yesterday i no longer want one. looks weird and cheap to me. they had to scale back on the aggressive design features and body lines so much. there's still a few here and there from the concept, but it just looks like a mash of designs put together.

with that said, i bet it's a really fun car to drive, and it'll probably get a cult following like the miata has. but no thanks. i <3 my WRX

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凛 ('Rin') - 2009 Nissan 370Z
With silence comes peace. With peace comes freedom. With freedom comes silence.