370Z Test Drive - Questions

Dave N

Hello Everyone,

Since this is my first post, I'll combine this as an introduction, of sorts, as well as questions I have after taking a test drive over the weekend. I'm not new to Z's having owned a couple of 240Z's, a 280-ZX, and a couple of Z32's. I currently have a TT Z32. I'm most active on twinturbo.net under the same screen name. So if there are any members that are also members on twinturbo.net, you'll recognize my screen name (Hi Seb@SZ ).

Let me preface this post by saying that I've done some searching and still plan to continue searching the site for answers to the questions below. However, I would still welcome feedback/opinions from anyone that can offer additional details on their experiences with their car.

I dropped by a local dealer and test drove a couple of 370Z's and I wanted to pass along some observations/questions to see what is normal and what isn't normal with regards to the 370Z - both cars had about the same mileage on them (just over 24K miles).

First car: 40th Anniversary Z

• When accelerating normally (typical in-town type of driving), I didn't observe anything out of the ordinary.

• However, when accelerating onto the freeway and running it up through the gears the engine seemed to run out of steam around 4,500 ~ 5,000 rpm. Pushing it past this point yielded more noise than acceleration. It wasn't pressing me back in the seat like I was anticipating (maybe I'm too accustomed to the acceleration of my TT).

• Exited the freeway and got on going the opposite direction and had a chance to accelerate hard through the gears (fast gear changes). I noticed what seemed like a delay in the clutch engagement. For example, with each rapid upshift (2->3; 3->4; 4->5), I had the clutch fully engaged but there was a delay (roughly 0.5s) before you felt positive lock-up with the clutch. I couldn't tell definitively if it was slipping but that was almost the sensation it was giving. (SyncroRev Match was OFF)

• Once off the freeway, I had the opportunity to accelerate hard from a standstill and noticed the rear end squatted tremendously with each up-shift(it was reminscent of my '83 280-ZX - and that was bad).

Beyond that, it was a nice/pleasant car to drive.

Second car: '09 Touring w/Sport Package
While looking the car over before the test drive, I noticed that the previous owner had changed the OE struts to adjustable aftermarket ones (there are holes in the cargo area trim for access to the adjustment shaft). So I was curious to see how this car rode in comparison to the 40th Z.

• The ride was more firm (closer to my TT), but it did jump around under moderate braking on uneven road surfaces. I didn't notice this on the 40th Z, but then again I didn't have to brake for a red light as suddenly during that test drive.

• On hard acceleration from a standstill, there was noticeably less rear squat.

• Freeway acceleration was the same as the 40th Z - you really hit a mental hardstop when you encounter what feels like resistance/reluctance from the engine to willingly rev higher than 5K. It's quite a contrast to my TT where it's smooth all the way up to the rev limiter.

• I did not notice the odd clutch engagement as I noticed on the 40th Z.

• There was a strange situation (at least to me) when driving the '09. We were taking an on-ramp to the freeway and just about the end of the on-ramp just before it straightened out, I accelerated up to about 7K rpm in 2nd gear and lost power. The engine didn't die but momentarily it would not go above idle speed no matter how far the accelerator pedal was pushed. It recovered and I started to accelerate normally and within seconds it happened again. I coasted off the freeway and within 10-15 seconds it recovered and never happened again. The car had just over a 1/4 tank of gas and I don't think the on-ramp speed was so great that it would have starved the engine of gas. Was this VDC intervening?

So I guess I've got some questions to ask:
- I've read about the engine being coarse at higher RPM's but was really suprised by what felt like a significant drop-off in power. Since I experienced it on two difference Z's, I presume this is normal? Do you get used to it?
- For those with stock suspension, is heavy rear-end squat normal under hard acceleration?
- For the odd clutch engagement I noticed on the 40th Z, is this an anamoly or is this somewhat normal?
- Lastly, can anyone offer their insight as to why the '09 would lose power under hard acceleration? There was no tire slippage and the car was pointed straight, so I am not inclined to think it was VDC kicking in. I wondered if perhaps the VDC started to intervene thinking maybe the accelerator was stuck at WOT.

