Official: 2012 Boss 302

m4a1mustang · 08-13-2010, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pharmacist

so is this supposed to replace the gt500 or will coexist with it? which one then will be the top of the line mustang?

Coexist. This one is based off the 5 liter from the regular GT and is more of a track-oriented car.

The GT500 is a street beast that uses the supercharged 5.4L.

Pharmacist · 08-13-2010, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

Coexist. This one is based off the 5 liter from the regular GT and is more of a track-oriented car.

The GT500 is a street beast that uses the supercharged 5.4L.

which one will be the faster around a road course? in a straight line i assume the gt500 will be faster.

theDreamer · 08-13-2010, 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pharmacist

which one will be the faster around a road course? in a straight line i assume the gt500 will be faster.

That will depend on track size really.
The GT500 is putting down more power and has great handling, but the Boss will beat around a corner but lose it on longer straights.

FL 4Motion · 08-13-2010, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pharmacist

which one will be the faster around a road course? in a straight line i assume the gt500 will be faster.

hard to say, the gt500 isn't exactly a slouch in the twisties, on a big track with lots of straightaways, i'd give the edge to the gt500, on a tighter track, the lighter weight of the 302 should have the edge, I think the boss302 would be more rewarding to drive, less muscling thru the corners compared to it's heavier big brother.

m4a1mustang · 08-13-2010, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pharmacist

which one will be the faster around a road course? in a straight line i assume the gt500 will be faster.

Honestly I have no idea. We will have to see the numbers once the car gets put through its paces.

FL 4Motion · 08-13-2010, 06:25 PM

I would take this boss302 over a GT 500, it looks like an amazing track car. THIS is what nissan needs to do with the NISMO Z, Ford went all out and it's going to be a hit.

Pharmacist · 08-13-2010, 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FL 4Motion

I would take this boss302 over a GT 500, it looks like an amazing track car. THIS is what nissan needs to do with the NISMO Z, Ford went all out and it's going to be a hit.

i'd love nissan to give the z the porche rs treatment and make a hardcore race car out of the box, possibly supercharged making about mid 400's hp, stripped and gutted interior, racing seats, roll cage, aerodynamic kit, brake and suspension upgrades, oil cooler, and lightweight carbon fibre body panels weighing around 3000 lbs or so, with a price mid point between the current z and the gtr

FL 4Motion · 08-13-2010, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pharmacist

i'd love nissan to give the z the porche rs treatment and make a hardcore race car out of the box, possibly supercharged making about mid 400's hp, stripped and gutted interior, racing seats, roll cage, aerodynamic kit, brake and suspension upgrades, oil cooler, and lightweight carbon fibre body panels weighing around 3000 lbs or so, with a price mid point between the current z and the gtr

I have daydreams about this scenario, I'd be all over something like this in a heartbeat. Nissan, are you ******* listening???

Pharmacist · 08-13-2010, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FL 4Motion

I have daydreams about this scenario, I'd be all over something like this in a heartbeat. Nissan, are you ******* listening???

the problem from nissan's perspective is that the z is their second car in the line up, overshadowed by the gtr which is their main performance vehicle. they will never make the z too fast for fear it may cannibalize gtr sales and make the gtr irrelevant. that's also why chevy will never make a camaro fast enough to encroach on the corvette turf. ditto with porsche's cayman and 911 carrera

shadoquad · 08-13-2010, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pharmacist

the problem from nissan's perspective is that the z is their second car in the line up, overshadowed by the gtr which is their main performance vehicle. they will never make the z too fast for fear it may cannibalize gtr sales and make the gtr irrelevant. that's also why chevy will never make a camaro fast enough to encroach on the corvette turf. ditto with porsche's cayman and 911 carrera

In fact, the Pontiac Fiero was, in its day, the only GM car that was profitable every year of its run. Rumor has it that it was squashed because it was too competitive against the Corvette. Reliability and safety issues aside, the Vettes of that era weren't much quicker.

FL 4Motion · 08-13-2010, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pharmacist

the problem from nissan's perspective is that the z is their second car in the line up, overshadowed by the gtr which is their main performance vehicle. they will never make the z too fast for fear it may cannibalize gtr sales and make the gtr irrelevant. that's also why chevy will never make a camaro fast enough to encroach on the corvette turf. ditto with porsche's cayman and 911 carrera

Totally agree, it would be a very fine line that Nissan would have to walk to get a more track/aggresively oriented Z produced that slotted in nicely between a "regular" Z and the GTR.

It can be done. like others stated, forget the carbon fiber and the roll cage,, just get the car to around 400-430 bhp (small twin turbo set up would do that the easiest), oil cooler std, clutch type lsd std, aggressive brake pads std, and sell it for around 45K.

