Lots of wrecked Z's...

m4a1mustang · 12-28-2011, 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pharmacist

Steve didnt win anything. He can convince himself i am avoiding him or whatever but i already stated my opinion about 100 times in this thread. Not sure what else he wants me to explain that i didnt already do repeatedly on many occasions. Maybe he should clarify his question instead of posting nonsense about dancing or stuff like that.

I'm not really sure where you answered it, but the response was a given anyways... so it doesn't really matter.

I just find it interesting that you've been quite opinionated about matters of handling for almost as long as I've known you on these forums... and only now do I find out that the 370Z is the only RWD car you've ever driven in your life. I guess it just puts things in perspective for myself and others... for better or worse.

Anyways, props to you for honesty. And for helping to keep things interesting.

m4a1mustang · 12-28-2011, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

Because it is a tough life having a fast car

I guess. Power on demand makes it really difficult to drive...

b1adesofcha0s · 12-28-2011, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

Because it is a tough life having a fast car

It's much more difficult to control on the street

onzedge · 12-28-2011, 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b1adesofcha0s

It's much more difficult to control on the street

ImportConvert · 12-28-2011, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

Nice theory, but go out and put it into practice before you make assessments like this. A Corvette will not run into a snap oversteer condition like you described unless you give it too much throttle... just like the Z. In fact, the Vettes themselves are fairly neutral with a bit of understeer... unless you overpower the rear tires.

And whether understeer or oversteer is easier to control is 100% up to the driver.

This was my experience with GS, Z06, and ZR1's that I have driven. At the limit, you get VERY PREDICTABLE under-steer with a lot of feed back from a good tire like the PS2, that is mitigated with a laying off of the gas-pedal or light application of the brake. The car is as docile as you let it be with no Jekyll and Hyde tendencies. I just wanted to inquire if the 370Z had any due to the shorter wheel-base and different suspension design. I am not familiar with the 370Z except for test drives that obviously did not involve the limit.

ImportConvert · 12-28-2011, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

You were going too fast for the conditions. I can get the back end to step out in my car on snow tires under braking if I am going too fast...

More rear weight makes the rear of the car want to overtake the front when you attempt to stop quickly... especially if turning. If you have more weight on the front, the car tends to track much straighter... Simple physics.

There's a reason why the older 911s were notorious for ridiculous amounts of oversteer... all that weight over the rear axle.

The 911 was famous for unintentional throttle lift snap oversteer. As in, the driver enters the corner, the front-end gives some feedback, the driver lifts on the throttle to shift weight forward, and that pendulum of an arse steps out in an instant. I have never driven a 911, but I understand the physics of it and can easily see how that would happen.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pharmacist

i disagree. it also means the rear of the car is prone to losing traction, especially under braking. i used to have a chrysler intrepid, and all the drivetrain (engine, gearbox, diff) was IN FRONT of the front wheels. brake a bit too hard and the back end would get light on its wheels. Occasionally that led to a bit of minor fishtailing under braking. Nothing the ABS didn't fix but it still did happen.

There is a difference between bad balance for a road course and a horrible abomination of engineering.

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

If you have the sense to do a full-on Noveske build you probably have enough common sense to handle a high power RWD car safely.

Thanks! Even the best of us can make split-second stupid decisions, though. I try not to leave my house thinking "I'm too sensible to screw up". I just don't like painting myself in the "Won't happen to me!" picture.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

bad balance is actually great in snow. tons of weight over the front axle means you can turn and stop very easily in poor traction conditions.

Which is why I keep my G20. It actually is kindof fun in the corners, too, if I respect its limits. No bad tendencies with it. Very predictable. Great in the snow (unless ground-clearance becomes an issue). Last time it snowed here it did just fine.

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

It doesn't matter... either one would be fine for me. The Z06 only has 500hp when you want it to have 500hp...

+1, it's slow and predictable in 40mph traffic in my hands. The power is very linear until about 4K rpm or so. Very tractable. I would pick the 370Z in snow/rain, though due to more weight being applied over a smaller area increasing the PSI of the contact patch on the snow, but that's neither here nor there, lol

ImportConvert · 12-28-2011, 10:30 PM

When I am behind the wheel of a sports car, I have adopted the Ron Jeremy philosophy on the accelerator.

"I only pull out enough to win [accomplish the task at hand]"

Just because I have 505bhp, doesn't mean I use them all, all the time.

Same will hold true for the 370Z...I'll just pull it out a bit further :P

Pharmacist · 12-28-2011, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TerribleONE

hes just sad he sold his Z and drives a ford now..

Quote:

I'm not really sure where you answered it, but the response was a given anyways... so it doesn't really matter.

Not even sure what your question was, but I believe I already stated my opinion in full detail. I don't believe there's anything more I can say without ending up repeating myself.

Quote:

This was my experience with GS, Z06, and ZR1's that I have driven. At the limit, you get VERY PREDICTABLE under-steer with a lot of feed back from a good tire like the PS2, that is mitigated with a laying off of the gas-pedal or light application of the brake. The car is as docile as you let it be with no Jekyll and Hyde tendencies. I just wanted to inquire if the 370Z had any due to the shorter wheel-base and different suspension design. I am not familiar with the 370Z except for test drives that obviously did not involve the limit.

Rather suprised to hear that considering that every review of the corvettes handling state that they tend to oversteer a lot with even a bit of throttle application. Well, if you find a corvette predictable, easy, and understeers, you'll have an easier time with a 370z. The Z does have a shorter wheelbase, but the suspension is quite soft (unless you go with the harder Nismo version which I havent driven), the engine is less powerful, and the suspension is set up from the factory with a bit of understeer. There's nothing unpredictable at all. Of course if you do something stupid like floor it in the middle of a right angle turn in 1st gear, yeah, you'll find yourself facing backwards in a flash. But other than that it's easy to drive.

Of course if you do plan on driving it on snow or on near freezing temperatures, definitely get snow tires. The stock tires are summer only and would not work at all in the winter.

m4a1mustang · 12-28-2011, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pharmacist

After the next snow I'm going to drive up your way in an SRT-10 to buy you a beer.

Pharmacist · 12-28-2011, 11:01 PM

Ironically enough, since I crashed my z in an accident I'm actually pondering doing the opposite move to ImporConvert and buying a z06. I was quite surprise to find used 2008 models in the low to mid 50k dollars, which is quite cheap. I'm a bit iffy about it though. mainly i'm uncertain if that crappy plastic interior will hold up or break apart, whether the cheapo plastic body panels wound break/crack/leak, any reliability issues with the engine or drivetrain or electronics, how comfortable it is to drive daily on bumpy roads with its stiff suspension, how it handles on rainy days. Probably won't be good on the snow so i'll probably have to have a winter beater. Also have there been any significant performance or reliability upgrades since 2008 or is it just the same car they're making today? ImportConvert if you have any info can you PM me?

Pharmacist · 12-28-2011, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

After the next snow I'm going to drive up your way in an SRT-10 to buy you a beer.

Just let me know before hand when you will be coming, so I can get my *** off the road and hide in a far away place in case you spin out and crash

Super Moderator II · 12-28-2011, 11:04 PM

Lots of threads to discuss other vehicles. This doesn't need to be a corvette/mustang/whatever else thread.

ImportConvert · 12-28-2011, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pharmacist

Not even sure what your question was, but I believe I already stated my opinion in full detail. I don't believe there's anything more I can say without ending up repeating myself. Rather suprised to hear that considering that every review of the corvettes handling state that they tend to oversteer a lot with even a bit of throttle application. Well, if you find a corvette predictable, easy, and understeers, you'll have an easier time with a 370z. The Z does have a shorter wheelbase, but the suspension is quite soft (unless you go with the harder Nismo version which I havent driven), the engine is less powerful, and the suspension is set up from the factory with a bit of understeer. There's nothing unpredictable at all. Of course if you do something stupid like floor it in the middle of a right angle turn in 1st gear, yeah, you'll find yourself facing backwards in a flash. But other than that it's easy to drive.

Of course if you do plan on driving it on snow or on near freezing temperatures, definitely get snow tires. The stock tires are summer only and would not work at all in the winter.

I'm not applying the throttle when entering a corner. That comes after the apex when I am straightening the wheel and exiting the corner, and it happens smoothly and results in a gentle weight-shift to the rear as the wheel straightens and the car happily lunges out of the corner with very little drama.

I am glad to hear of the 370Z's nature. Frustrated I don't have one yet, not because I don't love my Z06, but because I have made up my mind, and once I make up my mind on something, I want it. Then. However, patience is a virtue, so I console myself with this thread and others.

m4a1mustang · 12-28-2011, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pharmacist

Just let me know before hand when you will be coming, so I can get my *** off the road and hide in a far away place in case you spin out and crash

m4a1mustang · 12-28-2011, 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImportConvert

I'm not applying the throttle when entering a corner. That comes after the apex when I am straightening the wheel and exiting the corner, and it happens smoothly and results in a gentle weight-shift to the rear as the wheel straightens and the car happily lunges out of the corner with very little drama.

I am glad to hear of the 370Z's nature. Frustrated I don't have one yet, not because I don't love my Z06, but because I have made up my mind, and once I make up my mind on something, I want it. Then. However, patience is a virtue, so I console myself with this thread and others.

370Z is definitely a fun car. Way different when you are comparing it to a Z06. If I were in your shoes I definitely couldn't make the jump simply because the power hit would be too big for me to overcome... but I don't doubt that you will have fun with it.

12-28-2011, 11:01 PM	#175 (permalink)
Pharmacist A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2009 Location: Toronto, Ontario Posts: 1,249 Drives: 09 370z Sport 6MT Rep Power: 18	Ironically enough, since I crashed my z in an accident I'm actually pondering doing the opposite move to ImporConvert and buying a z06. I was quite surprise to find used 2008 models in the low to mid 50k dollars, which is quite cheap. I'm a bit iffy about it though. mainly i'm uncertain if that crappy plastic interior will hold up or break apart, whether the cheapo plastic body panels wound break/crack/leak, any reliability issues with the engine or drivetrain or electronics, how comfortable it is to drive daily on bumpy roads with its stiff suspension, how it handles on rainy days. Probably won't be good on the snow so i'll probably have to have a winter beater. Also have there been any significant performance or reliability upgrades since 2008 or is it just the same car they're making today? ImportConvert if you have any info can you PM me? __________________ 2009 370z Sport Touring/Nismo shift Knob/Z1 motorsports 34 row oil cooler

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Lots more CF parts!!! by CFElement....Lots of pics.	Carbon Fiber Element	Exterior & Interior	2	03-01-2014 04:22 AM
For those who have wrecked...	USMCASA	Nissan 370Z General Discussions	8	08-14-2011 03:41 PM
Another wrecked Z!!! VDC was off...	flashburn	Nissan 370Z General Discussions	30	01-05-2011 06:26 PM
Wrecked...	jamesleerpc	Nissan 370Z General Discussions	208	12-23-2010 10:52 PM
Wrecked my Z!!	sjilzian	Nissan 370Z General Discussions	32	05-30-2010 09:57 PM

12-28-2011, 10:30 PM	#172 (permalink)
ImportConvert A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: SWMO Posts: 4,454 Drives: 2019 CX5 GT Reserve Rep Power: 7627	When I am behind the wheel of a sports car, I have adopted the Ron Jeremy philosophy on the accelerator. "I only pull out enough to win [accomplish the task at hand]" Just because I have 505bhp, doesn't mean I use them all, all the time. Same will hold true for the 370Z...I'll just pull it out a bit further :P

12-28-2011, 11:04 PM	#177 (permalink)
Super Moderator II Super Moderator Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Earth Posts: 379 Drives: a Spaceship Rep Power: 6264	Lots of threads to discuss other vehicles. This doesn't need to be a corvette/mustang/whatever else thread.