Track Vs. Street

Eagle

Yeah sure piece of cake, wait...how many of us have $100k - $200k to spend on a car we're not going to drive very often?

cossie1600

People with that much modifications on their cars often let it sit anyway

m4a1mustang

What's the best way to make a small fortune racing?





Start with a big one.

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Eagle

Dis is true. Wish I had the fortune to make it happen. Perhaps one day in the not too distant future.


Sad but true. It's a waste in my opinion to do that to any car whether exotic or modified.

Eagle

Do you mean 30 hours to do a rebuild or 30 hours of racing in between rebuilds?

theDreamer

Best bet with that Porsche car is to go in with a shop or build a reliable team behind it, with some good sponsors to help cut costs. Going big can return some good rewards but need to prepare across the board, just buying the car is not enough. Need a team to support the car, sponsors to help provide wear parts (tires, brakes, etc.) or low cost, and more.

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Spikuh

Pretty sure he means that racing is mostly a money pit and not a way to make cash.

It reads that an engine rebuilds takes 30 hours. To me anyway.

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theDreamer

That is the way I see it also, 30 hours to rebuild the motor.
Then again, it could be 30 hours of run time at that higher output. Depending on the race length that could be a few races or 1-2 long endurance races.

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Eagle

I understood the same, I guess I was just expressing how I wish I could throw my money into racing without worrying about it much and just enjoy the sport. But I've got bills to pay like most people. So...yeah.

Thanks for your input on the engine rebuild question, was just looking for clarification there.

Given your answer and that of the others, how long would you say this engine could run between rebuilds?

I've heard of professional race teams rebuilding after each race regardless of the length/distance.

XiP

tracking means lots of sponsor and brand stickers

why do people who drive their car around on streets put stickers on their cars? if you don't track it then it makes you look like a tool/poser

note i'm not talking about my child is an honor student type stickers, i'm talking about stuff like nismo, TRD, etc

theDreamer

They want people to know they bought X item and are cooler than you.
There are some people who drive on the street who have sponsors & go to shows and have to have the stickers.

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Rusty

The way I read it. It's 30 hours of run time. So every 30 hours. It needs rebuilt. That seems about right. Don't forget, you're talking about an engine living at 9,000 rpm for most of it's life.

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BGTV8

You are correct - full race-spec engine life is measured in engine running hours.

For instance, Carillo rods in my race car engine (5-litre aluminium block V8, makes ~530 hp @ 6800rpm) are lifed at 80 hours. Time between short rebuild (bascially rings and bearings for the short, plus service for heads) is 35 hours, so every second re-build I need to replace the rods, same for pistons.

Fasteners get replaced each major rebuild (rod bolts, main cap studs and nuts, head studs, yadda yadda).

The alternative is you break a rod and cut the block in half and junk a $40K engine.

Crank is steel and lasts 2 major rebuilds.

Rocker gear gets replaced every major rebuild, valve springs and retainers every minor - my cam runs 600 thou lift at the seat and seat pressures to avoid valve to piston interference are substantial, which means cam wear is significant ... it just goes on and on ...

A full race engine is a marvellous thing, but is an expensive beast.

That said, assembly time for a minor rebuild is still around a day and a half and a major, where everything needs to be measued and involves a dummy assembly can be more than 2 days, and assumes someone has done the cylinder head overhaul (reface valves, recut seats etc).

Never let anyone tell you a race-spec engine is cheap. I;ve done the numbers on a race-standard 4.0 litre VQ build and you'd not get change out of $45K given the need for dry-sump, at least 14.5:1 on E85 to make torque at 7000+rpm (which is where the power is), a steel crank, good rods and pistons, a pair of trick heads, lumpy cams with at least 550 thou lift at the seat (assuming you get rid of the VVEL - which has no place on a race engine IMHO) and individual throttle bodies like the Jenvey stuff from the UK.

Such an engine would make comfortably in excess of 500 hp but would require a close-ratio gearbox to make it work, and engine life between 25-30 hours.

So, when I talk about 30 hour engine life - that is the time between rebuilds ....

30 hours of engine run time should give you a season ... in my case, because I don't run the national series and our state-based race series runs shorter events (bascially 20 minute sprint races), if I am careful, I get 2 seasons between minor rebuilds, but the supposed minro rebuild this past Christmas discovered 9 thou piston to bore clearance at the bottom of the bore, so the block was junk ... a $4500 bill .... gets expensive real quick .....

In the Australia GT series for instance, there are 8 race meetings per year, with most events offering 2 x 20-minute practise sessions, a quali-session and 2 30-minute races, with 2 major events involving a 30-minute sprint and a 1-hour race, plus the 12 hour in Feb. you plan on 2 hours per meeting, plus the 12-hour which (roughly) uses your engine life between rebuilds in a season.

Most semi-professional teams will carry a spare engine in case the primary goes bang, and the amateurs may or may not carry a spare.

BGTV8

30 hour run-time between rebuilds .... which is how race engine life is measured.

m4a1mustang

Expensive indeed. I got to do some work with a top NASCAR team for a school project several years ago and the engine program was amazing. Nothing but the block gets reused after a race weekend, and even then it is once or twice if at all.

Just to LEASE an engine from them for one race is around $75,000. Granted that comes with an engineer attached but still... 75k and you have to give it back.

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