Unimpressed by the 400z
 

I really think Nissan missed the mark on this one... To be honest you could probably post a slightly modded 370 interior and nobody would be the wiser. The interior, electronics/interface, and the transmission are already outdated and the car isn't even out yet. The exterior has potential, but it seems for some reason Nissan has fallen behind when it comes to innovation. Every "new" Nissan still has styling or technology from 10 years ago. It's a shame... I was so hopeful.

I still like the way a 1965 Mustang looks. Same for any year 370Z. Some designs are ageless. YMMV

Oh, I'm with you for the 370, or classic cars. But I think the time for the. "retro" look has come and pass here on the domestic market. Ford, Dodge, and Chevy have taken note and either have or are attempting to revitalize the aesthetics and technology in their vehicles. Honestly it seems like EVERY other manufacturer is looking to update their inventory with something that at least looks "innovative and futuristic". But good ol' Nissan and Infiniti are literally producing new cars with technology that was considered "dated" 7-10 years ago.

I just can't justify spending the amount of money they're going to ask for that car, for the aesthetics, technology, and performance it's going to have. They took beautiful cars and mashed them together to produce something...not as appealing. Something boring... And mind you, that's the concept. That's their "oh let's blow their mind" draft. The production model I imagine will be far less....well....everything.

Totally disagree with OP on all points.

I can't wait for the new 300Z Twin Turbo!

Lol. I get your point but wait 'til it becomes available and one blows by you stock and no tune. Also, there's not a good business reason for Nissan to put in more than they have to.

:facepalm::gtfo2:

You're entitled to your opinion. You raise some valid points, but I think Nissan saw an opportunity in the market to pull some Supra buyers and maybe pull some muscle car buyers by leveraging some existing tech they have without investing much in a new platform. This was most likely the ONLY way we were getting a new Z. They're investing in electric and other more profitable vehicles than the Z, since most sports cars, unfortunately, do not sell well these days.

I'll hold my thoughts on performance until those stats are released and until the drive reviews come back. I would imagine it's 400hp at around 3400lbs. Which is a pretty nice balance relative to something like a Mustang which is 480hp at 3900lbs. With the twin-turbo setup you'll have tuning potential that was much more challenging for 350-370 engines. Power will not be expensive to make relative to those cars (if that's your thing).

I love the design as it hits the heart strings by attaching itself to the older models. I've wanted a 240z inspired retro design for a long time and this is probably the closest we'll ever come. Some of the design elements don't seem to mesh well together, but the car is still a clean beautiful design in an age of excess vents and styling. The aftermarket can provide more here as well.

The benefit of using an existing platform/motor/transmission is reliability and cost. I do get that it's not as exciting, but, most of the kinks will have been worked out and they didn't have to invest in new tech for this project. On top of that, you'll get a more old school feel in this car, which is something that most enthusiasts say they want.

They did say 98% of the concept will be identical to the final production..

LOL. I doubt that will happen. And I don't think it's putting in more than they have to.. I just feel that their spirit of innovation has called it quits.

If you're going to go through the dog and pony show of unveiling a "new" Z why is it using technology from cars you had 10 years ago? I honestly think that lack of innovation is why Nissan/Infiniti is hurting the way they are. Not just in the Z's but across their whole line up. I'd be on board if they stuck to one Z car to base their retro style on....but all of them? I dunno man... Renders with aftermarket parts on it make it look great, but damn...I absolutely cannot appreciate that car in it's stock form.

:iagree: The new z is not even out yet lol

Because they want to sell these?

They need to drum up excitement and anticipation and show their potential customers that there IS actually a new Z on the way.

Maybe you aren't a customer because they didn't do enough in your eyes, but did you really think they were just going to low-key launch the Z and go here's a new Z, not much to it, maybe buy it maybe don't?

If i have to choose between the new Supra and the Z. I'd go for the new Z. The manual trans gives it away and i'm digging the look.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dK0U...KelleyBlueBook

You don't really have a choice.

Massachusetts just joined California with a 2035 ICE ban. So did Japan.

The next generation of sports cars is probably the last. Take it or leave it, there won't be a 450Z to hold out for.

There’s always the butt fugly Supra for $65,000+

I leased a 2016 GTI. Turbo power, added JB4, even more turbo power. Amazing DSG. Amazing handling. With the JB4 it could out-accelerate BMW 340i. Lots of "tech" in that car. Headlights that swiveled, adjustable suspension, Android Auto at a time only Hyundai had AA. Amazing car to drive.

2 miles from picking it up from the dealer, check engine light. Was in the shop 10 times over 33 months. Trust me, I loved driving that car. But as my lease was nearing an end, I actually chose a less complicated, obviously "old-school" under the skin car to replace the GTI. I bought my 2014 CPO Q60 to replace my 2016 GTI knowing: everyone hates the 7AT, under the skin the car is actually 18 years old, the VQ has been out "forever" and I'd be giving up my Android Auto.

I gained AWD traction, and in 2 years of ownership never ONCE needed any repairs.

So, the whole "it's outdated" argument falls on deaf ears with me. I. Could. Care. Less.

