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Originally Posted by 6MT Fair enough. But I've seen far too many Hyundai's go through our shop. And I've sold countless parts over the years for them, that my view

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Old 12-30-2012, 03:59 PM   #91 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by 6MT View Post
Fair enough. But I've seen far too many Hyundai's go through our shop. And I've sold countless parts over the years for them, that my view is a little tainted. You get the feel for that. I'll give them about another five years or so. If their quality remains and their reliability is half decent (not like the past 10 years). Then, I would consider them. Until then, I can't give them any respect.

Time will tell.
You make a very valid point Andy, but I would not have touched the Hyundai's from 5 years ago let alone 10.... Today's version seems to have learned a little from it's past. I too will have to wait and see how it does in the long term. In the meantime, it has an excellent warranty which I hope I don't have to use!...
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Old 12-30-2012, 05:19 PM   #92 (permalink)
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I feel you. And I'm sure if you compare a G37s to a 370z, you'd probably wouldn't want the G as your track car either.

I'm just nervous about all this sketchy Z info. Everytime magazines mention the Z and BRZ in the same breath when it comes to nissans next generation iteration. People say on paper numbers are garbage but I will challenge this theory of on paper stats meaning nothing.

The Z gained praise in 09 for having identical on paper stats as the Porsche Cayman S while beating it in overall grip. The Cayman S @ the time was a 13.3 second quarter mile car that averaged .94g on the skidpad. The Z pushed 13.1 (with automatic with .99g on the skidpad. On paper... this car was considered a Porsche fighter. The Z is far from the fastest car on the road but a driver capable enough can show a real competitive edge on paper.

If the "SO CALLED" extremely fun and "BEST OVERALL SPORTS CAR" in the world is a FRS/BRZ. And all of a sudden, these are the stats to beat???? The Z's new on paper quota to beat is 16 second quarters and .93g on the skidpad. I would call that 2 steps forward and 4 steps back.
If we make the BRZ our competitor? And Hyundai makes the BMW 3 series the competitor. We go from Porsche to subaru while Hyundai goes from infiniti to BMW. As it stands the gencoupe 2.0 CREAMS a BRZ on a roadcoarse. Now I don't see either of these cars as any real Z competitors. But when people in mags talk on types of cars tfor Nissan to beat or battle. That gets me nervous cuz as of now... NISSAN HAS THESE CARS BEAT BY A MILE...
My biggest Z fear is a Nissan downgrade while these little guys upgrade. Hmmm? One to ponder. I hope all this Bullshyt BRZ hype doesn't make nissan feel the need to downgrade the Z??? Remember, Mr K back in 2010 compained of the Z being to heavy. And power being too much of the focus. Mr K didn't like the Z34. Sadly I do.

The 2014 Porsche Cayman S with Sport Chrono package is the car to beat. 12.6 quarter mile. That number to me means something. The BRZ 15.9 seconds means as much to me as used toilet paper.

While I know sports cars aren't defined by speed. Speed and handling is my personal preference. I love fast cars that handle awesome. Sorry if I broke sports car law??? But the Z is a perfect combo of the above. (Though a little to front heavy)
oh im there with you

the g37s in my honest opinion isnt a good track car, its a nice street car though
the 370z is an excellent track car and a really good street car, and the nismo 370z is even better

but i feel paper stats are only there when it benefits people, and they help when making comparisons between cars(aka argue which car is better) but it doesnt do anymore then that
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Old 12-30-2012, 05:25 PM   #93 (permalink)
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Hopefully if Nissan does "downsize", it will be lighter with a 300hp turbo engine! Thats just dreaming though lol.
i hope they dont downsize, i do hope however they make a 370zx TT
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Old 12-31-2012, 10:41 AM   #94 (permalink)
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oh im there with you

the g37s in my honest opinion isnt a good track car, its a nice street car though
the 370z is an excellent track car and a really good street car, and the nismo 370z is even better

but i feel paper stats are only there when it benefits people, and they help when making comparisons between cars(aka argue which car is better) but it doesnt do anymore then that
I'll admit that too many forum threads go overboard with "On paper" stats as a measurement of a sports car being good. Really, on paper stats don't prove much in that area.

But when it comes to car companies meeting a performance goal. Those on paper stats mean a lot before you purchase. To me, the on paper stats help me determine if the car is worth spending the money.

I'm pretty sure the on paper stats of a stock mustang 5.0 having the capability of pulling a 12.6 second quarter mile with a foot of roll out sold a crap load of them. Yet on drag tracks, most STOCK 5.0's I've seen get 12.9/13.2 range.

On paper stats sell cars.
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Old 12-31-2012, 10:45 AM   #95 (permalink)
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That's because they are such a PITA to launch.

They are fully capable of 12.6-12.7 stock. I managed a 12.8 but was still giving up some on my 60'. That's on the driver, though.
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Old 12-31-2012, 10:48 AM   #96 (permalink)
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That's because they are such a PITA to launch.

