I am real curious as to why....

Ryan@Forged · 08-05-2009, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

I know it will never happen but I'd love to see the margins on certain products.

It's honestly all over the place. The higher quality parts take more R & D and require more expensive parts. This in turn usually raises the cost to the vendors and furthermore to the customer. A lot of parts there is not much margin on. However other parts it's crazy. I obviously can't disclose which parts have which margins, etc.

Robert_Nash · 08-05-2009, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZKindaGuy

I am real curious as to why the folks here accept so easily that the
3rd-party manufacturers of parts for the 350 and 370 Z's are completely overcharging for most of the intake and exhaust parts they manufacture whether they be related to NA or forced induction.

I'm curious to know how you arrived at the assumption that these manufacturers are "overcharging".

I'd like to buy ribeye steak for $0.30/lb...how dare the supermarket charge me $6.98/lb; who do they think they are anyway!

VCuomo · 08-05-2009, 06:03 PM

I'm real curious to know why you (the OP) are stating as fact that the 370Z aftermarket parts vendors are overcharging? What's the basis for that claim?

EDIT: Looks like Robert_Nash beat me to the punch!

COC · 08-05-2009, 06:18 PM

I understand where the OP is coming from. The AM parts for my 335i were insane. They did come down once multiple vendors started coming out with competitve products. Until then you will have to pay to play.

DannyGT · 08-05-2009, 08:45 PM

*posted using my mobile device*

PLEASE, PLEASE...STOP referencing/comparing the nissan world, OR ANY other
manufactures world to that of the mighty american mustang! Thats all I have heard out of your mouth is mustang this, and my friends-friends-uncles-brothers-cousin is this or that in the mustang world.

Everyone knows things are typically much cheaper in the world of american stangs/camaros/etc etc - NO ONE CARES.

However, I must say, I did believe the whole 'if it takes this much metal/r&d for this car, what are they doing to make it so special for this car that makes it that expensive'. It frusterated me to no end, but then you just accept the fact that the more expensive a car is, USUALLY parts get more expensive too. It sucks...

But, I have to ask, have you ever been in or around anything other than a mustang?? For someone who claims they've been doing this (mod's) for 20+ years - you seem really surprised/naive to find that things are more expensive for other manufactures, specifically as the price of the car goes up?!?

I mean, the guy who owns a 911 GT3...Do you think he cares to pay 10k for a titanium exhaust after he has already spent 100k+ on the car? It scales man, it scales...

Am I missing something??

RCZ · 08-05-2009, 10:23 PM

No, you're right. The more expensive the car, the more owners are willing/able to pay for parts. However, because someone is willing/able to pay for something, it alone does not justify an inflated price. Just because I understand, it doesn't mean I agree. I think paying 5k for a piece of pipe is the most ridiculous.

As far as the Mustang thing goes, I agree, but I'm keeping myself out of this one.

355890 · 08-05-2009, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RCZ

No, you're right. The more expensive the car, the more owners are willing/able to pay for parts. However, because someone is willing/able to pay for something, it alone does not justify an inflated price. Just because I understand, it doesn't mean I agree. I think paying 5k for a piece of pipe is the most ridiculous.

As far as the Mustang thing goes, I agree, but I'm keeping myself out of this one.

I agree 110%

kannibul · 08-05-2009, 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zZSportZz

I always wondered why a stainless dual exhaust for my Titan which is 3 times as big costs half as much......

Someone explain that to me? Not like the Titan is that popular.

Pricing is probably partially based on how many projected sales they think they can get to recoupe costs associated with designing it, and the intended market.

That, and the more-than-likely demographic of the buyer of the vehicle, the vehicles typical cost...those factor I'm sure...along with how often a model changes.

m4a1mustang · 08-05-2009, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryan@Forged

It's honestly all over the place. The higher quality parts take more R & D and require more expensive parts. This in turn usually raises the cost to the vendors and furthermore to the customer. A lot of parts there is not much margin on. However other parts it's crazy. I obviously can't disclose which parts have which margins, etc.

Yeah, I understand that for sure. I kind of have an idea on what the margins would be like. Being in finance I just really, really want to know for certain though.

ZKindaGuy · 08-06-2009, 12:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DannyGT

*posted using my mobile device*

PLEASE, PLEASE...STOP referencing/comparing the nissan world, OR ANY other
manufactures world to that of the mighty american mustang! Thats all I have heard out of your mouth is mustang this, and my friends-friends-uncles-brothers-cousin is this or that in the mustang world.

