TOP Tearing issue

Merlin · 10-19-2010, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hi-Step'n370Z

I commend you on your effort!

This is something that needs to be addressed to Nissan, this is not a minimal little glitch. The top is everything regarding the appearance - and resale value of the whole car.

I have had absolutely no problem with my top in any way, but I did have the thought that the issue needed to be addressed regardless.

For those who have experienced this issue, it is has to be devastating. And to the rest of us, we just wait and wonder if it will happen to our Roadster.

Depending on the response you receive from Nissan, perhaps more of us should follow your lead, and encourage Nissan to give the matter the level of priority it deserves.

I would also like to know if this is an occasional problem, or if they all were manufactured with the same glitch that will eventually ruin the canvas on all the Z's. If so, there should be some kind of piece of mind life time warranty on the 2010's for this specific problem.

I don't want anyone to forget the problems that some have experienced with the installation of their new top because, it was not installed to look like a factory install, and were told that the fit will "wear in."

If my new Roadster was delivered to me, with the top looking like the one that was pictured on this Forum after it was replaced, I would not have accepted the car with it looking like that. If anyone needs to have a top replaced, their Z should not be delivered back to the owner looking any less than factory.

Once again vifferman, I commend you for pursuing this with Nissan. Of course, keep us posted.
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FYI, I elevated my top issue to Nissan North America a few weeks ago. I have been in discussions with one of their senior customer affairs account execs for a while as I go thru this process. I don't go out and drop major cash for a car only to have these kinds flaws occur and then have to spend an inordinate amount of time and energy screwing with it. What a headache. Anyway, when I asked about whether there are "systemic issues" across the 2010 model for tops, I did not get a straight answer, and haven't received one yet. I would encourage anyone who has a top issue to report it to Nissan at the corporate level and make it an issue. Get it on record. Dealerships will be reporting these issues too, but it is better if you report it directly yourself.

So at this point they have re-routed the wiring harness that is attached to the driver's side hatch arm and made it look like it was done this way at the factory. At least the tech tried. This has stopped the rubbing on the canvas. Now they are going to give me a new canvas top. A Nissan regional tech is going to do the replacement and I have met and talked to him. He seems very qualified and has done this before (but not on a 370Z). The canvas replacement makes me very nervous. I do NOT want to have the issues that Z_U-later had with the new canvas. I have already contacted a consumer lawyer and am in a wait-and-see mode. If the top is replaced and it looks factory installed, I will be happy and that should be the end of this issue. If it is not and this saga continues, I am going to engage on legal fronts. Like most of you, I have a job and don't have the time to keep screwing with this stuff. And we all deserve better from Nissan and the car they are selling. Stand by for more.

vifferman · 10-20-2010, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Merlin

FYI, I elevated my top issue to Nissan North America a few weeks ago. I have been in discussions with one of their senior customer affairs account execs for a while as I go thru this process. I don't go out and drop major cash for a car only to have these kinds flaws occur and then have to spend an inordinate amount of time and energy screwing with it. What a headache. Anyway, when I asked about whether there are "systemic issues" across the 2010 model for tops, I did not get a straight answer, and haven't received one yet. I would encourage anyone who has a top issue to report it to Nissan at the corporate level and make it an issue. Get it on record. Dealerships will be reporting these issues too, but it is better if you report it directly yourself.

So at this point they have re-routed the wiring harness that is attached to the driver's side hatch arm and made it look like it was done this way at the factory. At least the tech tried. This has stopped the rubbing on the canvas. Now they are going to give me a new canvas top. A Nissan regional tech is going to do the replacement and I have met and talked to him. He seems very qualified and has done this before (but not on a 370Z). The canvas replacement makes me very nervous. I do NOT want to have the issues that Z_U-later had with the new canvas. I have already contacted a consumer lawyer and am in a wait-and-see mode. If the top is replaced and it looks factory installed, I will be happy and that should be the end of this issue. If it is not and this saga continues, I am going to engage on legal fronts. Like most of you, I have a job and don't have the time to keep screwing with this stuff. And we all deserve better from Nissan and the car they are selling. Stand by for more.

Any chance you could post a pic or two of the hatch arm with the re-routed wire harness? Perhaps also a pic of the affected area on the canvas? Is the wear in the same area as Z_U_Later's tear and my indentation/crimp?

Merlin · 10-21-2010, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vifferman

Any chance you could post a pic or two of the hatch arm with the re-routed wire harness? Perhaps also a pic of the affected area on the canvas? Is the wear in the same area as Z_U_Later's tear and my indentation/crimp?

Here are some images of the top and of the hatch arm. You can see what the tech did to it (move wiring harness and taped it up). The wear mark has not worsened since they adjusted the way the wiring harness was attached to the arm. The fuzz is gone, but the mark is still there.