I'd appreciate any insight on these observations and I look forward to hopefully meeting some folks in person one of these days.

Thanks,

Dave N.

cossie1600

The 370 feels like a slow car compare to the 350/EVO/STi, it's just the byproduct of a high revving engine and the extremely tall gears. The car will always have a delay thanks to the drive by wire lag, the clutch feel is just personal preference. I have driven 300ZX TT. It feels fast, but it is not faster.

280z/300zx

With regards to the 09 losing power I think it's fuel starvation. There have been reports that if close to 1/4 tank and high speed cornering that it can be fuel starved as the fuel pick up isn't able to accomadate.

As for high rpm acceleration I think you are just used to the TT you have now. The feeling of acceleration does go away in the higher rpms but if you look down at the speedo you are still accleration at a good pace.

Not sure about the rear squat. I too am used to that with my Z31 and my 370z doesn't have that. I used to have a 2009 touring sport and the rear squat is what I would consider normal, not like the 280zx or 300zx. Currently I have a Nismo 370z and it doesn't squat at all, but then again the suspension is much firmer.

As for the 09 adj suspension skipping around, thats common when changing the suspension to aftermarket. You have to be carefull you chose a set up that is meant for the car. Previous owner may have just not set the struts up right.

clutch on the 40th may need repalcing. Perhaps sign of prior abuse from owner or new manual driver learning on the car.

Based off your description of both cars I would pass and find a different selection. I would avoid the 40th because of the clutch and avoid the 2009 due to the suspension. If I buy a used sports car I want something that was babied and never modified, but thats me and probably why I just buy new instead (aside from my 280z and 300zx).

Dave N

I initially thought of that, but the engine didn't sputter as if it was starving for fuel. Perhaps the ECU is programmed to override the throttle input and force the engine to stay at idle and avoid a lean condition. I'll dig deeper on the fuel starvation topic and see if I can come up with more info.

I was thinking the same thing but still surprised at how anemic the engine appeared to be. And while you're right about the acceleration continuing at a good pace, it's definitely not the pace that the TT provides. Another thing that probably skewed my perspective is that I've gotten a ride in a TT 370Z and it was very impressive throughout the RPM range. Obviously a lot of credit goes to the turbos but I had presumed the normally aspirated engine would not be as hindered as what I felt on these two cars over the weekend.

Those were my same thoughts as well. Too stiff and you start losing tire patch on the pavement due to the car's inability to absorb the impacts.

Agreed on both counts. I was really leaning towards a 40th but, silly as this may sound, I prefer the nav package as it places more info higher up so you don't have to take your eyes too far off the road to get climate/radio/phone info. I could live with the soft suspension for a while but would have insisted the dealer verify the clutch is OK (supposedly checked to qualify it as CPO, but I don't think rapid upshifts are part of the criteria).

The '09's biggest downfall is the aftermarket suspension and the question of abuse by the previous owner. I played this up to the sales guy along with the fact that it lost power twice. Based on those items, I think the car is over priced and definitely not something I want to take on. Like you, I prefer new cars so *I* know that it's been properly broken in and not abused. Aside from the funky clutch action, I think the 40th Z was much closer to the mark than the '09.

I'm in no hurry to buy another car at this time. It was more of an exercise to scratch an itch and see how the 370Z compared to my Z - I was mostly curious to see if I could fit in it (6'4" - it was a bit snug). The 370Z has some nice amenities and the styling is growing on me. But the Z32 doesn't look too dated compared to most cars out there. My biggest issue on the Z32 is it's age (22 years old), and relative lack of safety enhancements compared to the 370Z (and virtually every newer car on the road for that matter).

Thanks for your input. It's greatly appreciated.

Dave

christian370z

I've never noticed a lack of power above 5krpm. In fact, that's where the car pulls its hardest, making peak power around 7krpm.

