I don't think we need to compete with muscle. I think the Z has to built out of principle, not profit. Our cars have their own heritage. We don't have to compete against ANYONE except Porsche and jaguar.

Keep in mind that the ss Camaro is around 10k more than the base 370Z and the Mustang GT at least 5k more. For that money, you could do some serious aftermarket work and have a much more unique and exciting car. In my opinion Nissan provides an excellent base platform for which their are many intriguing mod options. Personally I'd rather build a beast piece by piece than drive one off the lot.

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My personal opinion is in comparing the Z to the muscle cars is strictly about performance to the dollar. I bought the Z for its uniqueness like most folks on this thread. I would gladly cough up another $5 to $10k to get the same upgrades that come with the latest models SS and GT muscle cars. Them damn things out the box are as nimble or more than than the Z with the same amount of money put into a Z with aftermarket components...and it will take you that much money to level the playing field with them. I got my *** waxed by a guy in a brand new SS Camero in the rain on a track day. Yeah, he is a better driver but that damn car lives up to the hype.

I am a Z fan through and through and even given the performance of the new Cameros and Mustangs, they are beast compared to the feeling I get when sitting in and handling my Z. I just would like a Z that starts at the same place as the before mentioned muscle cars. And for comparing the Z to the Porsche, Jag, Vett and Audi TT for me only speaks to the feeling of what a sportscar should feel like...you can't get that from a muscle car or even a GTR!

I get where you're coming from and you make some valid points. It would be nice is you the Z was available with FI or an upgraded engine, particularly the nismo version. The current features offer very modest hp gains and hardly seem worth the additional cost. Personally, I'm more of a project guy and I enjoy the process of the build. I think of I bought something that was nearly perfect out of the box, I'd tire of it sooner and be looking for something new before long. As with nearly all consumer products each year brings a new version with more exciting features that inevitability make predecessors feel somewhat dated. No matter what you drive, there is always going to be somebody who is faster or can corner better. It's the nature of the beast. I'm sure the guy in the ss has had his doors blown off at some point as well. A Hellcat for example would toast the Camaro. As for comparisons to Porsche, Jag, Audi, etc, all make some remarkable sports cars but they are simply in a different class. If the Z was priced in the 60-80k range, I'm sure it would be just as impressive as an F type or 911, but it would also be out of my price range. If money was no object, I'd be driving the new NSX. Until then I'm just having as much fun as I can within my means.

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The deal is I can debate this topic from many perspectives as there are so many variables. The big reality hammer in this discussion when making comparisons is the economy of scale for the manufactures as been brought up here. The big 3 American companies sell more pony cars so their price per unit is less. On the import side we get to make up that difference in price as the Z is not even in the game compared to the number of units sold. It truly is a special niche product and that is what makes the car special...mod on my brother as you can see I gone full stupid in that game and she is always one of the crowd favorites no matter if is at the track or hard parked.

So does the Mazda MX5...:stirthepot:

Agreed, It used to be that the supply of high HP cars was limited unless you spent a fortune. Now anyone can get a high HP car ..
Z beats those cars in reliability, looks, handling, cost and usable HP.

Cool car for a girl..
Horse power has gotten to be excessive and unusable but 155 hp? Thats 3 less than a honda civic base model....:icon14:

Though, the civic weighs 400 lbs more!

Divide your Z's present HP by 2 and its still higher than the miata.:superghey:

Try this....google "MX5 for girls?" Tons of people asking the question, confirming it is, or defending it isn't.
Then ask yourself if you want to spend multiple years defending your purchase against the "girls car" stereotype.:icon14:

222 days to Tokyo.

Hey, but you'll be a better driver, driving a slow car fast compared to driving a fast car slow.

The Z is definitely a car I don't see too often. Hands down though, we all can attest to the Mustangs, Camaros, etc that are driving around. I wish Nissan really took into consideration what "Project Z" was. We all know the next engine will most likely will be FI so atleast it was already made for boost. I feel that Nissan can do better in the handling department.

One takeaway when Hotrodz and I were driving a week ago was, we could still keep up with most of the cars out there in the corners despite the weight of the Z.