Parrotguy · 10-20-2010, 02:56 PM

I took delivery of my roadster at the end of May. Living in San Diego I have left the top down pretty much the whole summer. I have operated the top maybe 20 times and have no wear spot or crease but I am worried that its only because I have not been operating the top much. The hard protruding frame spot is very noticeable when you run you hand over it, and I'm also worried that because I operate the top so infrequently, the top won't be ruined until I'm out of warranty. I had planned to keep this car for a long time. The fabric inner-lining prevents us from adding some cushioning there.
I am going to send this thread to my dealer and see what they have to say. I'm wondering how many owners are having this issue and don't read this forum and/or haven't looked closely at their top.

Parrotguy · 10-21-2010, 01:49 PM

I took another look at my top in the light of the sun yesterday and noticed there is a crease there and the top is a lighter shade at the spot with the wiring harness underneath. This after using the top maybe only 20 times. I'm going to ask the dealer to re-route the wiring harness.

Parrotguy · 12-14-2010, 02:28 PM

I took my roadster in for service and asked them to move the wire harness on the top frame support, explaining to them everything on this thread and providing them with the links to this thread. I thought that was a reasonable request. They gave me the standard bs response, that until Nissan issues a warantee authorization they could not do the work under the warantee. I asked for an estimate of the cost to pay for it myself and they said they don't know, whatever that means. I'm going to have to think further about what to do. Write a letter to Nissan? - the problem there is my top is OK - what we're talking about is preventative maintenance. I may also ask a repair shop for an estimate. Meanwhile I don't like to put the top up and down more than I have to. Overall the service department, Poway Nissan, Poway CA, was inflexible, contrarian, and not customer orientated. Not particularly concerned with a happy customer.

Hi-Step'n370Z · 12-15-2010, 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Parrotguy

I took my roadster in for service and asked them to move the wire harness on the top frame support, explaining to them everything on this thread and providing them with the links to this thread. I thought that was a reasonable request. They gave me the standard bs response, that until Nissan issues a warantee authorization they could not do the work under the warantee. I asked for an estimate of the cost to pay for it myself and they said they don't know, whatever that means. I'm going to have to think further about what to do. Write a letter to Nissan? - the problem there is my top is OK - what we're talking about is preventative maintenance. I may also ask a repair shop for an estimate. Meanwhile I don't like to put the top up and down more than I have to. Overall the service department, Poway Nissan, Poway CA, was inflexible, contrarian, and not customer orientated. Not particularly concerned with a happy customer.

I can understand parrotguy's concern. This issue that has been plaguing our tops is very unnerving to say the least.

Maybe the best way to go would be to just operate the top as often as you like, and see how your particular top handles it. As a matter of fact, maybe it would be a good idea to operate it every day, even if you don't want to, just to see if your top needs the warranty repair.

IF you get an issue, Nissan has shown that they will fix it, and the latest fix seems to involve some improvements - IE: that "pivot pin" upgrade, although I don't really feel that the original pin was the culprit because of the many Roadster's that are fitted with the original pivot pin, but do not have an issue, plus, the more Nissan fixes the issue, the more they learn about how to do it to insure the best long term result.

Because of the fact that only a few tops have been affected, I still think it was an assembly glitch. That one pic of the wire trunk cable that rubbed through the top indicated to me that if your wire trunk cable was not bulging into the fabric, then you're not going to have the issue. I felt around that area and could not feel that cable, so I have to believe - at this point - that I will not have any issue with wear-through, that's just a guess, of course, but it's all I have to go on at this point.

Also, there was mention of a bent frame that caused a problem, which was either an assembly glitch, or other damage between manufacturing and delivery.

So, like it or not, we're stuck with this issue, and all we can do is to go ahead and enjoy our Roadster, and if the problem hit's us, then we go the warranty route.

Don't let this spoil your enjoyment of this great car. It's nothing that can't be handled.
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B52EWO · 12-15-2010, 08:43 AM

The dealer replaced my top yesterday.

I was told not to cycle the top for a week or so to allow the new fabric to stretch properly but of course as soon as I got home, I cycled it to see if it worked properly - it didn't. It comes up just short of reaching the top of the windshield and I can see the latches close but, of course, they're not engaged in the slots so the top doesn't pull tight. If I exert just a little force by pulling down on the top with my left hand as the top nears the closed position, it reaches the top of the windshield and closes just fine. I'll wait for the week to pass and try it again. It's possible the fabric is so taut that it's preventing the top from fully closing; at least I hope that's the case. If it doesn’t work properly, I feel certain the dealer will do the right thing - he has so far. They were told to send my old top and the struts back to Nissan for their analysis so it’s getting some attention. I asked them to take pictures but they failed to do so.

