Bikers Attack Driver After Accident: Caught on Tape

ElVee · 10-02-2013, 11:58 AM

Definitely depends if that "bystander" is part of the group or not. The biker victim may not have made any actual violent pretense, but as a part of the group he is still participating in intimidation and whatever else the group commits. Not as bad as the actual doers/leaders of the violence, but certainly still a participant.

Red__Zed · 10-02-2013, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tazicon

This is like picking a fight with a guy, getting beat up then you sue the guy you picked the fight with. This whole thing should have been stopped long before it escalated. The mom suing should look at her son and the way she raised him then sue herself for having been a crappy parent. If her son was raised right he wouldn't have been a part of those stupid actions.

The only thing in question is who "really" (from a legal perspective) started the fight. There are a number of reasons to assume the bikers, but evidence at this point is still unclear.

ElVee · 10-02-2013, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

That's actually largely irrelevant. The bikers cannot use it as a defense as any immediate danger would have passed and it does little to change whether the RR driver was acting in self-defense when he sped off.

I mean to provide no defense for the bikers, just to be clear.

Red__Zed · 10-02-2013, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElVee

Definitely depends if that "bystander" is part of the group or not. The biker victim may not have made any actual violent pretense, but as a part of the group he is still participating in intimidation and whatever else the group commits. Not as bad as the actual doers/leaders of the violence, but certainly still a participant.

Not under US law (with limited exceptions).

Cmike2780 · 10-02-2013, 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

I guess passive-aggressiveness is your only option.

I'm no friend of guys like these bikers, and I'd prefer if the NYPD would toss them all in jail for their recorded behaviors. But following the law regarding escalation of force is very important.

I'm really not trying to start anything with you and I have nothing at stake here. We can squash it now and let it go or you can continue to google Wikipedia links to educate us all on the legal system.

Red__Zed · 10-02-2013, 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElVee

I mean to provide no defense for the bikers, just to be clear.

I know. I'm just pointing out that even if it comes out that the RR driver was waving a gun at them prior to the video start, it really doesn't matter that much (to the facts of this situation, he could be charged separately for other offenses).

DEpointfive0 · 10-02-2013, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck33079

We'll just have to see how it plays out in court. What I believe based on what we've seen so far makes me think this is pretty clear self defense. You seem to disagree. It'll be interesting to see what additional information leaks out. I still want a transcript of the 911 call.

I'll bet you a six-pack the driver walks on all criminal and civil issues- you in?

I'm on your side, but fùck it, I'll bet you, lol

SouthArk370Z · 10-02-2013, 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElVee

... Things do change slightly if there is video footage and/or third party witnesses about the RR cutting off the bikers. ...

If I'm out showing my a$$ (weaving through traffic, changing lanes suddenly, crowding other vehicles, &c) and someone cuts me off, I don't think I have much to complain about. But maybe that's just me.

Red__Zed · 10-02-2013, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DEpointfive0

I'm on your side, but fùck it, I'll bet you, lol

I'm in if we make it a 48 pack.

You know what, forget the bet and let's grab some drinks

ElVee · 10-02-2013, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

Not under US law (with limited exceptions).

If you can't tell who the bystanders are apart from the attackers, and they all appear to be part of the same group... Should the RR driver rolled down his window and politely asked for clarification?

The guy run over might have been the good samaritan of the group, but he is still part of the group that escalated things.

Chuck33079 · 10-02-2013, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

I'm in if we make it a 48 pack.

You know what, forget the bet and let's grab some drinks

I'm completely ok with this.

Red__Zed · 10-02-2013, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElVee

If you can't tell who the bystanders are apart from the attackers, and they all appear to be part of the same group... Should the RR driver rolled down his window and politely asked for clarification?

The guy run over might have been the good samaritan of the group, but he is still part of the group that escalated things.

I don't disagree with the principle (in this case) but it's a core principle upon which the English legal system was founded (and by extension, the US system).

You can imagine in other cases where this might not work out so favorably.

Chuck33079 · 10-02-2013, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

I don't disagree with the principle (in this case) but it's a core principle upon which the English legal system was founded (and by extension, the US system).

You can imagine in other cases where this might not work out so favorably.

Agreed, but some kind of "dumbfuck exemption" might not be a bad idea.

SouthArk370Z · 10-02-2013, 12:14 PM

Somebody has to do it. Might as well be me.

Hitler and Nazis

ElVee · 10-02-2013, 12:15 PM

True, but like many things, it comes down to what a *reasonable* person would think.

10-02-2013, 11:58 AM	#151 (permalink)
ElVee Track Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Iowa Posts: 750 Drives: 13 370z 7at t+s grey Rep Power: 16	Definitely depends if that "bystander" is part of the group or not. The biker victim may not have made any actual violent pretense, but as a part of the group he is still participating in intimidation and whatever else the group commits. Not as bad as the actual doers/leaders of the violence, but certainly still a participant. SouthArk370Z likes this.

10-02-2013, 12:14 PM	#164 (permalink)
SouthArk370Z Premium Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: South Arkansas Posts: 8,435 Drives: 2014 Challenger Rep Power: 324198	Somebody has to do it. Might as well be me. Hitler and Nazis DEpointfive0 likes this. __________________ Steering Lock Links - Search The370Z Bookmarklet - FSM @ NICOclub Mankind has progressed past the need for war but we haven't evolved that far. - NachoMahma

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10-02-2013, 12:15 PM	#165 (permalink)
ElVee Track Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Iowa Posts: 750 Drives: 13 370z 7at t+s grey Rep Power: 16	True, but like many things, it comes down to what a reasonable person would think.