Maintenance on the Boxster

UNKNOWN_370

If you're going to do the maintenence yourself? You just better have time and discipline for the porsche. Not so much that it's hard but it's a time consuming process that some may not want to do religiously?
But i see why labor is so high on these. Everything is a 5 step process.

shadoquad

Overpriced German car that is overcomplicated to work on, however infrequently. My opinion is that, and you really can't convince me otherwise with snarky insults. There are many better cars for less, although they don't outhandle it.

I don't mind performing simpler tasks more frequently rather than frustrating and overblown tasks every few years.

If it were just a filter that was this complicated, not so bad, but it's most everything, yeah?

Shamu

Define better? The Z has many short comings as a performance car that Porsche does not.

And again most of the simple maintenance items on Boxster really are not that tough. Just differnt to those who haven't owned a mid engine car. Guess you haven't had too much experience wrenching on many modern Japanese luxury cars lately. Again pulling a couple of easy pieces for long term maintenance items just isn't that tough. Oil changes are easy, you unscrew a couple pieces to get to air filters , big whoopee do? Tells us more about your level of mechanical ability than the car?

I have owned and serviced two boxsters myself and frankly found them far less frustrating than the Z. And the quality of the Porsche engineering and materials makes Boxster worth extra $25k. Heck you'd spend $25k fixing all the flaws on A Z and still not have a car that rides or handles better than a Boxster. I won't even start on all parts that have failed in first 12 miles of my track going Z.

From the brakes to the tranny and motor it's just a far better car than many on the road. Don't take my opinion most professional car journalists agree.

You just need to pay to play when you want to step up to a Porsche.

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Grant

shadoquad

Don't get me wrong, I would love a Porsche. I just wouldn't want to maintain one. I have turned wrenches on many vehicles: American, Japanese, German, Italian.

I have also worked on mid engined two seaters

RandyD

meh - aside from the debate on how hard it is...

the video going over all the stuff is a great idea.

zakimak

The scary thing is that the overly complication for basic maintenance and with $75 to $100/hr, these things adds up when you need to remove this button up that, etc. I can imagine service work beyond the basics that would make you cringe. I have a colleague who is a Porsche fan and has put a down payment on an NSX and have sold his 911S because it's past warranty.

"I sold recently b/c it was off warranty and started having expensive problems. I decided to unload it b4 I got mad at it. "

That said, if I would or more appropriately could, trade up right now; the Boxster would be my choice. In reality, the argument is really not about engineering but more of what each of us could afford in order to play. Yes it is complicated or maybe overly complicated but if one can afford it, one would. I have no doubt the Boxster is a better car than my ZR on many levels and I still lust after one on the occasion I see one. But right now, I do love my ZR. But.....I guess it is just rationalization on my part.

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shadoquad

Just for giggles, I test drove a Cayman S this weekend.

It's a better car than the Z, from a driving perspective, but not better enough for me to want to trade. It was an '07, which is roughly equal in price to what I bought new in '10. The car is fast, sexy, obviously more prestigious. If I had to choose between the two at initial purchase, I may have gone either way. The Cayman is certainly less comfortable. But as it is, there's no way to justify trading.

I have had zero issues with my Z, Shamu. Sorry bout your luck. I never said that I was incapable of removing the ECU, just that it's pretty stupid to have to do that in order to change an air filter.

And yeah, while Porsches may be wonderful, the price of maintenance is wacky. How dare I speak out against Stuttgart? I didn't say I hated them, only that maintaining them seems comically over-complicated and expensive. Let me know, Porsche fans, when you can accept that as a basic principle without resorting to insult. I don't expect you to agree with it, but I know I'm not alone in this opinion.

bigsix

I imagine what's most pleasurable about driving a Porsche Cayman is the great balance & handling from the design's mid-engine placement sending power to the rear wheels. I always think about this placement when i'm riding my bicycle. the light curb weight, too - - -

Shamu

Do yourself a favor. Go find an old 350z with say 150,000 miles on it and compare it to Porsche with same age and mileage.

Just start looking at quality of materials. Lets start with paint. Paint on Porsche is flawless and will last 20 plus years without chipping and fade we see on our Nissans. Interiors in Porsches age much better than Z's as well. I owned 2007 350z roadster for 6 years and I have to be honest it had more problems with trim, convertible top, interior than my 10 year old Porsche Boxster that I owned at same time. Porsche suspensions are typically made with high quality bilstein dampers that will last nearly a decade while we don't see similar quality with Nissans. Electronics in my 350z were problematic as well - window motors needed replacing at 5 year mark outside warranty (ouch!). Notchy shifter in 350z at 4 year mark, brakes gone at 35k with rotors that always seemed to warp? My first Boxster was at 60k and pads and rotors were still good!
.First clutch in 350z at 40k. Boxster had 101k on its clock before clutch was replaced. To me that sounds like 350z was nightmare to maintain compared to my older Boxster.

Nissan Z's still have very heavy construction and some design elements best reserved for 1980s. Heavy steel sub frame in rear is a joke, poorly insulated tunnel area is nice for sub freezing winter days but heats the car to unbearable temps in summer. Just feel that tunnel sometime on a warm day while your sitting in traffic. I found opposite of you with comfort. boxsters are far more comfortable and offer much more civil and refined ride. 370 and 350 feel like they borrowed suspension from and old ford when you hit bumps.