I don't think this would cannibalize GTR sales, /\ that car, will never match the performance of a GTR (7:26 'ring time is haulin ***), but it would be competitive against all the cars we constantly compare the Z too. I believe there's room in the Z linup for this. Base, Touring, and tt Nismo basically. If they really went crazy, they could have a tt touring with sport pkg for those that want the power but not the track oriented stuff, but that puts the Z closer to what the 300zxtt was and it died off here in the us so that probably won't happen.

m4a1mustang · 08-13-2010, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pharmacist

i'd love nissan to give the z the porche rs treatment and make a hardcore race car out of the box, possibly supercharged making about mid 400's hp, stripped and gutted interior, racing seats, roll cage, aerodynamic kit, brake and suspension upgrades, oil cooler, and lightweight carbon fibre body panels weighing around 3000 lbs or so, with a price mid point between the current z and the gtr

My guess is a Z built as you described would well beyond the mid point between the Z and GTR. You're pretty much talking a full on race car which would probably go for $100k or more.

Not to mention they need to build the car to fit SOME specification. What you described is just a race car that could compete in what? Track days?

A better option would be something more like what Ford did with the Boss 302. A track day car that can still be driven around on the street. Maybe a TT or SC tuned to make 450hp out of the box with an aggressive street/track suspension, interior, and not much in the way of creature comforts. That would be something that they could have priced between the base Z and the GTR.

But when you start talking roll cage, carbon fiber panels, etc... the prices skyrocket.

Pharmacist · 08-13-2010, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

My guess is a Z built as you described would well beyond the mid point between the Z and GTR. You're pretty much talking a full on race car which would probably go for $100k or more.

Not to mention they need to build the car to fit SOME specification. What you described is just a race car that could compete in what? Track days?

A better option would be something more like what Ford did with the Boss 302. A track day car that can still be driven around on the street. Maybe a TT or SC tuned to make 450hp out of the box with an aggressive street/track suspension, interior, and not much in the way of creature comforts. That would be something that they could have priced between the base Z and the GTR.

But when you start talking roll cage, carbon fiber panels, etc... the prices skyrocket.

perhaps something like the boxster spyder. basically lightweight racing seats, and a gutted minimalist interior with no a/c or radio. upgraded pads and cross drilled slotted rotors. bigger wheels and wider tires. supercharger and oil cooler. mechanical lsd. and shortersprings/firmer dampers. i'd imagine this ca be done for an extra 15-20k increase in price, and then we'd have a cayman and exige killer.

m4a1mustang · 08-13-2010, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pharmacist

perhaps something like the boxster spyder. basically lightweight racing seats, and a gutted minimalist interior with no a/c or radio. upgraded pads and cross drilled slotted rotors. bigger wheels and wider tires. supercharger and oil cooler. mechanical lsd. and shortersprings/firmer dampers. i'd imagine this ca be done for an extra 15-20k increase in price, and then we'd have a cayman and exige killer.

That makes sense, except I'd keep the radio and A/C because from a sales standpoint you'd want the car to still be desirable for someone who wants a track car for the street that has SOME creature comforts...

But yeah, I'd throw in some light weight seats, manual windows, get rid of what little sound deadening is installed in the base model car, upgrade the brakes, suspension, and engine (and add an oil cooler!!!). I'd say at a ~$60k price point it'd probably work.

The only problem is NISSAN really doesn't have the money... lol. And it's painfully clear that they don't really care in the first place. They'd rather show off their new Leaf.

theDreamer · 08-13-2010, 06:51 PM

The issue I see with Nissan is you have a 30k car and an 80k car.
Now Ford does not have anything over 60k currently (Ford GT), but they feel the gap between 30k to 60k nicely. If I want a track ready street car I can get a GT500 or now a Boss 302, but with Nissan you get a good value sports car which needs track work or a super car.

08-13-2010, 06:51 PM	#15 (permalink)
theDreamer A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 30,879 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 4211	The issue I see with Nissan is you have a 30k car and an 80k car. Now Ford does not have anything over 60k currently (Ford GT), but they feel the gap between 30k to 60k nicely. If I want a track ready street car I can get a GT500 or now a Boss 302, but with Nissan you get a good value sports car which needs track work or a super car. __________________ theDreamer's Z // Fast Intentions // Uprev // GTM // HKS // TEIN theDreamer's Silvia // URAS // GREDDY Houston Zs // Facebook // Twitter // Instagram

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08-13-2010, 06:25 PM	#6 (permalink)
FL 4Motion A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: FL Posts: 4,776 Drives: Baby Shark Rep Power: 701616	I would take this boss302 over a GT 500, it looks like an amazing track car. THIS is what nissan needs to do with the NISMO Z, Ford went all out and it's going to be a hit.