The Nissan Z - Then and now

SeattleLion · 10-27-2010, 02:10 PM

As one of the first people to own a 240Z in the U.S., I have been thinking about how the car and its ecosystem have changed. I also wonder how others see it.

When I got my first Z (1969 or 1970; I can't remember), the 240Z was one of a fairly large field of low-cost sports cars. It competed with the Triumph Spitfire, TR4, Fiat had one, and there were a few more. All cost under $4000. The 240 was a great value and competed very well in its class. Porsches were in a different class. A 911 cost $8,000 then. None were very high powered. My 240 had manual rack-and-pinion steering and a fairly small 4 engine. Zero to 60 was not great.

At that time Corvettes were considered muscle cars like GTO's and 409's. They didn't qualify to race with Z's or Porsche. They also weren't that nimble.

Just like the current 370Z the 240's had some problems with engine heat. My 240 would overheat (water) on hot days when I sustained over 60mph.

Now the world has changed drastically. Limits on engine displacement have changed so that now a Z can race a 'vette or a porsche. My 370 is pretty close to a muscle car with a 200 hp/ton power ratio. The 240 was well under 200hp.

All sorts of new things are discussed here because our Z's are now powerful cars that can be discussed along with Porsche and 'Vette.

It's not fair to compare cabin tech with the 240. Most of the radio stations were AM back then. The fact that the Z was air conditioned was a big deal (it didn't do too much good on really hot days). It is fair to say that as I remember it, the 240 was very nimble and would compare favorably to the 370. It's top speed certainly wasn't close to 155. I think I once got my 240 up to 100mpg. It may have been able to go faster, but I didn't try.

So now the car that cost $3500 costs over $40,000, and the Porsche now can go for well over $100k. What I find most interesting is that since the sports car market has largely shaken out all of the lower-end sports cars (even the MR2 is gone, just the Miata is left), the Z finds itself in comparisons with cars that cost over twice as much. I think the 370 does just fine in those comparisons. Of course Nissan couldn't build a Porsche for $40,000. It had to cut some corners (like an oil cooler). But just like the 240 I had 40 years ago, my 370 is pure fun to drive. And when you get down to it, that's exactly what it was made to be.

What do you think?

ImportConvert · 10-27-2010, 02:24 PM

I think that a 332bhp car cannot be discussed with a lighter 430bhp car in terms of acceleration one bit. Other than that, I think you summed it up well! The 370Z is powerful compared to the 240 you had, but it is still stuck in the late '90s regarding its power/weight ratio. Handling-wise, it's right there with the best of them.

Modern "muscle-cars" run deep into the 12's now-days. The Z is still a light-weight, easily tossable in the corners, fun-to-drive car that doesn't command a steep price. Nothing has really changed, just evolved.

PapoZalsa · 10-27-2010, 02:25 PM

With all the complains some of us have about the 370Z, to me is the best bang for the buck!

I do not think that you can compare the 370Z on that same category with any other car, the Z will win.

Most comparison are with muscle cars and so on.

kenchan · 10-27-2010, 02:39 PM

i think we need to get 8-tracks back.

thanks for the read.

spearfish25 · 10-27-2010, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PapoZalsa

With all the complains some of us have about the 370Z, to me is the best bang for the buck!

I do not think that you can compare the 370Z on that same category with any other car, the Z will win.

Well, people may certainly argue with you on that point by bringing up the GTR or maybe the Hyundai Genesis (sedan). Certainly different categories of cars, but each offers an unprecedented 'bang for the buck'. If your bang is supercar, GTR. If it's sportscar, Z. If it's luxury sedan, Genesis.

kenchan · 10-27-2010, 02:46 PM

i thought the G37 sedans had the best bang for buck for lux sedans? genesis... you pay more than $30K you have to explain to your neighbors every time why you spent that kind of money on a hyundai/kia.

hahaha.

waaaasabi · 10-27-2010, 04:31 PM

OP, your post reminded me of Andy Rooney; now I can't stop reading your post with his voice in my head haha. Very interesting insight into the 240Z though.

SeattleLion · 10-27-2010, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waaaasabi

OP, your post reminded me of Andy Rooney; now I can't stop reading your post with his voice in my head haha. Very interesting insight into the 240Z though.

Well, my eyebrows are a bit bushy.

Jamaica · 10-27-2010, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kenchan

i thought the G37 sedans had the best bang for buck for lux sedans? genesis... you pay more than $30K you have to explain to your neighbors every time why you spent that kind of money on a hyundai/kia.

hahaha.

I will never spend that much on a hyundai ...then again i woult never buy one.

Dwight Frye · 10-27-2010, 07:06 PM

Seattlelion, I think you show the wisdom that comes with age. Hopefully some of it will rub off on others.

