Evo X or 370Z???

SS_Firehawk · 10-28-2012, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

I see this posted all the time and it just isn't true. Let's do 2011 models.

370Z coupe

Year 1 Year 2 Year 3 Year 4 Year 5 5 Yr Total
Depreciation $3,233 $2,835 $2,494 $2,212 $1,985 $12,759

2011 Mustang:
Year 1 Year 2 Year 3 Year 4 Year 5 5 Yr Total
Depreciation $2,574 $2,275 $2,023 $1,816 $1,655 $10,343

WRX sedan:

Year 1 Year 2 Year 3 Year 4 Year 5 5 Yr Total
Depreciation $2,585 $2,268 $1,994 $1,769 $1,587 $10,203

Mazdaspeed3

Year 1 Year 2 Year 3 Year 4 Year 5 5 Yr Total
Depreciation $1,864 $1,649 $1,465 $1,315 $1,199 $7,492

Your spreadsheet needs a starting price. Cars at a higher price losing the same % in residual value in comparison to another vehicle that is more inexpensive. Considering most Z's are averaging about $37,000 new (I'm not factoring what anyone paid just MSRP), it paints a different picture.

KBB estimates my vehicle at $31,200 (around 10k mi) in excellent condition on private resale and $29,300 on trade in. Sticker, my vehicle was around $36.5k. With VPP pricing, I got it for $32,400 (irrelevent to the arguement, but only losing $1300 and owing $28k, I'm winning this battle of depreciation and only owned it for a total of one year.)

I ran the same thing with a 2011 Ford Mustang GT Premium with leather, HID headlights and same mileage, $26,650 and the stealership will only pay $24,395.

I'm not sure what reputable source your using, but these are prices in the States using KBB, a source most dealerships and private buyers use to estimate the value of a vehicle.

Irrelevant to the argument, but only losing $1300 and owing $28k, I'm winning this battle of depreciation and only owned it for a total of one year. I am already out from being underwater and my loan was for $34k.

I'm going to bed (Afghanistan), so you have roughly 7 hours to formulate an argument to prove I am incorrect.

Red__Zed · 10-28-2012, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SS_Firehawk

Your spreadsheet needs a starting price. Cars at a higher price losing the same % in residual value in comparison to another vehicle that is more inexpensive. Considering most Z's are averaging about $37,000 new (I'm not factoring what anyone paid just MSRP), it paints a different picture.

KBB estimates my vehicle at $31,200 (around 10k mi) in excellent condition on private resale and $29,300 on trade in. Sticker, my vehicle was around $36.5k. With VPP pricing, I got it for $32,400 (irrelevent to the arguement, but only losing $1300 and owing $28k, I'm winning this battle of depreciation and only owned it for a total of one year.)

I ran the same thing with a 2011 Ford Mustang GT Premium with leather, HID headlights and same mileage, $26,650 and the stealership will only pay $24,395.

I'm not sure what reputable source your using, but these are prices in the States using KBB, a source most dealerships and private buyers use to estimate the value of a vehicle.

Irrelevant to the argument, but only losing $1300 and owing $28k, I'm winning this battle of depreciation and only owned it for a total of one year. I am already out from being underwater and my loan was for $34k.

I'm going to bed (Afghanistan), so you have roughly 7 hours to formulate an argument to prove I am incorrect.

Using KBB prices is enough argument against your point.

Try looking at auction prices vs actual price paid, rather than comparing Msrp to KBB excellent.

The number of cars sold for KBB's excellent price can probably be counted on one hand.

Try actually selling the car, then re-evaluate

EDIT, for fun, here is depreciation as a percentage of MSRP and average purchase price.

MSRP ||5 year depreciation (per NADA) ||residual (vs MSRP) ||average purchase price new ||TC residual

2011 370z
$31,450 || $18,302|| 0.418060413 || $31,296 || 0.4200
GSR
$34,095 || $19,204|| 0.436750257 || $33,080 || 0.4497
MR
$38,090 ||$21,302 || 0.440745603 || $35,380 || 0.4686

All based on NADA to keep things fair

Hbomb · 10-28-2012, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snakes709

Not saying you or NADA are wrong but im seeing different prices going with my buddies to get their cars. Not that it changes the difference between the two cars but add $10,000-15,000 to those prices that nada quotes, for Canadians...lol.