Everyone knows things are typically much cheaper in the world of american stangs/camaros/etc etc - NO ONE CARES.

However, I must say, I did believe the whole 'if it takes this much metal/r&d for this car, what are they doing to make it so special for this car that makes it that expensive'. It frusterated me to no end, but then you just accept the fact that the more expensive a car is, USUALLY parts get more expensive too. It sucks...

But, I have to ask, have you ever been in or around anything other than a mustang?? For someone who claims they've been doing this (mod's) for 20+ years - you seem really surprised/naive to find that things are more expensive for other manufactures, specifically as the price of the car goes up?!?

I mean, the guy who owns a 911 GT3...Do you think he cares to pay 10k for a titanium exhaust after he has already spent 100k+ on the car? It scales man, it scales...

Am I missing something??

And no I am not surprised or naive in the least bit. I just happen to have witnessed that in the last 15 years the US consumer has gotten dumber and dumber with each passing year and has cast off the buying power they once possessed......all because the need to "gotta have it so I can be BMOC" has completely beaten into oblivion common sense and consumer bargaining savvy.

As long as US consumers keep just handing over rediculous amounts of cash to the carpetbagging manufacturers these rediculous prices are going to continue skyrocketing upward.

And to those who cite that it is all a matter of "supply and demand" then to those folks I say you only have 1/2 of the intended understanding of that principle. The law of supply and demand is a two way street. It's function isn't just to favor the manufacturer which the US consumers apparently only seem to understand with the senseless overpaying they do.

It also works the other way as well.....the consumer doesn't have to wait until he / she is broke to stop buying product. The principle can also be exercised by consumers refusing to buy the overpriced product so that the manufacturers inventory stockpiles as a result of stagnant sales.

If folks wouldn't just jump at every new product put on the market the moment it hits the shelf at the MSRP price-point and rather instead just learn to be patient and ignore the stuff, that crap will stockpile real quick and drive the prices way down.

But no...BMOC ego and the obssessive compulsive pathetic infantile need to always one-up the next guy is the only thing that is the focus of the American consumer anymore....nothing like the proverbial selling of your soul to the Great Imposter.

need4speed · 08-06-2009, 02:47 AM

I'm not a mechanic. But I have shelled out a lot of money on mod parts for cars over the years. N wat I can tell u is this much.
NO THEY DON'T FIGURE since u bought a 30k car u can afford a lil more. That's not it at all. N no u
Dual intakes don't call for that much of a premium. N its not cuz nissan is almost an infiniti. Lol. Lol
You people are funny for real.
The Z is the only "2 seat hard top true sports coupe". Let me stress that again for the purists, mechanical engineers n others that luv to argue. The Z is the only 2 seat hard top true sports car in a 30 to 40k price range. 2+2 are gt cars. Convertibles have a different driving dynamic from coupes. So cars that we pretend to be competition like bmw Z4 n Z8, Honda S2000, mazda rx8 pontiac solstice. All either fall into the gt performance meaning 2+2 or gt roadsters which mean topless sports.
Again this is a whole seperate driving experience altogether.
NOW, because the Z has no competition in within 5k of its top price. The bimmer starts at 45k n the cayman at 60k and lotus 50k. this leaves NISSAN the sole proprietor of the "AFFORDABLE TRUE SPORTS CAR." the whole 900 to 600 in 10 years is bogus. I seen body kits go from 1600 to 400 in 5 years.
I seen intakes go from 399 to 199 in 1 year.
The Z can afford to jack prices n hold out on dropping prices cuz there is no competition. See how the car magazines struggle to find a real comparo car. They can't. So they use the cayman and mustang as comparison cars.
Totally unfair. The porsche costs 35k to build. The Z costs right around 18k to build.(before options) Its gonna be more refined. The mustang is a total gt. Not fair.
Anyway... point is. The exclusivity of the car type brings up cost and its bogus imho.
But ur stuck between a rock n a hardplace. If u holdout? Aftermarket won't produce many parts. If u buy u get more parts for cars. 1st year modders get raped. Cuz they have to pay forinitial r&d cost recovery. Once that's paid off. Prices go down.
I got chewed out here by a couple of fruits one time for saying 1st year mods are way to expensive n the companies rape your pockets. Lol. Guys were crying like they own stillen stock or somethin. I modded 6 cars and the price trend is the same. High on 1st year. Just like defects on cars are highest on 1st year models. This is a fact. You can use kelly blue book, true delta or any car mag. They will tell u 1st year buyers are guinea pigs to the function n reliabilty of the cars. If u buy a 1st year car? Its best to buy in the 3rd quarter...
My question is... do u guys really race? Or do u mod to say I did it First? Or is it u just wanna be text book racers that picked up a lot of mod terminology then come on here n make people think u can drive those cars you own by having a slight edge on technical terminologies n crap.
More important than mods is having the skill to control a car like this
Hone the skill

