Is the Z NOT a tuner friendly car?

BigT · 04-22-2013, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mike12002us

I wouldnt say it runs cirlces around the Z.

Sports Car Comparison - 2011 Nissan 370Z vs. 2011 Mitsubishi Lancer Evo GSR - Road & Track

You're more bi-polar than I am. We are talking modified cars here.

Evo's make great drag cars, auto-x cars, and road coarse car. I don't see any shop actively trying to compete with a Z in any of those categories outside of Doran Racing.

I think some of you are just posting in this thread to derail my point instead of understanding what i'm trying to say.

ZMan8 · 04-22-2013, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigT

Sorry to bring this topic up, but i've been thinking about it a lot lately and its kind of pissing me off. I really love my car and I want it to be the best. BUT, our cars are slow. I'm not talking about stock for stock, as it is a decent contender stock (+oil cooler?), but rather as a performance car. I'm realizing more and more that the Z is more of a GT car than a sports car. Its smooth, looks sexy, and is down right the biggest attention getter on the road, this side of a supercar. But, who wants a stock car?Please explain how you came to that conclusion. What is your definition of a sports car exactly? what is your definition of slow? Compared to a GTR, sure it's slow. But compared to its closest competitors it holds its own, modded or unmodded. Last I checked its a very capable car that requires little work (suspension, brake/oil cooling) to be an excellent race car. Just looked at the teams that race 370z and still have the 3.7 NA motor. If you're comparing it to Evo's pushing 1000 WHP that owners spent 50K on, your point is lost. Those are NOT tuner cars because realistically they are pointless on the street. Those type of cars are professionally built cars for purpose of racing.

The manual trans for example, is smooth, but quirky and cannot be shifted fast.That's driver dependent, not the car And, don't get me started on the clutch hydraulic system. SRM is a joy, but downshifting is only a part of the puzzle. The Auto guys seem to do well, if thats your thing. But, it will never be like a superior twin clutch trans and it will blow if you give it more than NA power.it's a 30K affordable sports car, not a 90k porsche

The VVEL, oh the VVEL. This is the best and worst part of this car. GREAT, if you want to keep a stock car. Real shitty from a tuner stand point. I hope Ecutek holds true to its control. Otherwise, we will all put down less power with FI than the HR motors unless we can figure something out. I assume you're aware Nissan was forced to make the Z more fuel efficient. VVEL is fine for a "street" car with a stock motor. If you build the motor, swap vvel out.

I'm just ranting at this point. There is a lot I can say, but it might not be worth it. Some can say to sell the car and get something else, but I cant. There is something about this car. Its such a joy. I fills a great void considering I can't afford a porsche or the like. HOWEVER, it is not a tuner car at all. Evo's, Sti's, and even the BRZ/FRS are leaps and beyonds ahead of the Z in that aspect. I guess, i'm just pissed because I realize that now. Still do not get why you believe a brz is more of a "tuner" car. Sti/evo is mute point because turbo cars respond completely different to bolt on mods.

Sorry for the rant.

See in red above

Cmike2780 · 04-22-2013, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigT

Its tough for me to explain it seems. lol

My evo X had 370whp, bolt ons and tune only. My evo 8 had 420 whp with a small 20g turbo. My DSM also had 400whp with a 20g turbo. All built and tuned by myself. Those cars responded so well to mods, handled and drove so FUN. Also, they were great starting platforms. Go to any auto-x, road coarse, or drag strip and these cars can compete with the best of them.

Now, I wanted something new to start with. Part out and trade in my last evo, the 8, and purchased a Z. This is just slightly over a year ago. The Z is a great car. I truelly enjoy it, more than just for its performance. The motor is so smooth. The ride is surprisingly very good. (try driving an Evo or STI, the Z is a BMW compared to those) The car is fantastic. It even gets great gas mileage. I'm contemplating keeping this car for a while, a long while.

I'm getting married in September. I have an appointment with Ignition Motorsports to install a Stillen supercharger in October. But, now i'm wondering if its even worth it. A stock turbo Evo will run circles around this car. The Z performs WELL in so many ways, but it does nothing GREATLY.

I've come to this conclusion. I either need to get my priorities straight and decide what I want from this car. Or move on.

Proof?

If you're gunning for big gains, the Stillen won't cut it. You need to go with a twin turbo setup. You're also comparing a car design to be NA to a car designed with turbos from the factory. From someone with your experience, it shouldn't be that difficult to understand how the Evo is more receptive to breather mods. Also, by your account, I thought whp numbers and dynos didn't matter?

BigT · 04-22-2013, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cmike2780

Proof?

If you're gunning for big gains, the Stillen won't cut it. You need to go with a twin turbo setup. You're also comparing a car design to be NA to a car designed with turbos from the factory. From someone with your experience, it shouldn't be that difficult to understand how the Evo is more receptive to breather mods. Also, by your account, I thought whp numbers and dynos didn't matter?

Touche! But, I owned those cars and actively had fun with them on racetracks. I didn't come in this thread to post their dyno graphs. I can compare the real life because i've experienced both cars.

Drex · 04-22-2013, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigT

Its tough for me to explain it seems. lol

My evo X had 370whp, bolt ons and tune only. My evo 8 had 420 whp with a small 20g turbo. My DSM also had 400whp with a 20g turbo. All built and tuned by myself. Those cars responded so well to mods, handled and drove so FUN. Also, they were great starting platforms. Go to any auto-x, road coarse, or drag strip and these cars can compete with the best of them.

Now, I wanted something new to start with. Part out and trade in my last evo, the 8, and purchased a Z. This is just slightly over a year ago. The Z is a great car. I truelly enjoy it, more than just for its performance. The motor is so smooth. The ride is surprisingly very good. (try driving an Evo or STI, the Z is a BMW compared to those) The car is fantastic. It even gets great gas mileage. I'm contemplating keeping this car for a while, a long while.