I m just tired of snarky uneducated Porsche bashing that I often see from likes of people who have very little experience with this marquee. I can light up on some of flaws of Porsche but difficult maintenance isn't one of them. In early Boxsters throw away motors were bigger issue. Porsche had failed attempt to make a motor they thought would be maintenance free. Oops. New motors are much much better.

I have also had luxury of pretty much dissembling a 370z and a Boxster and the way Porsches are put together just shows in every little detail. Z is closer to a Nissan Sentra economy car in many of its design elements while Boxster is much more a kin to its bigger brother the 911 a true high quality sports car.

People who get in trouble with Porsches are those who have no experience. Porsches need to be well maintained or they will kick your butt with high cost parts if you get a dealer to fix the car out of warranty but even there if you know aftermarket there are lots of high quality replacement parts. I can site example after example. I have seen people spend $25 k on same fix an experienced Porsche owner could spend $5k. I changed my own oil and filter for $30 bucks in 15 minutes while a sucker going to dealer might see $250 or even more!

Porsches aren't for everyone, but to say they are hard to maintain is sort of silly.

See problem you're going to have with me is that I have owned Porsches and Z's since the 1970s. I have owned 6 nissans/Datsuns and 5 porsches. I'm not biased to one brand like some. And I can talk same $hit with Porsche owners who unjustly bash Nissans.

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Grant

shadoquad

But I didn't bash the Porsche. I've said repeatedly that I like the cars, and they're fun. All I said is that they're more complicated to maintain, and that it's a little annoying. I don't plan to own a sports car at 150,000 miles regardless.

I never questioned the quality of the vehicle. Not once, not ever. I simply stated that they are costlier to repair/maintain and are more complicated.

Never said I wouldn't own one. This all started because I said I wouldn't want to maintain a Porsche and that my Porsche boner shrank from watching a needlessly complicated air filter replacement.

But to speak against the Mighty Porsche, even if it's a small criticism, is apparently too much to bear for Porsche fanboys.

zakimak

I don't think it is meant as a bash when I posted the video but wanted to illustrate the over complication of basic maintenance of the Boxster in comparison to pretty much everything else on the road. This complication usually result in additional cost.

Not everyone is as well versed in mechanical up keeping and will have to rely on the dealers to service them. I can guarantee that some kid at Mister lube will screw something up on a Boxster's air filter change but unlike to do so on virtually any other car. That being the case, no one would be comfortable bringing a Boxster there unless they are a masochist so there are up level costs involved. For example using you're $250 oil change for a Boxster at a Porsche dealer will be $100 at a Nissan's for a Z everything being equal with the exception of the time required due to additional complications.

We all know the Boxster IS a better car than the ZR in many ways. But is it a 1/3 to 1/2 better at the initial purchase? Most of us will probably say no. That said, is the Boxster 1 1/2 times better when it comes to an oil change? Most of us will definitely say no.

There are deficiencies in all cars. The Boxster with "throw away motors", the 350Z with window motors and camber issues, the 370Z with oil temp, fuel starvation, paint and brake cooling issues, the 458 with car burning to the ground issue . Spending $5000 in upkeep may be is justifiable on a Porsche but may not be so in a Z. Over engineering is not always real world better. Torx is better than traditional phillips head but not applicable for all situations.

All said, "Porsches aren't for everyone", neither is Ferraris aren't for everyone nor Austin Martins aren't for everyone, on and on. Unless we can comfortably afford the difference, the choice can be more difficult to bare and we have to justify it. Obviously the axiom, you have to pay to play applies. Real car guys knows that better than anyone.

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JARblue

It sounds a little like you are you comparing road-driven Porsches to a track-driven Z here...

For a car with much better engineering and materials, I don't see how you can't acknowledge that normally simple maintenance procedures seem excessively complex in this car. That is part of the engineering design, and more specifically, the part where it falls a little short imo. I don't remember anyone saying that because of this, the Porsche has inferior paint or interior or power or insert-any-random-component-here.

Favor? Comparing sports cars with 150K miles seems completely unrelated to this conversation except that you wanted to bring up how much better quality Porsche is. Don't get me wrong, I love Porsche and would love to own one, but the 370z gives me a great imitation within my budget. My guess is most people who can afford a new Porsche aren't even coming close to 150K miles before they get a new car. IIRC, the original conversation here was about the procedure to change the air filter...


Just my

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Ziggyman

I'm not a mechanic and I don't play one on TV, but... I was shopping Cayman and Boxsters used before i purchased the Z. They are absolutely wonderful to drive and can make very good DDs too.

I did some research and lurked on Cayman/Boxster forums a bit as well. They are not bullet proof,and with all respects to Ferdinand, have had some costly design issues that lingered through several model years like the IMS bearing issues.

Shop rates at the Porsche stores are in the $125-$180/hr range for labor, so for me it didn't make sense because the difference in performance is such that I'd need driving classes to realize it.

I'd never say it's not worth it to someone else, because only they can make that decision, and both are performance bargains in their own right.

cossie1600

I wouldn't mind a Porsche, I just don't want to pay for one.