Plasmaball · 08-06-2009, 02:51 AM

A person can own an expensive car and still be cheap.

need4speed · 08-06-2009, 03:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZKindaGuy

And no I am not surprised or naive in the least bit. I just happen to have witnessed that in the last 15 years the US consumer has gotten dumber and dumber with each passing year and has cast off the buying power they once possessed......all because the need to "gotta have it so I can be BMOC" has completely beaten into oblivion common sense and consumer bargaining savvy.

As long as US consumers keep just handing over rediculous amounts of cash to the carpetbagging manufacturers these rediculous prices are going to continue skyrocketing upward.

And to those who cite that it is all a matter of "supply and demand" then to those folks I say you only have 1/2 of the intended understanding of that principle. The law of supply and demand is a two way street. It's function isn't just to favor the manufacturer which the US consumers apparently only seem to understand with the senseless overpaying they do.

It also works the other way as well.....the consumer doesn't have to wait until he / she is broke to stop buying product. The principle can also be exercised by consumers refusing to buy the overpriced product so that the manufacturers inventory stockpiles as a result of stagnant sales.

If folks wouldn't just jump at every new product put on the market the moment it hits the shelf at the MSRP price-point and rather instead just learn to be patient and ignore the stuff, that crap will stockpile real quick and drive the prices way down.

But no...BMOC ego and the obssessive compulsive pathetic infantile need to always one-up the next guy is the only thing that is the focus of the American consumer anymore....nothing like the proverbial selling of your soul to the Great Imposter.

Bud the group that's hitting u now has there own agenda. The more u try to make them understand where u comin from the more they gonna treat u like ur the idiot.
This forum is a cool place if ur just trying to learn from other peoples mistakes on the 1st year model or if u need tips on performing a mod from one of the "real seasoned tuners".
These guys are bringing this hybrid mustang/bimmer mentality into the import tuner culture.
I c ur point n only 5% will. Lol
Its this one sided mentality on this forum that is the tip of the iceberg of american close mindedness. This is why the world hates us. Arrogance and the constant need to belittle the next man to feel better about oneself. Instead of seeing ur point. Ur naive. Oh u expect too much. Like how dumb is that. If u look at the full spectrum of wat this man is saying. He's right. Jeeeez! N he's not stating opinions he stating facts. With an opinion as a sub context. Not vice versa like the rest of u guys.

armensti · 08-06-2009, 03:28 AM

paying 2 k for an exhaust for me is to much why? because its just 6-7 feet of pipes welded together. im sure it doesnt cost more then 10% of the price to manufacture the part.

Ryan@Forged · 08-06-2009, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by need4speed

I'm not a mechanic. But I have shelled out a lot of money on mod parts for cars over the years. N wat I can tell u is this much.
NO THEY DON'T FIGURE since u bought a 30k car u can afford a lil more. That's not it at all. N no u
Dual intakes don't call for that much of a premium. N its not cuz nissan is almost an infiniti. Lol. Lol
You people are funny for real.
The Z is the only "2 seat hard top true sports coupe". Let me stress that again for the purists, mechanical engineers n others that luv to argue. The Z is the only 2 seat hard top true sports car in a 30 to 40k price range. 2+2 are gt cars. Convertibles have a different driving dynamic from coupes. So cars that we pretend to be competition like bmw Z4 n Z8, Honda S2000, mazda rx8 pontiac solstice. All either fall into the gt performance meaning 2+2 or gt roadsters which mean topless sports.
Again this is a whole seperate driving experience altogether.
NOW, because the Z has no competition in within 5k of its top price. The bimmer starts at 45k n the cayman at 60k and lotus 50k. this leaves NISSAN the sole proprietor of the "AFFORDABLE TRUE SPORTS CAR." the whole 900 to 600 in 10 years is bogus. I seen body kits go from 1600 to 400 in 5 years.
I seen intakes go from 399 to 199 in 1 year.
The Z can afford to jack prices n hold out on dropping prices cuz there is no competition. See how the car magazines struggle to find a real comparo car. They can't. So they use the cayman and mustang as comparison cars.
Totally unfair. The porsche costs 35k to build. The Z costs right around 18k to build.(before options) Its gonna be more refined. The mustang is a total gt. Not fair.
Anyway... point is. The exclusivity of the car type brings up cost and its bogus imho.
But ur stuck between a rock n a hardplace. If u holdout? Aftermarket won't produce many parts. If u buy u get more parts for cars. 1st year modders get raped. Cuz they have to pay forinitial r&d cost recovery. Once that's paid off. Prices go down.
I got chewed out here by a couple of fruits one time for saying 1st year mods are way to expensive n the companies rape your pockets. Lol. Guys were crying like they own stillen stock or somethin. I modded 6 cars and the price trend is the same. High on 1st year. Just like defects on cars are highest on 1st year models. This is a fact. You can use kelly blue book, true delta or any car mag. They will tell u 1st year buyers are guinea pigs to the function n reliabilty of the cars. If u buy a 1st year car? Its best to buy in the 3rd quarter...
My question is... do u guys really race? Or do u mod to say I did it First? Or is it u just wanna be text book racers that picked up a lot of mod terminology then come on here n make people think u can drive those cars you own by having a slight edge on technical terminologies n crap.
More important than mods is having the skill to control a car like this
Hone the skill