If I can get a 400HP Turbo 2 seater, I am likely going to keep it a long time. I can guarantee I will keep it so long it will undoubtedly be considered outdated no matter what kind of "but only if" tech they could cram into it in 2021.

For the OP, I would suggest the C8 Corvette. If a high-tech cutting edge affordable 2 seater is what they are after, that's probably the best choice if going solely by the metrics.
BMW Supra would be another choice.
Any Lexus coupe is actually "outdated" too.

Choices are good. I am glad to not be hung up on "needs to be the newest tech". Just being physically new even if older engineering is OK by me as long as the quality is good (Made in Japan please) so I can forseeably keep it 20+ years.

Underwhelming in some ways, but also a lot of something

Nissan kept it theirs. Made it manual. Both those together are actually not safe business moves on top of being a sports car in general. Yes they're leaning on reusing resources, but it's hardware that is expected to be thought-out with time, and simple fact is, they didn't have to do this. At all. But they did.

I was trying to poise myself for a C8 or C7, and bottom line keep my 370Z, but if something happened unplanned, I'm probably going to be in line for a 400Z to keep moving on in sports car life.

Let me know when you get to your point. They clearly unveiled a Z. Whether or not it's available for purchase doesn't change the fact that the product they DID show was unimpressive to me...

Again...the new z is not even out yet, don't judge the proto, hence the word "proto" as the final production is not unveiled.

The C8 in my opinion is a great example of innovation and styling. I wouldn't call it affordable though lol. I have a Q60RS and I like it quite a bit but there's still things about it that I'm like..."c'mon you could've thought this out better, or this could at least be on par with other cars in it's class". I don't think it needs to be the newest tech...just not tech I can get from a car they made in 2009.

Do you like it?

I love the side profile, the rear needs some work, the front square definetly needs work, but over I love the clean design, more so than the Supra and even more that it is a manual.

The spirit is there but no money to lift that spirit. Which is OK. Can't expect too much given current conditions and how the industry is headed towards EVs and how its partnership with Renault hurt it in the long run (yes I know they needed their money to survive). With their current struggles, going cheap was the right course using whatever they can from existing parts bin.

For me, what was innovative and ahead of the curve was the S30,and its variants and the Z32. My brother had a white Z32 TT, T-Top, and four-wheel steering. That was when I said, I got to have a Z some day. In less than 2 years, it was squashed when his apartment landed on it during the Northridge quake.

So you can like it even though it's not out yet, but I can't not like it. LOL got it.

Damn, that's a shame about the earthquake. Crazy how quickly things can change in life.

Again....didnt say you or anyone can like it, but if you see my sentence as the "front and rear needs work", I know there is room for improvements and I am not to make quick negative judgement.

Didn’t read all the post on this thread; but this is a “Throwback” body style, so it’s not gonna have everything brand new on design :ugh2:

Chevy,Ford,Dodge did it in last 10yrs....so Nissan is giving it a whirl :tiphat:

I think it’s best to wait till the vehicle arrives and we start seeing reviews on performance etc. The way I look at it is while the proto was underwhelming since we only saw and heard about the design aspect but no mention of what was added underneath that design - but it was a GREAT surprise to see that Nissan is actually doing a new Z - i think all of us have been complaining about ‘where is the new Z - been 10+ years’.

When you look at a car like the Supra, lets not forget that the car is over $55k and this new Z ‘SHOULD’ be priced well below that to allow for the aftermarket to take care of things that we want to replace all for less than a stock Supra. Also at least the new Z will offer a manual which is great for enthusiasts. As for looks - it’s subjective - but I want to wait to see one in person and then make my decision - at least the interior looks better than what we currently have in our Zs (just my .02).

As far as performance vehicles - what vehicles come to mind that you feel are full filling the promise of performance + tech? The only vehicle that is REASONABLY priced is maybe the Civic Type R - but even that car has an outdated interior, subjective looks and an infotainment that everyone on their forum complains about - seems all the tech was added to making a FWD vehicle perform. As for the Supra - it required teaming with BMW and use THEIR engine and basically their interior as well; it feels like the only thing Toyota did was add a shell and a different tune. While I do like the design - its a hefty price for new and I don’t consider a $55k to $60k (after TTL) reasonable.

I know we all want to act like our Zs are still relevant but get real. This new Z will be a massive upgrade. Just the engine change puts it in a completely new class. What “technology” do you care about that is putting you off? You’re worried it won’t have Apple car play?

Come on now.

Obviously the new z will feature newer tech and it'll be faster, but that isn't the only reason people buy cars? At least i should hope not otherwise anything older than 2-3 years and you'll already be itching for an "upgrade". I myself, didnt buy the Z because of speed and it sure as hell wasn't the fastest thing around too and unless you track your z, where are you going with all this extra speed? We'll still see each other at the next red light anyway lol.

I absolutely love that Nissan decided to make a new Z and their decision to make the new z standard only speaks volumes, but i think Nissan really set the bar with the 370z. Despite the common issues our cars have, overall its an amazing car. I don't think this new z is up to what Nissan is capable of. This in itself i think will only make previous Z's more relevant and desired.