__________________
-320whp / 259wftlbs-
SP Rays -- RE-11s -- SpecialtyZ Tune -- Swift Springs -- Stillen 25R Oil Cooler -- Stillen G3 Intakes -- Berk HFCs -- F.I. 12" CBE -- Stillen Sway Bars -- Es14 Spring -- INGS+1 lip -- CF Spoiler -- GTR Start Button -- VLED Parking Lights -- PWJDM V2 shift knob

ImportConvert

I will disagree partially.

I think the 370Z felt fast at any rpm, based on the numbers it lays down (It felt way stronger than 230rwtq off the line, and about right for 290whp at 80mph).

The gears in it, I found to be a bit short. I was already in 3rd by about 60-70 driving it "spiritedly".

The reason people whine about the 370Z "nosing over" or "feeling slow" is because they are probably not used to cars with large displacement engines, superchargers, or VVT. All of which contribute to a very linear torque curve. People expect a car to hit harder and harder as the revs climb, and the 370Z certainly does, but your body perceives that the acceleration has "leveled" off very fast in cars with table-top torque curves.

The rate of acceleration is much more linear.

It's like watching a guy jog across a football field vs. watching a guy walk, then jog, then break into a sprint. If you live for the last few feet/rpm, that guy was SO MUCH FASTER! But if you look at the data, our jogger probably has a better time.

FWIW, the 370Z feels identical to the C5 corvette/Camaro/Trans Am of the LS1 era, regarding its acceleration. Including 5-60mph. This totally stunned me. V6 with 230rwtq feeling the same from a low slow roll as an LS1 V8. I looked up the numbers and my suspicions were correct. 5-60 times the mags got as were identical. Crazy.

Hats off to Nissan. Go race something (on a track ) and report back. I bet it pulls harder than you think past 5K.

bvl

The 370z does feel a bit different above 5K. The valvetrain isn't the smoothest as many have noted, and the speed is very deceptive: you don't feel like you are going faster but you really are.

I think this is mostly attributed in my case to the very good torque off the line and how tractable the engine is in almost any gear. I have had two previous small displacement engines which are soft down low, then very linear once on boost (both turbo 4's).

Previous NA track/street car had a high strung 4 that was linear with a tad more pull above 5500 so you felt that (and still soft below 2000).

We also have a G35 sedan whose power delivery is quite different and not nearly as violently delivered as the Z.

Coming from the Z32 TT, the 370 is going to take some getting used to IMHO

- b

cossie1600

It might be short compare to your Corvette, but it can do 42 in 1st and 69 in 2nd and about 99 in 3rd. That's pretty tall for a car with that kind of gear. I mean I think it is perfect, but to the fast and furious crowd it is a little bit low.

kenchan

didnt read the entire post as it's too long... here's my comments on the q's though.

- I've read about the engine being coarse at higher RPM's but was really suprised by what felt like a significant drop-off in power. Since I experienced it on two difference
Z's, I presume this is normal? Do you get used to it?

mine does not dip up high. it could be the ECU that has been in economy mode for some time. if you WOT a few times it should open up to redline.

- For those with stock suspension, is heavy rear-end squat normal under hard acceleration?


it does squat somewat but not "heavy"...

- For the odd clutch engagement I noticed on the 40th Z, is this an anamoly or is this somewhat normal?

you'll get use to it. the Z has throttle input latency to add to the fun.

- Lastly, can anyone offer their insight as to why the '09 would lose power under hard acceleration? There was no tire slippage and the car was pointed straight, so I am not inclined to think it was VDC kicking in. I wondered if perhaps the VDC started to intervene thinking maybe the accelerator was stuck at WOT.

see above. unless the slip light flashes it's not active during power-on, i dont think. you can't fully disable off-throttle from what ive experienced. the car wants to correct itself so need to keep power on if you dont want to look like some novice WRX driver getting ready to tackle drifting with brand new shitty nitto tires hiccuping down the turns.

cossie1600

When VDC is off, the stability control is off. It does have something called ABLS, it works as an electronic limited slip where it will control the one wheel spin by applying brakes at that corner but will not cut throttle

Mt Tam I am

As a former Z32TT owner from twinturbo.net, who now has an "09 touring sport with adjustable after market coil overs, I can offer an opinion.