There's so much misinformation in this post I woudn't even know where to start. If you think the Z is an exclusive sports car in which manufactures are taking advantage of the owners... you need to take another look.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Plasmaball

A person can own an expensive car and still be cheap.

Absolutely. I have seen it done over and over.

Quote:

Originally Posted by need4speed

Bud the group that's hitting u now has there own agenda. The more u try to make them understand where u comin from the more they gonna treat u like ur the idiot.
This forum is a cool place if ur just trying to learn from other peoples mistakes on the 1st year model or if u need tips on performing a mod from one of the "real seasoned tuners".
These guys are bringing this hybrid mustang/bimmer mentality into the import tuner culture.
I c ur point n only 5% will. Lol
Its this one sided mentality on this forum that is the tip of the iceberg of american close mindedness. This is why the world hates us. Arrogance and the constant need to belittle the next man to feel better about oneself. Instead of seeing ur point. Ur naive. Oh u expect too much. Like how dumb is that. If u look at the full spectrum of wat this man is saying. He's right. Jeeeez! N he's not stating opinions he stating facts. With an opinion as a sub context. Not vice versa like the rest of u guys.

I don't see how you come to your conclusions. What agenda do you think everyone in this thread has? Do you think the majority of the members on this forum prefer to pay more money and are trying to justify themselves? Nobody is trying to make the OP feel like an idiot. The point that was trying to be made is that prices are not overpriced like the OP is claiming.

Quote:

Originally Posted by armensti

paying 2 k for an exhaust for me is to much why? because its just 6-7 feet of pipes welded together. im sure it doesnt cost more then 10% of the price to manufacture the part.

Where I see your viewpoint on this matter I can assure you it costs significantly more than you think to manufacture such a part. The margins are nowhere near that range. Take in to consideration R&D, material costs, pruduction costs, and shipping.

08-05-2009, 08:45 PM	#20 (permalink)
DannyGT Track Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Jersey Posts: 919 Drives: 370Z (SOLD) Rep Power: 279	posted using my mobile device PLEASE, PLEASE...STOP referencing/comparing the nissan world, OR ANY other manufactures world to that of the mighty american mustang! Thats all I have heard out of your mouth is mustang this, and my friends-friends-uncles-brothers-cousin is this or that in the mustang world. Everyone knows things are typically much cheaper in the world of american stangs/camaros/etc etc - NO ONE CARES. However, I must say, I did believe the whole 'if it takes this much metal/r&d for this car, what are they doing to make it so special for this car that makes it that expensive'. It frusterated me to no end, but then you just accept the fact that the more expensive a car is, USUALLY parts get more expensive too. It sucks... But, I have to ask, have you ever been in or around anything other than a mustang?? For someone who claims they've been doing this (mod's) for 20+ years - you seem really surprised/naive to find that things are more expensive for other manufactures, specifically as the price of the car goes up?!? I mean, the guy who owns a 911 GT3...Do you think he cares to pay 10k for a titanium exhaust after he has already spent 100k+ on the car? It scales man, it scales... Am I missing something?? __________________ Performance GTM Stage 1 SC, GTM Res.Test Pipes, Invidia Gemini Exhaust, GTM HD Oil Cooler Wheels & Suspension AME Tracer TM02's 19x9.5F 19x10.5R w/ 265x35F & 305x30R, Hotchkis Sways, BC (BR) Racing Coilovers (Car Sold)

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08-05-2009, 06:03 PM	#18 (permalink)
VCuomo Track Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: SoCal Posts: 887 Drives: BMW 335i Sport Rep Power: 17	I'm real curious to know why you (the OP) are stating as fact that the 370Z aftermarket parts vendors are overcharging? What's the basis for that claim? EDIT: Looks like Robert_Nash beat me to the punch!