I may be mistaken but when he was saying tech I assumed he meant from a chassis, engine, transmission, suspension standpoint. Meaning, the architecture for this car is old and the engine is from a car released in 2017.

From that perspective there is less to be excited about. It's not a ground up build where we'll see new everything.

My points are still that this helps keep cost low and reliability high, while providing a very nice upgrade over the current 370. It's a wise business decision and probably the only way we were going to get a new Z during these difficult times for the company and the push for electrification.

I think Nissan is still able differentiate this car significantly from the 370 with better brakes, better handling, more (tunable) power, refreshed design, and some modern screen tech.

Side pro is good, front looks like what Scion already failed at and the rear obviously pulled off the already :icon23: ugly 240Z. Yup pun intended.

Couldn't care less about tech nor power making up for other low lights. If I did I wouldn't have taken the 420 hp hit to own a 370Z, yes previous platform had 750hp:rolleyes:.

As for price, I can't justify the price of a new 370Z as I bought my '10 Sport Touring with 72k on it in 2016 for $15k (clean title, no wrecks etc., yes well bought) so obviously won't be able to for the 400 neither.

The 370Z will be the pinnacle for Nissan's design of the Z platform. :tup:

With what I view a an aesthetic fail in the 400Z next up for me will be 718 Porsche.

That's what I was getting at. I can't fault a company for using the cost effective option in order to stay in business. But as someone who has seen a car I own last a decade unchanged I was really hoping that the new car would be just that...new. And while people will consider it having the 3.0t a new engine, even that will be 4-5 years old by the time it's released.

I completely get where you're coming from but a couple of questions:
1. Would you rather Nissan partner with another car maker such as Toyota with Subaru or Toyota with BMW with the making of the BRZ/FRS or the Supra? Basically one could say that the Supra doesn't have much in other than the shell, QA of the car and a tune?

2. Considering the R&D that would be needed to build a new engine - would you be willing to pay much more than lets say $45k for a new engine and new technology?

Considering they already have a twin turbo for the Q - why not use the same engine and technology - work on adding a manual to it - and work out the kinks - maybe look at the existing shortcomings of the Q60 and look to improve on that for the new Z. This way your focus can be on things such as the shell, the improvement of the engine and other things to make it a revision as far as teh engine of the Q60 and giving the looks and interior tech of the new Z.

I don't know - again, I understand that the hype makes it seem like this would be a BRAND NEW car and it feels more like a refresh that should have happened several years ago.

1. Would I prefer Nissan were able to produce a wholly new car on their own? Yes.

But if it took collaborating with another manufacture to produce something fresh and innovative, I wouldn't turn my nose up at it. Just as long as the car was mostly Nissan (if that makes sense).


2. Yeah, if Nissan were to produce a real banger, I'd pay the money for it. If the Nismo version of the Z was a 4L twin turbo with a kick *** transmission and suspension, I'd feel justified paying a bit more. Hell, I was in the market for a Q60 Black S had they followed through with their ambitions.

3. I'm not knocking them for using the engine. I'm knocking them for deciding to do it so late. I feel like the introduction of the Q50/Q60 and the VR30 platform should've been when it took place. I mean they've had a solid twin turbo V6 since what? 2009. The kinks have been worked out. If they want to take a twin turbo engine/set up from one of their own, they could've literally just handed that down to the Z in 2015, and made a new platform for the GTR. The most "innovative" thing they did for the Z in the past 10 years was add Recaro seats to the Nismo.

To the OP, complaining about a "lack of innovation" on the upcoming "400Z", what do you think they should have done? I like the simplicity. Less stuff to break. Tech for tech's sake sucks.

I have a 2017 370Z which through an aftermarket head unit has Android Auto. The only things that I wish the car could have is blind spot monitoring and ventilated seats would be great too.

I understand Nissan's budget on the 400Z was around $240 million. A total new design from the ground up on a new chassis is over a billion. I'm amazed that they are going to release a 400Z at all, considering Nissan's rough last few years and the world economic doldrums we are in. They don't sell enough of cars like this to justify dropping a billion on a total new design.

If Nissan had done a total new design from the ground up, 400Z's or whatever they would have called it would probably start at $50K and go up from there.

The new 400Z will have a V6 twin turbo, 6-speed manual or probably a 9-speed auto, updated safety features and blind spot monitoring, updated infotainment, revised chassis, good build quality/fit and finish, and great looks. What more is there to want for a reasonable price?

The GT-R's twin turbo engine is hand-built by a group of 4 guys. Would cost too much to put that engine into a Z. Perhaps they could have taken the GT-R's engine and built it on an assembly line instead, thus lowering the costs. You're wanting Nissan to sell a 565hp car for $50K. LOL

The most worthless annoying nanny feature you could ask for. Adjust your mirrors properly and there is no blind spot.

Loading down the new Z with useless nanny features is nothing I'm interested in. Go get a mini van if you want that junk

Yea.......Who wants a sports car that is overloaded with tech features that takes away from the driving experience. :driving: