More info on the next 370Z

b15 · 08-19-2014, 10:19 PM

Limeybastard · 08-20-2014, 12:35 AM

Americans love Hyundai's. Last time I checked this country is the biggest purchaser of Hyundais outside of S Korea.

I remember when I first came to America back in 2007, I was like WTF is with all the Sonatas and shite on the road. I couldnt come to terms with it at the time.

I never recall ever seeing an Acura in Europe when I lived there. Its all just Honda. Even the NSX was a Honda NSX.

Magic Bus · 08-20-2014, 02:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shamu

As of 2013 Infiniti brand has been sold in Japan and has been in many other countries other than US for years.

Lexus has been in many countries for years and has separate operating units design centers etc.

Far more than rebranded Toyota and Nissans . Successful strategy for both nissan and Toyota parent companies as well.

I hear you Shamu and we're splitting hairs here. Infiniti has been introduced in Japan in 2013 but the first vehicle badged as an Infiniti was sold this year. But it was sold through a Nissan outlet.

I apologize as I said Lexus started several years back but I wasn't trying to be super technical. I knew it started back in 2005 in Japan.

It was just a quick post attempting to explain b15's post, about status conscious Americans. And yes, you are totally correct, it's a very successful strategy for both.

Virtual · 08-20-2014, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Limeybastard

Americans love Hyundai's. Last time I checked this country is the biggest purchaser of Hyundais outside of S Korea.

I remember when I first came to America back in 2007, I was like WTF is with all the Sonatas and shite on the road. I couldnt come to terms with it at the time.

I never recall ever seeing an Acura in Europe when I lived there. Its all just Honda. Even the NSX was a Honda NSX.

I'd argue that Hyundai has a more exciting lineup than Acura does right now. You couldn't say that 10 years ago.

Jordo! · 08-20-2014, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Limeybastard

Americans love Hyundai's. Last time I checked this country is the biggest purchaser of Hyundais outside of S Korea.

All Hyundais come with an extra large fries and soft drink for only 85 cents more, so...

Davey · 08-20-2014, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virtual

I'd argue that Hyundai has a more exciting lineup than Acura does right now. You couldn't say that 10 years ago.

Well yeah but to be fair, Acura's lineup is awful. They have an upscale Civic, an outdated upscale Accord, a couple of ginormous boats, a few SUV's...

Drakonis GTR · 08-20-2014, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b15

I mean the reason why exists was because Americans care about status. For many people, the badge/prestige is an important part of car ownership. To some that's all that matters. When the same product is badged differently and has different marketing to target the desired demographic (those who are 'too good' for the mainstream brands), now people all of a sudden see it in a different light. It's about status. To the average (dumb) American, 'Infiniti' is more luxurious than a Nissan, even though until recently Infiniti's wore the Nissan badge outside the US. For example, take the V36. In the US it's the Infiniti G35 sedan and the rest of the world a Nissan Skyline. Put these two identical cars in front of an American and guaranteed they'll think the Infiniti is better, because that's what they've been trained to think.

Obviously as the marques have developed, the manufacturers have started to differentiate the mainstream brand more from the luxury brand, but when they were first created, they were merely dressed up versions of the mainstream vehicle sold elsewhere in the world with different marketing.

Just like people state they could 'never pay $50k' for a Hyundai.....market it as a Genesis without mention of Hyundai, and the idiots will come. Heck there's a reason why the Hyundai logo is not on any of their luxury cars....

A lot of this thinking is because America for a long time dealt only with the Big 3; GM, Ford, and Chrysler, all of which had multiple brands that were acquired over the years and then turned into the brand tiers that we are all familiar with. The low level/economy market (Chevy, Ford, Plymouth), the mid tiers (Buick, Mercury, Dodge), and the up-scale tiers (Cadillac, Lincoln, and Chrysler) all allowed them to hit each market segment and still ultimately pick up the money. Then the other countries show up, and find themselves facing competition on almost every level. Is it truly such a surprise that they would inevitably decide that if it works, why not try it?

What is funny though is your thought that only American's feel this way. A number of European companies also practice this logic within their own bases. Audi, for example, is used by Volkswagen as their up-scale, snob level brand. And, while perhaps a more extreme example, Maybach is used by Mercedes as their super up-scale Rolls Royce competitor. Even Italian Fiat does this, using Alfa Romeo and Lancia (and getting their little cut from Ferrari) to hit the higher markets while keeping their house brand at more wallet-friendly levels. One can argue that they got this attitude from the "Americans", but the fact of the matter is that it works in other countries as well. It doesn't matter as much in Japan, simply because the Japanese don't care as much about a car's name as they do about it's performance.

UNKNOWN_370 · 08-20-2014, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drakonis GTR

A lot of this thinking is because America for a long time dealt only with the Big 3; GM, Ford, and Chrysler, all of which had multiple brands that were acquired over the years and then turned into the brand tiers that we are all familiar with. The low level/economy market (Chevy, Ford, Plymouth), the mid tiers (Buick, Mercury, Dodge), and the up-scale tiers (Cadillac, Lincoln, and Chrysler) all allowed them to hit each market segment and still ultimately pick up the money. Then the other countries show up, and find themselves facing competition on almost every level. Is it truly such a surprise that they would inevitably decide that if it works, why not try it?

What is funny though is your thought that only American's feel this way. A number of European companies also practice this logic within their own bases. Audi, for example, is used by Volkswagen as their up-scale, snob level brand. And, while perhaps a more extreme example, Maybach is used by Mercedes as their super up-scale Rolls Royce competitor. Even Italian Fiat does this, using Alfa Romeo and Lancia (and getting their little cut from Ferrari) to hit the higher markets while keeping their house brand at more wallet-friendly levels. One can argue that they got this attitude from the "Americans", but the fact of the matter is that it works in other countries as well. It doesn't matter as much in Japan, simply because the Japanese don't care as much about a car's name as they do about it's performance.

Well-debated on both sides of the spectrum. Bit this point is inarguable.

Davey · 08-20-2014, 06:38 PM

Yeah, Europeans don't care about status. Serfs and knights and kings and all that crap is just some made-up stuff that they lied to you about when you were a kid.

njobe89 · 08-21-2014, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davey

Yeah, Europeans don't care about status. Serfs and knights and kings and all that crap is just some made-up stuff that they lied to you about when you were a kid.

not much difference between a king and the president here... obama does whatever he wants here much like kings did/do. until the people get tired and then overthrow them. lol

KaienZ34 · 08-21-2014, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by njobe89

not much difference between a king and the president here... obama does whatever he wants here much like kings did/do. until the people get tired and then overthrow them. lol

Where does the "people that are sick of this king shit" line start?!?

More executive orders than ALL other presidents combined, spent more money than ALL other presidents combined....The list just goes on and on, not to mention the man HATES the fuck out of America.

Cmike2780 · 08-21-2014, 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Limeybastard

Americans love Hyundai's. Last time I checked this country is the biggest purchaser of Hyundais outside of S Korea.

I remember when I first came to America back in 2007, I was like WTF is with all the Sonatas and shite on the road. I couldnt come to terms with it at the time.

I never recall ever seeing an Acura in Europe when I lived there. Its all just Honda. Even the NSX was a Honda NSX.

Up until Hyundai's recent models, I wasn't really a fan either. About 20 years ago their cars were worthless than scrap metal. I still remember my uncle's Excel that I swear I could rip apart with a butter knife. 10 years ago, their styling was terrible, but build quality was on par with some American cars. With the market collapse, people in the US started buying them because they were relatively less expensive than their counterparts and they offered a lengthy warranty compared to others (5-year bumper-to-bumper with a 10-year powertrain). That's a huge plus for most consumers. People who just needed a car to get them from A to B swallowed them up and the rest is history. This is pretty much how Nissan and Toyota gained footing in the 80's and 90's.

Word of mouth just started to spread and most of their line-up surprisingly started becoming more reliable. About 4-5 years ago, I think they really up'd the ante and came out with bolder styling and better build quality. My wife had an '04 Santa-fe which we just traded in for a new Tucson. I gotta say, I'm truly impressed with the overall improvement in build quality over her old car. It's night and day and I would honestly consider placing Hyundai on the list of companies if I were buying a new car now. I sat in a new Sonata & Santa-Fe Sport in the dealership and it was a lot nicer than what Nissan, Toyota, Mazda or Honda has to offer so far. The Genesis Coupe is still meh...but it looks like they're at least headed in the right direction. Only issue will all this is pricing. Hyundai is no longer the cheap/bargain alternative. It's definitely more in-line with other companies now and the price points show it.