I'll send an update next week.

vifferman · 12-15-2010, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Parrotguy

I took my roadster in for service and asked them to move the wire harness on the top frame support, explaining to them everything on this thread and providing them with the links to this thread. I thought that was a reasonable request. They gave me the standard bs response, that until Nissan issues a warantee authorization they could not do the work under the warantee. I asked for an estimate of the cost to pay for it myself and they said they don't know, whatever that means. I'm going to have to think further about what to do. Write a letter to Nissan? - the problem there is my top is OK - what we're talking about is preventative maintenance. I may also ask a repair shop for an estimate. Meanwhile I don't like to put the top up and down more than I have to. Overall the service department, Poway Nissan, Poway CA, was inflexible, contrarian, and not customer orientated. Not particularly concerned with a happy customer.

Just thank your lucky stars that you don't have a problem with your top (I do, but the majority don't) and enjoy your 370ZR. Why would you want the dealer to mess with a car that has "no problem?" I don't even trust my dealer to do an oil change, so I'll wait as long as possible before I submit to the trauma of a top replacement.

jhp3 · 12-16-2010, 06:28 AM

I don't have a roadster, but I've followed this issue with great interest and have empathy for those of you having these significant problems with essentially brand new and quite costly autos. As a retired attorney, i believe this is a problem which seriously impairs the value of what you bought, not to mention the headaches and frustration of having to deal with a manufacturer and some dealerships not living up to their legal obligations under federal and probably most state laws. If you are not completely satisfied by your treatment and the results of your efforts to have this handled responsibly by Nissan and its dealers, I strongly recommend you consult with an attorney who specializes in consumer rights (hopefully with a focus on auto claims) to make sure you don't waive or otherwise adversely affect your legal rights under state or federal law. I promise you Nissan is getting legal advice and guidance as to how to avoid liability for this and minimize its economic costs to fix a problem that it is clearly responsible for.

Hi-Step'n370Z · 12-16-2010, 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jhp3

I don't have a roadster, but I've followed this issue with great interest and have empathy for those of you having these significant problems with essentially brand new and quite costly autos. As a retired attorney, i believe this is a problem which seriously impairs the value of what you bought, not to mention the headaches and frustration of having to deal with a manufacturer and some dealerships not living up to their legal obligations under federal and probably most state laws. If you are not completely satisfied by your treatment and the results of your efforts to have this handled responsibly by Nissan and its dealers, I strongly recommend you consult with an attorney who specializes in consumer rights (hopefully with a focus on auto claims) to make sure you don't waive or otherwise adversely affect your legal rights under state or federal law. I promise you Nissan is getting legal advice and guidance as to how to avoid liability for this and minimize its economic costs to fix a problem that it is clearly responsible for.

Thank you for stepping in with your expertise.

I think that the main thing here is to be sure that; "you don't waive or otherwise adversely affect your legal rights under state or federal law."

Sometimes fighting these type of battles can fatigue a person to the point of settling, or giving up all together, especially when they're in that David and Goliath type of fight.

As jhp points out, for all who become affected by this top tear issue, remember; you do have legal rights. Keep your head, stick to it and don't give up until you are satisfied. This IS a very serious issue and needs to be treated as such.

As much as it appears that Nissan and their Dealers are doing all they can to resolve this issue, you need to remember jhp's advise should you run into trouble with them down the road.

Thanks again jhp for your concern.

jhp3 · 12-16-2010, 08:55 AM

Hi-Stepin 370z: Thanks for your comments. But the main reason I'm writing back is that the Picture below your name is the best I've seen on this forum. You have good taste (in cars and women).

370Z_Fan · 12-14-2010, 04:17 PM

^^^Try a different dealership if you're not satisfied with their service.

CrownR426 · 12-23-2010, 05:31 PM

I'd never get a drop top unless its like porsche...
But I still wouldn't get it lol...
:T
Pay more, weigh more, go slower, get skin cancer doesn't seem to make sense to me...

Merlin · 12-24-2010, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrownR426

I'd never get a drop top unless its like porsche...
But I still wouldn't get it lol...
:T
Pay more, weigh more, go slower, get skin cancer doesn't seem to make sense to me...

What a very helpful opinion...LMAO! How fortunate for us you won't be joining our honored group...

12-15-2010, 08:43 AM	#8 (permalink)
B52EWO Base Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Florida Posts: 7 Drives: 2010 370Z Roadster Rep Power: 15	Update on Top Replacement The dealer replaced my top yesterday. I was told not to cycle the top for a week or so to allow the new fabric to stretch properly but of course as soon as I got home, I cycled it to see if it worked properly - it didn't. It comes up just short of reaching the top of the windshield and I can see the latches close but, of course, they're not engaged in the slots so the top doesn't pull tight. If I exert just a little force by pulling down on the top with my left hand as the top nears the closed position, it reaches the top of the windshield and closes just fine. I'll wait for the week to pass and try it again. It's possible the fabric is so taut that it's preventing the top from fully closing; at least I hope that's the case. If it doesn’t work properly, I feel certain the dealer will do the right thing - he has so far. They were told to send my old top and the struts back to Nissan for their analysis so it’s getting some attention. I asked them to take pictures but they failed to do so. I'll send an update next week.

12-23-2010, 05:31 PM	#14 (permalink)
CrownR426 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: South Korea Posts: 4,676 Drives: Manual Rep Power: 848	I'd never get a drop top unless its like porsche... But I still wouldn't get it lol... :T Pay more, weigh more, go slower, get skin cancer doesn't seem to make sense to me... __________________ Love + Hardwork + Passion RIP SVTRacer

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10-20-2010, 02:56 PM	#4 (permalink)
Parrotguy Base Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: San Diego Posts: 51 Drives: '10 Roadster Touring Rep Power: 16	I took delivery of my roadster at the end of May. Living in San Diego I have left the top down pretty much the whole summer. I have operated the top maybe 20 times and have no wear spot or crease but I am worried that its only because I have not been operating the top much. The hard protruding frame spot is very noticeable when you run you hand over it, and I'm also worried that because I operate the top so infrequently, the top won't be ruined until I'm out of warranty. I had planned to keep this car for a long time. The fabric inner-lining prevents us from adding some cushioning there. I am going to send this thread to my dealer and see what they have to say. I'm wondering how many owners are having this issue and don't read this forum and/or haven't looked closely at their top.

10-21-2010, 01:49 PM	#5 (permalink)
Parrotguy Base Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: San Diego Posts: 51 Drives: '10 Roadster Touring Rep Power: 16	I took another look at my top in the light of the sun yesterday and noticed there is a crease there and the top is a lighter shade at the spot with the wiring harness underneath. This after using the top maybe only 20 times. I'm going to ask the dealer to re-route the wiring harness.

12-14-2010, 02:28 PM	#6 (permalink)
Parrotguy Base Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: San Diego Posts: 51 Drives: '10 Roadster Touring Rep Power: 16	I took my roadster in for service and asked them to move the wire harness on the top frame support, explaining to them everything on this thread and providing them with the links to this thread. I thought that was a reasonable request. They gave me the standard bs response, that until Nissan issues a warantee authorization they could not do the work under the warantee. I asked for an estimate of the cost to pay for it myself and they said they don't know, whatever that means. I'm going to have to think further about what to do. Write a letter to Nissan? - the problem there is my top is OK - what we're talking about is preventative maintenance. I may also ask a repair shop for an estimate. Meanwhile I don't like to put the top up and down more than I have to. Overall the service department, Poway Nissan, Poway CA, was inflexible, contrarian, and not customer orientated. Not particularly concerned with a happy customer.

12-16-2010, 06:28 AM	#10 (permalink)
jhp3 Base Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Roll Tide, Alabama Posts: 34 Drives: 2010 NISMO (#0193) Rep Power: 16	I don't have a roadster, but I've followed this issue with great interest and have empathy for those of you having these significant problems with essentially brand new and quite costly autos. As a retired attorney, i believe this is a problem which seriously impairs the value of what you bought, not to mention the headaches and frustration of having to deal with a manufacturer and some dealerships not living up to their legal obligations under federal and probably most state laws. If you are not completely satisfied by your treatment and the results of your efforts to have this handled responsibly by Nissan and its dealers, I strongly recommend you consult with an attorney who specializes in consumer rights (hopefully with a focus on auto claims) to make sure you don't waive or otherwise adversely affect your legal rights under state or federal law. I promise you Nissan is getting legal advice and guidance as to how to avoid liability for this and minimize its economic costs to fix a problem that it is clearly responsible for.

12-16-2010, 08:55 AM	#12 (permalink)
jhp3 Base Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Roll Tide, Alabama Posts: 34 Drives: 2010 NISMO (#0193) Rep Power: 16	Hi-Stepin 370z: Thanks for your comments. But the main reason I'm writing back is that the Picture below your name is the best I've seen on this forum. You have good taste (in cars and women).

12-14-2010, 04:17 PM	#13 (permalink)
370Z_Fan Base Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Toronto, ON Posts: 238 Drives: 2010 MB ZR sport pkg Rep Power: 17	^^^Try a different dealership if you're not satisfied with their service.