They are fully capable of 12.6-12.7 stock. I managed a 12.8 but was still giving up some on my 60'. That's on the driver, though.
i know bruh... You're preaching to the choir. But the point was the on paper stat part. I'm not taking anything away from the stang.

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Old 12-31-2012, 10:52 AM   #97 (permalink)
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I do agree stats are generally meaningless. What you feel in your butt when you drive the thing is what matters most.
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Old 12-31-2012, 10:52 AM   #98 (permalink)
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And some cars massage your azz.
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Old 12-31-2012, 11:56 AM   #99 (permalink)
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Let me see Hyundai is releasing a sports coupe that competes performance wise with big heavy German base model sedans? That's an accomplishment? Hmm wonder if new Hyundai will have aluminum frame, aluminum suspension, aluminum body panels by 2015? Lol!

Want to see an accomplishment? Watch for new c7 Vette.
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Old 01-01-2013, 10:02 PM   #100 (permalink)
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if GM can make the vette's interior nice, that alone would be an accomplishment.

back to hyundai
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Old 01-01-2013, 10:06 PM   #101 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by UNKNOWN_370 View Post
I'll admit that too many forum threads go overboard with "On paper" stats as a measurement of a sports car being good. Really, on paper stats don't prove much in that area.

But when it comes to car companies meeting a performance goal. Those on paper stats mean a lot before you purchase. To me, the on paper stats help me determine if the car is worth spending the money.

I'm pretty sure the on paper stats of a stock mustang 5.0 having the capability of pulling a 12.6 second quarter mile with a foot of roll out sold a crap load of them. Yet on drag tracks, most STOCK 5.0's I've seen get 12.9/13.2 range.

On paper stats sell cars.
Paper stats are pretty much worthless numbers to satisfy some preconception on the part of a buyer. Some people need hp, some need light weight, others need skidpad, 0-60, mpg, etc...

Even speed is overrated if you're not enjoying yourself. Fastest does not always mean funnest, and most owners of performance cars won't track their cars, let alone push those limits on public streets (which is not where they should be tested anyway).
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Old 01-02-2013, 10:51 AM   #102 (permalink)
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Paper stats are pretty much worthless numbers to satisfy some preconception on the part of a buyer. Some people need hp, some need light weight, others need skidpad, 0-60, mpg, etc...

Even speed is overrated if you're not enjoying yourself. Fastest does not always mean funnest, and most owners of performance cars won't track their cars, let alone push those limits on public streets (which is not where they should be tested anyway).
You're kinda rehashing what im saying but putting more value on another part of what I'm saying than the other. Then devaluing on paper stats. I guarantee you, if the Z was a fun azz car that the top speed was 110mph and the quarter mile was achieved in 15.4 seconds? Would you have paid $40k for your Z in 2009/10??? lol YES or NO????

Most don't think a LOADED BRZ is worth $30k. But @ 25k it would be better priced. Do you think its because its on paper stats don't add up to other $30k cars or... Because it's not fun enough to drive @ the 30k price point. Reviewers say its the most fun car since the porsche 911.

I think most don't like the $30k price based on comparable cars in the price range. Those comparos come from on paper stats... Sorry but its true.
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Old 01-02-2013, 11:06 AM   #103 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by shadoquad View Post
Paper stats are pretty much worthless numbers to satisfy some preconception on the part of a buyer. Some people need hp, some need light weight, others need skidpad, 0-60, mpg, etc...

Even speed is overrated if you're not enjoying yourself. Fastest does not always mean funnest, and most owners of performance cars won't track their cars, let alone push those limits on public streets (which is not where they should be tested anyway).
thats why the brz does so well
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Old 01-02-2013, 08:58 PM   #104 (permalink)
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You're kinda rehashing what im saying but putting more value on another part of what I'm saying than the other. Then devaluing on paper stats. I guarantee you, if the Z was a fun azz car that the top speed was 110mph and the quarter mile was achieved in 15.4 seconds? Would you have paid $40k for your Z in 2009/10??? lol YES or NO????

Most don't think a LOADED BRZ is worth $30k. But @ 25k it would be better priced. Do you think its because its on paper stats don't add up to other $30k cars or... Because it's not fun enough to drive @ the 30k price point. Reviewers say its the most fun car since the porsche 911.

I think most don't like the $30k price based on comparable cars in the price range. Those comparos come from on paper stats... Sorry but its true.
I paid 30k for my z in 2010 and don't regret it for a second. The BRZ, Miata, and Exige are all cars that can deliver lightweight thrills with little power. I respect them all.

If all you care about is stats, you're limiting yourself.
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Old 01-02-2013, 09:06 PM   #105 (permalink)
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It's kinda like meeting a new girl (if I remember correctly! lol)....

It either hits you and you have to have it... or it doesn't. The Z hit me as a 'must have' immediately. I love the perfections and the flaws = true love! lol
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