The badging is used by companies to charge higher premiums for certain cars. It makes sense in the US because of the way our cars are priced. Some companies like Toyota for example, have models that overlap if they didn't separate from Lexus. Rather than cannibalizing sales from one model to another, it makes more sense to have a standalone company that offers more of a niche luxury market. This can be beneficial to companies with a large model portfolio. It also has a lot to do with being able to create costly dealerships outlets. It's why Hyundai is still on the fence about separating it's Genesis line-up. With only a 3 or so models so far, it doesn't bode well on the logistics side to construct a new network of dealerships. In the UK, the market is significantly different. They frankly have different taste when it comes to cars and more often flock to smaller cars. Luxury brands are a bit more difficult to introduce in the UK especially when you have established brands with better pedigree right next door.

Cmike2780 · 08-21-2014, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KaienZ34

Where does the "people that are sick of this king shit" line start?!?

More executive orders than ALL other presidents combined, spent more money than ALL other presidents combined....The list just goes on and on, not to mention the man HATES the fuck out of America.

Just a reminder. Read the forum rules.

edk370 · 08-21-2014, 02:35 PM

^I always thought Lark Voorhees aka Lisa Turtle was the hottest of them all.

But the Toyota, Nissan thing you wrote, I disagree with. I don't think Japanese cars ever suffered a POS car reputation in the U.S. I think their windfall was the 1970s oil crisis when people drove 8 mpg Detroit metal, and when gas prices were like 40 cents a gallon or something. Then the oil crisis happened, people with certain numbers or letters in their license plates go to visit gas stations on certain days. People in Detroit literally got baseball bats and smashed Toyotas and Hondas, blaming them for being laid off the plants...Hyundai's windfall on the other hand was due to the financial crisis i.e. 2008.

watson853 · 08-21-2014, 02:42 PM

Down south where I live people still think nissan's are POS cars, it drives me crazy. Not nearly as bad as it used to be though.

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08-19-2014, 10:19 PM	#181 (permalink)
b15 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Chicago Posts: 3,229 Drives: 4drz Rep Power: 36571	watson853 likes this.

08-20-2014, 12:35 AM	#182 (permalink)
Limeybastard A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: FL and London UK. Posts: 1,514 Drives: 2014 370Z Sport. Rep Power: 17	Americans love Hyundai's. Last time I checked this country is the biggest purchaser of Hyundais outside of S Korea. I remember when I first came to America back in 2007, I was like WTF is with all the Sonatas and shite on the road. I couldnt come to terms with it at the time. I never recall ever seeing an Acura in Europe when I lived there. Its all just Honda. Even the NSX was a Honda NSX. Last edited by Limeybastard; 08-20-2014 at 12:37 AM.

08-21-2014, 02:42 PM	#195 (permalink)
watson853 Base Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Texas Age: 38 Posts: 202 Drives: 2014 Blue T/S 7AT Rep Power: 12	More info on the next 370Z Down south where I live people still think nissan's are POS cars, it drives me crazy. Not nearly as bad as it used to be though. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

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08-20-2014, 06:38 PM	#189 (permalink)
Davey A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Indiana Posts: 3,766 Drives: '15 NISMO 6MT Rep Power: 117171	Yeah, Europeans don't care about status. Serfs and knights and kings and all that crap is just some made-up stuff that they lied to you about when you were a kid.

08-21-2014, 02:35 PM	#194 (permalink)
edk370 Enthusiast Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: So Cal Posts: 296 Drives: 09 370Z Rep Power: 12	^I always thought Lark Voorhees aka Lisa Turtle was the hottest of them all. But the Toyota, Nissan thing you wrote, I disagree with. I don't think Japanese cars ever suffered a POS car reputation in the U.S. I think their windfall was the 1970s oil crisis when people drove 8 mpg Detroit metal, and when gas prices were like 40 cents a gallon or something. Then the oil crisis happened, people with certain numbers or letters in their license plates go to visit gas stations on certain days. People in Detroit literally got baseball bats and smashed Toyotas and Hondas, blaming them for being laid off the plants...Hyundai's windfall on the other hand was due to the financial crisis i.e. 2008.