I'm getting married in September. I have an appointment with Ignition Motorsports to install a Stillen supercharger in October. But, now i'm wondering if its even worth it. A stock turbo Evo will run circles around this car. The Z performs WELL in so many ways, but it does nothing GREATLY.

I've come to this conclusion. I either need to get my priorities straight and decide what I want from this car. Or move on.

so the problem is factory FI vs NA and the ease of power gains with FI vs NA?

mike12002us · 04-22-2013, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigT

A stock turbo Evo will run circles around this car.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigT

You're more bi-polar than I am. We are talking modified cars here.

Evo's make great drag cars, auto-x cars, and road coarse car. I don't see any shop actively trying to compete with a Z in any of those categories outside of Doran Racing.

I think some of you are just posting in this thread to derail my point instead of understanding what i'm trying to say.

You brought up the stock part, I responded.

diddy535 · 04-22-2013, 01:34 PM

Ibtl

BigT · 04-22-2013, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZMan8

See in red above

Good points! Some cars are just better platforms than others. Like I said before, my issue seems to be with my priorities.

Haboob · 04-22-2013, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cmike2780

Proof?

No dyno sheets, those don't mean anything.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cmike2780

If you're gunning for big gains, the Stillen won't cut it. You need to go with a twin turbo setup. You're also comparing a car design to be NA to a car designed with turbos from the factory. From someone with your experience, it shouldn't be that difficult to understand how the Evo is more receptive to breather mods. Also, by your account, I thought whp numbers and dynos didn't matter?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drex

so the problem is factory FI vs NA and the ease of power gains with FI vs NA?

/thread

That's what it sounds like.

As Zman (and others above) have said, FI responds so much more to bolt-ons than NA.

It's almost comparing apples to oranges.

BigT · 04-22-2013, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drex

so the problem is factory FI vs NA and the ease of power gains with FI vs NA?

If the Z was factory FI, that would be SWEET! Tell them to ditch the VVEL too.

theDreamer · 04-22-2013, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigT

You're more bi-polar than I am. We are talking modified cars here.

Evo's make great drag cars, auto-x cars, and road coarse car. I don't see any shop actively trying to compete with a Z in any of those categories outside of Doran Racing.

I think some of you are just posting in this thread to derail my point instead of understanding what i'm trying to say.

Have you even tried to research this car or just upset you miss your turbo?
Look up Fast Intentions, GTM, Boosted Performance, AAM, Z1, etc.

1/4 mile:
official 1/4 mile track times

Quote:

FORCED INDUCTION
1) SharpByCoop --GTM TT S2-- 08 G37S coupe 5AT 11.130 @ 123.93 mph 1.677 60ft DR
2) TerribleONE ------FI TT-- 10 Tour ----- 6MT 11.493 @ 124.32 mph 1.766 60ft ET street

Auto-X most members do not really post much on this forum. There are a good 5-7 Houston members who compete very highly in the local/regional Auto-X but never post here.

Track, spend some time in here: Track / Autocross / Drifting / Dragstrip - Nissan 370Z Forum
Have some great members like Sphon, Wstar, Mike, Travis, etc who are funding themselves & building great track cars. Most are N/A currently and pushing the limits of the chassis and a few are making the jump to boost finally. We will start seeing realistic limits of this car under heavy modifications.

Honestly it sounds like you miss the "big" gains from a factory turbo car, which honestly is going to be any factory turbo car. I see the new ecoboost (turbo) F150 by Ford & people throw on a new intake and pick up 30whp. With a N/A car it will require more work because the car is tuned out most of the way from factory, and honestly if you care so much about racing. Take the car stock to a track first, it will be completely different than any AWD car you have driven. Weight distribution, AWD v RWD, V6 N/A motor, learn to drive the car factory & then start to add mods where you need them to fulfill your racing needs.

theDreamer · 04-22-2013, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigT

If the Z was factory FI, that would be SWEET! Tell them to ditch the VVEL too.

The VVEL system will be the way modern cars go, it is early so there are some kinks (think direct injection) but having the ability to electronically control the intake cam is huge. Can easily just dial in your needs with a tune without having to swap out parts.

Haboob · 04-22-2013, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigT

If the Z was factory FI, that would be SWEET! Tell them to ditch the VVEL too.

I miss boost, oh how I do, but I'm quite enjoying NA as well with the Z.

It's kind of like real boobs vs. plastic, paid for ones. Natural just feels... proper, but both are fun.

JARblue · 04-22-2013, 01:41 PM

My Z is very friendly to tuners. In fact, the Z has a date with one next week. I overheard their phone call, and she was very polite

Haboob · 04-22-2013, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JARblue

My Z is very friendly to tuners. In fact, the Z has a date with one next week. I overheard their phone call, and she was very polite

Mine hasn't quite been the proper wingman yet.

04-22-2013, 01:34 PM	#37 (permalink)
diddy535 Track Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 789 Drives: '09 370Z RAE 6MT Rep Power: 14	Ibtl __________________ ( Click to show/hide ) http://www.the370z.com/members-370z-...ys-thread.html

04-22-2013, 01:41 PM	#44 (permalink)
JARblue A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Austin, TX Age: 43 Posts: 36,450 Drives: 11 Z34, 98 E36 M3 Rep Power: 2684440	My Z is very friendly to tuners. In fact, the Z has a date with one next week. I overheard their phone call, and she was very polite XwChriswX, Haboob and CDepp like this. __________________ 2011 370Z 6MT Sport Gun Metallic \| ARC \| CJM \| Ecutek \| FI \| Fujimura \| R2C \| SPL \| Stillen \| TWM \| Z1 \| ZSpeed \|

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