OP:
Second car: '09 Touring w/Sport Package
While looking the car over before the test drive, I noticed that the previous owner had changed the OE struts to adjustable aftermarket ones (there are holes in the cargo area trim for access to the adjustment shaft). So I was curious to see how this car rode in comparison to the 40th Z.

RE:
The ride was more firm (closer to my TT), but it did jump around under moderate braking on uneven road surfaces. I didn't notice this on the 40th Z, but then again I didn't have to brake for a red light as suddenly during that test drive.

The ride on mine actually get better and I do not hop around. I hope this can be adjusted out.

RE:
On hard acceleration from a standstill, there was noticeably less rear squat.

Can not speak to this. I have an after market exhaust and maybe it makes a difference.

RE:
Freeway acceleration was the same as the 40th Z - you really hit a mental hardstop when you encounter what feels like resistance/reluctance from the engine to willingly rev higher than 5K. It's quite a contrast to my TT where it's smooth all the way up to the rev limiter.

I get good power all the way up to 7,000 rpm's without resistance.


I did not notice the odd clutch engagement as I noticed on the 40th Z.
There was a strange situation (at least to me) when driving the '09. We were taking an on-ramp to the freeway and just about the end of the on-ramp just before it straightened out, I accelerated up to about 7K rpm in 2nd gear and lost power. The engine didn't die but momentarily it would not go above idle speed no matter how far the accelerator pedal was pushed. It recovered and I started to accelerate normally and within seconds it happened again. I coasted off the freeway and within 10-15 seconds it recovered and never happened again. The car had just over a 1/4 tank of gas and I don't think the on-ramp speed was so great that it would have starved the engine of gas. Was this VDC intervening?

Upon first read I thought you'd hit 7500 rpm's and the rev limiter kicked in. But the car recovers as soon as you shift (drop below 7500 I assume). It also sounds like it could be VDC or gas starvation in a right turn, except neither takes 10-15 seconds to recover.

I only got the 370 after a drunk killed my Z32. The Z32 is more comfortable and this stands out, on longer trips. I think it is the better car after some mods. Also the trunk space is much greater.

Good luck.

__________________
Nissan Motorsports 34R Oil Cooler. Stillen CBE. Hotchkis Sport Sway Bars. KW Variant 3 Coilover System. Stillen Gen3 CAI. Michelin Pilot Super Sport. Stillen Brake Ducts. Carbotech™ XP10/XP8 Pads. Z1 Front Rotors. Z1 Stainless Brake Lines. Two degrees of camber

ImportConvert

A little lower geared than my old F-body. It's not a tall geared car unless you're coming from a Prius.

cossie1600

Prius can hit 114mph in just D, you can't beat that in your Corvette.

Audi S4 has similar power than the 370, they have gears that are shorter. Same with STI/EVO. There are cars made outside of Kentucky

ImportConvert

Prius has CVT?

Yes, my Mustang was made in Detroit, as was one of my Trans Ams (one 4-speed auto, one 6-speed manual), and the other in Canada, I believe. My G20 made in Japan.

All of them have/had taller gears than a 370Z. Yes, even my G20.

I guess you're right, some cars are geared lower, I just have 0 experience with them and found the 370Z to be geared similarly to my 5.0 after I put 4.10's in it. They redlined at about the same (I believe I ran a 6700rpm chip, then swapped for 7K rpm chip in the 5.0's 6AL), and I found myself shifting the 370Z like I shifted my 5.0, rpm-wise/speed-wise.

cossie1600

Prius has two planetary gear, not a conventional automatic or CVT

High torque and non performance cars will always have taller gears, that's the name of the game. It makes no sense to have a close ratio box when the car has tons of power. It will just be a smoke show.