A guy in my unit was looking at traded in his 350z for a 370z or GTR. I was looking at used 370z's and they were between 20-30k with between 30,000-80,000kms. In Canada you are lucky to find a used Evo for anything less then 30,000-35,000 no matter how many km's on it.

And once again, bunch of our local evo club traded their cars in for BMW's (oddly enough 5 guys traded their evo's for bmw's within a span of a couple months) and they all got amazing trade in value. I actually called up the dealership yesterday to give me a quote on my car with a blown engine. $19,000k for a evo that has a blown engine which is pretty damn good.

Fast and the Furious tax. Just like a MK4 supra- Blue book in good condition 15-30k usually, but the market is fll of guys with 200k mile Supras going for 50k+. Just the nature of the car. The Evo was more popular then the Z, Hands down. The tuner crowd took it and ran with it, given it being turbo and all. The Z (just like the 350z) has a storied history, but for guys in the 20-40 demographic, without tons of extra cash to throw around, the Evo is a better bang for your buck modding vehicle.

Off topic- where were you at in the ghan? I was in the Kunar from 2010-11, and shinkay area 05-06

Hbomb · 10-28-2012, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

Using KBB prices is enough argument against your point.

Try looking at auction prices vs actual price paid, rather than comparing Msrp to KBB excellent.

The number of cars sold for KBB's excellent price can probably be counted on one hand.

Try actually selling the car, then re-evaluate.

so a mustang does NOT depreciate faster then a Z? Hmm. Given the outrageous production numbers of the mustang compared to the 10k a year of the Z, I would have thought it to be opposite.

Red__Zed · 10-28-2012, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hbomb

so a mustang does NOT depreciate faster then a Z? Hmm. Given the outrageous production numbers of the mustang compared to the 10k a year of the Z, I would have thought it to be opposite.

The value stays high for the same reason there are a high number produced--a lot of people want to buy them.

Snakes709 · 10-28-2012, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hbomb

Fast and the Furious tax. Just like a MK4 supra- Blue book in good condition 15-30k usually, but the market is fll of guys with 200k mile Supras going for 50k+. Just the nature of the car. The Evo was more popular then the Z, Hands down. The tuner crowd took it and ran with it, given it being turbo and all. The Z (just like the 350z) has a storied history, but for guys in the 20-40 demographic, without tons of extra cash to throw around, the Evo is a better bang for your buck modding vehicle.

Off topic- where were you at in the ghan? I was in the Kunar from 2010-11, and shinkay area 05-06

love how you keep saying fast and furious. Yet the EvoX was never in any of the fast and furious movies and the Z was.

ZMan8 · 10-28-2012, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snakes709

love how you keep saying fast and furious. Yet the EvoX was never in any of the fast and furious movies and the Z was.

however evo VIII was in 2 fast 2 furious

LakeShow · 10-28-2012, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snakes709

love how you keep saying fast and furious. Yet the EvoX was never in any of the fast and furious movies and the Z was.

That automatically means the Z is better lol!

Hbomb · 10-28-2012, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snakes709

love how you keep saying fast and furious. Yet the EvoX was never in any of the fast and furious movies and the Z was.

But plenty of 9's. And you get my "drift"

Its the mark up the tuner crowd gives it. Now your just being difficult, I have given you empirical data to prove at least here in the states that the cars depreciate at the same rate. You got taken bye 5k of "cosmetic damage" and want to justify your purchase, and I get that. But spreading opinions (even the dealers opinion, which is where your getting your prices from) is no match for the truth I have provided for you.
p.s. princess patricia's light infantry. Really? /wink

Hbomb · 10-28-2012, 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZMan8

however evo VIII was in 2 fast 2 furious

and their was two 9's in fast five

Snakes709 · 10-28-2012, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hbomb

But plenty of 9's. And you get my "drift"

Its the mark up the tuner crowd gives it. Now your just being difficult, I have given you empirical data to prove at least here in the states that the cars depreciate at the same rate. You got taken bye 5k of "cosmetic damage" and want to justify your purchase, and I get that. But spreading opinions (even the dealers opinion, which is where your getting your prices from) is no match for the truth I have provided for you.
p.s. princess patricia's light infantry. Really? /wink

I had 5k of damage. Some women scraped along my driver door and took off. I caught her, cops didnt want to do anything. Someone scraped along the corner of my rear bumper in a parking lot, left no info and then. My hood got a couple dents in it from me being stupid. I'm a strat, **** PPCLI. I was attached to 3VP during my tour to Afghanistan last year.

Hbomb · 10-28-2012, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snakes709

I had 5k of damage. Some women scraped along my driver door and took off. I caught her, cops didnt want to do anything. Someone scraped along the corner of my rear bumper in a parking lot, left no info and then. My hood got a couple dents in it from me being stupid. I'm a strat, **** PPCLI. I was attached to 3VP during my tour to Afghanistan last year.

yea, had a dumb LT ( I say dumb because he backed up almost 10 feet straight to hit my car, then told me he "never saw it") back up into my car with an f150 a few weeks back, had to get the whole rear bumper repainted, costs his insurance 750. I am a grunt, and I joke about PPCLI, but those guys were legit my first deployment. And at least from our perspective, your ROE is much better implemented then ours. We have to send a letter bye carrier pigeon to shoot anything now.

Snakes709 · 10-28-2012, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hbomb

yea, had a dumb LT ( I say dumb because he backed up almost 10 feet straight to hit my car, then told me he "never saw it") back up into my car with an f150 a few weeks back, had to get the whole rear bumper repainted, costs his insurance 750. I am a grunt, and I joke about PPCLI, but those guys were legit my first deployment. And at least from our perspective, your ROE is much better implemented then ours. We have to send a letter bye carrier pigeon to shoot anything now.

that was the same way for Op Podium (winter olympics in vancouver) On our mountain we had our rifles, ammo but didnt have the bolts to the gun. We had a 9mm, loaded due to cougers in the area but we would have to get on the radio and get permission to engage if we were being attacked.

SS_Firehawk · 10-28-2012, 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

Using KBB prices is enough argument against your point.

Try looking at auction prices vs actual price paid, rather than comparing Msrp to KBB excellent.

The number of cars sold for KBB's excellent price can probably be counted on one hand.

Try actually selling the car, then re-evaluate

EDIT, for fun, here is depreciation as a percentage of MSRP and average purchase price.

MSRP ||5 year depreciation (per NADA) ||residual (vs MSRP) ||average purchase price new ||TC residual

2011 370z
$31,450 || $18,302|| 0.418060413 || $31,296 || 0.4200
GSR
$34,095 || $19,204|| 0.436750257 || $33,080 || 0.4497
MR
$38,090 ||$21,302 || 0.440745603 || $35,380 || 0.4686

All based on NADA to keep things fair

I'll be at work with "prison" internet, I'll check on this when I am off (12 hrs from now). But we all should keep in mind there are a lot offactors outside of type of vehicle that can affet the sales price. And for the record, I sold vehicles a while back, my car is definitely considered in excellent condition. IT's the only reason I used it, as it's a real world value. But I would cede, because I was a salesman does not make me an expert, but I definitely not ignorant of value :P

Red__Zed · 10-29-2012, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SS_Firehawk

I'll be at work with "prison" internet, I'll check on this when I am off (12 hrs from now). But we all should keep in mind there are a lot offactors outside of type of vehicle that can affet the sales price. And for the record, I sold vehicles a while back, my car is definitely considered in excellent condition. IT's the only reason I used it, as it's a real world value. But I would cede, because I was a salesman does not make me an expert, but I definitely not ignorant of value :P

The fact that you deem your car to be in excellent condition does not mean it will ever sell for KBBs excellent estimation.

It's far more telling to look at what cars actually sell for. KBB is widely known to be inaccurate (generally inflated).