A list of wishes for the next Z:

-Make the Nismo version lighter (just like the GT3s and GT3RSs)

-Engine forced inducted from factory (check)

-Handling improvements (Front and Rear sway bar stiffened), I felt the stroke in the suspension was adequate, but the roll wasn't to my liking. It's pretty obvious though.

-Make each model of the next Z more tailored for various drivers.

-Base (standard Z w/o the usual bells and whistles; more milder in suspension setup for ride comfort/handling)

-Sport (a step up in suspension/handling, but still has room to modify for those wanting to track. optional wheel/tire setup, optional radiator/oil cooler)

-Nismo (more track oriented setup [suspension tailored for track use, but compliant on the street], AC delete option, more bolstered Recaros/bucket seat option, square wheel/tire setup option, larger radiator/oil cooler standard)

*of course there would be options for nav/radio/etc.

That would be in my eyes what I wish to see with the new Z.

I couldn't agree more, the MX5 is super girly, could never see myself in one of those. I am a bit surprised by how many guys I see driving the around here. Then again, the DC metro seems to have an endless supply of yuppie d-bags, so I guess it's really not that surprising.

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I have respect for the Miata. Ton of guys track them because they are light, handle great, and are inexpensive to run. Seems just fine for a fun sports car. It's definitely not fast or for me, but that's not everything and if it's fun for its owners, that's all that matters. They often graduate into s2ks though.

If the S2K came back, there would be a lot of guys jumping from Zs and Miatas.

The Miata is the most tracked vehicle in the US!

Yep. I can see why. Old ones are cheap, consumables cost nothing, and you learn a whole lot more if you're not trying to hold back 600hp at the same time.

They're a ton of fun on the street too. You can hang the *** end out around every corner, tires squealing, and not even break the speed limit. Even though you're going 30 mph, it feels like you're going twice that since it's low to the ground and tiny. My sister had one for a few years and I loved borrowing it for errands. It is really spooky driving it on the freeway, though. You come halfway up the tire on an 18 wheeler. He wouldn't even feel it if he ran over a Miata.

And has the wrong wheels doing the work.

Put a roots blower or turbo on a new MX-5, and it will have plenty of punch and kick everyone's *** all day.

If I can't swing an Alfa 4C for my next car, I'm going to have to seriously think about one of those in RF trim with some boost.

I can tell you there are a lot of folks that get a$$ handed to them by those ladies cars on the track. Those bad boys that are boosted are pretty freaking fast!

This got stickied? What in tarnation?

I have seen videos of a non booster s2000 do a nurburgring lap and pass plenty faster cars. Driver mod is highly underrated.

I hear that track is a killer.

When I played grand tourismo its like is this even real? Google way back and was like holy **** it is.

I hope to lap on it one day.

As the joke seems to have flown right over your head, the name of the track you're thinking of is the Nurburgring. Nuremberg is .....much less pleasant. :roflpuke2:

LMFAO made my day...

...in a dark humor sort of way.

English is 5th language.

jibberish
not English
sometimes English
definitely not English all preceed. :(

I was like wait... oh. RIGHT fml :ugh2:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qAkSAA_d4K4

anyways here the video... sure the m4 was 'faster' in straights but was a little bitch in the corner.

They finally decided to make the 60k for a Z thread official Huh? LMFAO. A Lil late in the game ehhh. Lol

Any official word what so ever on the Z35??

I know sorry :facepalm:

Gan San's drive of the S2000 prototype video shows it all.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nl5cFzcZ8YY

You're gonna have to wait for the Tokyo auto show.

Oct 27, 2017 to November 5 2017.

Lol we hope...hopefully it's not an Mazda R9 deal!

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can't wait any longer -_-

To be fair, it could probably be edited down to maybe 10 pages if you cut the fluff.

It could be locked and deleted too :bowrofl:

Hey guys, what oil should I use in my Z35?

You'll have to wait until it comes out to RTFM.

Knowing nisserns I'll bet it'll be extra virgin olive oil

tuna oil... has protein in it. good for the car

Gotta' be sushi grade for a JDM car.

My parents used make us take cod liver oil when we kids...I don't get sick much and my engine is still running strong!