08-05-2009, 06:18 PM	#19 (permalink)
COC Base Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 2 Drives: 335i Rep Power: 16	I understand where the OP is coming from. The AM parts for my 335i were insane. They did come down once multiple vendors started coming out with competitve products. Until then you will have to pay to play.

08-05-2009, 10:23 PM	#21 (permalink)
RCZ A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Miami Posts: 6,403 Drives: '09 370Z Rep Power: 1119	No, you're right. The more expensive the car, the more owners are willing/able to pay for parts. However, because someone is willing/able to pay for something, it alone does not justify an inflated price. Just because I understand, it doesn't mean I agree. I think paying 5k for a piece of pipe is the most ridiculous. As far as the Mustang thing goes, I agree, but I'm keeping myself out of this one.

08-06-2009, 02:47 AM	#26 (permalink)
need4speed Base Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: tx Posts: 199 Drives: 08 altima 3.5se Rep Power: 16	I'm not a mechanic. But I have shelled out a lot of money on mod parts for cars over the years. N wat I can tell u is this much. NO THEY DON'T FIGURE since u bought a 30k car u can afford a lil more. That's not it at all. N no u Dual intakes don't call for that much of a premium. N its not cuz nissan is almost an infiniti. Lol. Lol You people are funny for real. The Z is the only "2 seat hard top true sports coupe". Let me stress that again for the purists, mechanical engineers n others that luv to argue. The Z is the only 2 seat hard top true sports car in a 30 to 40k price range. 2+2 are gt cars. Convertibles have a different driving dynamic from coupes. So cars that we pretend to be competition like bmw Z4 n Z8, Honda S2000, mazda rx8 pontiac solstice. All either fall into the gt performance meaning 2+2 or gt roadsters which mean topless sports. Again this is a whole seperate driving experience altogether. NOW, because the Z has no competition in within 5k of its top price. The bimmer starts at 45k n the cayman at 60k and lotus 50k. this leaves NISSAN the sole proprietor of the "AFFORDABLE TRUE SPORTS CAR." the whole 900 to 600 in 10 years is bogus. I seen body kits go from 1600 to 400 in 5 years. I seen intakes go from 399 to 199 in 1 year. The Z can afford to jack prices n hold out on dropping prices cuz there is no competition. See how the car magazines struggle to find a real comparo car. They can't. So they use the cayman and mustang as comparison cars. Totally unfair. The porsche costs 35k to build. The Z costs right around 18k to build.(before options) Its gonna be more refined. The mustang is a total gt. Not fair. Anyway... point is. The exclusivity of the car type brings up cost and its bogus imho. But ur stuck between a rock n a hardplace. If u holdout? Aftermarket won't produce many parts. If u buy u get more parts for cars. 1st year modders get raped. Cuz they have to pay forinitial r&d cost recovery. Once that's paid off. Prices go down. I got chewed out here by a couple of fruits one time for saying 1st year mods are way to expensive n the companies rape your pockets. Lol. Guys were crying like they own stillen stock or somethin. I modded 6 cars and the price trend is the same. High on 1st year. Just like defects on cars are highest on 1st year models. This is a fact. You can use kelly blue book, true delta or any car mag. They will tell u 1st year buyers are guinea pigs to the function n reliabilty of the cars. If u buy a 1st year car? Its best to buy in the 3rd quarter... My question is... do u guys really race? Or do u mod to say I did it First? Or is it u just wanna be text book racers that picked up a lot of mod terminology then come on here n make people think u can drive those cars you own by having a slight edge on technical terminologies n crap. More important than mods is having the skill to control a car like this Hone the skill

08-06-2009, 02:51 AM	#27 (permalink)
Plasmaball Base Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: San Diego Posts: 113 Drives: 6sp PG 370z Rep Power: 16	A person can own an expensive car and still be cheap.

08-06-2009, 03:28 AM	#29 (permalink)
armensti Enthusiast Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: CA Posts: 447 Drives: 370Z/Tring/Spt/6MT Rep Power: 16	paying 2 k for an exhaust for me is to much why? because its just 6-7 feet of pipes welded together. im sure it doesnt cost more then 10% of the price to manufacture the part.