PapoZalsa · 10-27-2010, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spearfish25

Well, people may certainly argue with you on that point by bringing up the GTR or maybe the Hyundai Genesis (sedan). Certainly different categories of cars, but each offers an unprecedented 'bang for the buck'. If your bang is supercar, GTR. If it's sportscar, Z. If it's luxury sedan, Genesis.

That is what I'm talking about "DIFFERENT CATEGORIES"!

The GTR and G37S are not in the same category as the Z so they cannot be compare that is my entire point.

Muscle Car vs Muscle Car
Luxury vs Luxury
Supercar vs Supercar

specZ · 10-27-2010, 07:58 PM

wow this is great, I feel like I just sat through a short 6o minute segment

- This certainly made me happier to be a Z owner.

Red__Zed · 10-27-2010, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeattleLion

As one of the first people to own a 240Z in the U.S., I have been thinking about how the car and its ecosystem have changed. I also wonder how others see it.

When I got my first Z (1969 or 1970; I can't remember), the 240Z was one of a fairly large field of low-cost sports cars. It competed with the Triumph Spitfire, TR4, Fiat had one, and there were a few more. All cost under $4000. The 240 was a great value and competed very well in its class. Porsches were in a different class. A 911 cost $8,000 then. None were very high powered. My 240 had manual rack-and-pinion steering and a fairly small 4 engine. Zero to 60 was not great.

At that time Corvettes were considered muscle cars like GTO's and 409's. They didn't qualify to race with Z's or Porsche. They also weren't that nimble.

Just like the current 370Z the 240's had some problems with engine heat. My 240 would overheat (water) on hot days when I sustained over 60mph.

Now the world has changed drastically. Limits on engine displacement have changed so that now a Z can race a 'vette or a porsche. My 370 is pretty close to a muscle car with a 200 hp/ton power ratio. The 240 was well under 200hp.

All sorts of new things are discussed here because our Z's are now powerful cars that can be discussed along with Porsche and 'Vette.

It's not fair to compare cabin tech with the 240. Most of the radio stations were AM back then. The fact that the Z was air conditioned was a big deal (it didn't do too much good on really hot days). It is fair to say that as I remember it, the 240 was very nimble and would compare favorably to the 370. It's top speed certainly wasn't close to 155. I think I once got my 240 up to 100mpg. It may have been able to go faster, but I didn't try.

So now the car that cost $3500 costs over $40,000, and the Porsche now can go for well over $100k. What I find most interesting is that since the sports car market has largely shaken out all of the lower-end sports cars (even the MR2 is gone, just the Miata is left), the Z finds itself in comparisons with cars that cost over twice as much. I think the 370 does just fine in those comparisons. Of course Nissan couldn't build a Porsche for $40,000. It had to cut some corners (like an oil cooler). But just like the 240 I had 40 years ago, my 370 is pure fun to drive. And when you get down to it, that's exactly what it was made to be.

What do you think?

100mpg!!!!

Just playing. It is interesting to see the changes in cars over time-- they're very clearly evident in the Z lineage.

Rooskey · 10-28-2010, 12:43 AM

My best friend owned a 1977 260 back in the day and that car was so much fun to drive! He had the first old school cars of all my friends. I really liked the guages too. I think nissan did the best retro with the 370z than all the other car manufactures out there. The body lines, side windows, and the guages really represent the old z.

ProfessorDave · 10-28-2010, 09:21 AM

Great post, OP!

One of the things I like about the Z line is that they stayed (mostly) true to the original concept. You can't say that about many of the others we often compare the Z to (e.g., Mustang went through some miserable designs in the 70's and 80's, Camaros fell off the face of the earth along with Firebirds, and don't even get me started on the last attempt at a GTO!). Another line that has been true to its roots is the Miata (like the Z, a 2 seater that has not tried to be the fastest and blends good power with handling).

I find myself reviewing all the American muscle that now rest in peace:
Firebird/Trans AM
GTO/Lemans
AMC Javelin/AMX
Olds 442
Nova SS
Chevelle SS
Plymouth Satellite/Super Bee/Road Runner/GTX
Barracuda

10-27-2010, 02:10 PM	#1 (permalink)
SeattleLion Base Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Seattle WA Posts: 226 Drives: '13 Mustang GT Prem. Rep Power: 234	The Nissan Z - Then and now As one of the first people to own a 240Z in the U.S., I have been thinking about how the car and its ecosystem have changed. I also wonder how others see it. When I got my first Z (1969 or 1970; I can't remember), the 240Z was one of a fairly large field of low-cost sports cars. It competed with the Triumph Spitfire, TR4, Fiat had one, and there were a few more. All cost under $4000. The 240 was a great value and competed very well in its class. Porsches were in a different class. A 911 cost $8,000 then. None were very high powered. My 240 had manual rack-and-pinion steering and a fairly small 4 engine. Zero to 60 was not great. At that time Corvettes were considered muscle cars like GTO's and 409's. They didn't qualify to race with Z's or Porsche. They also weren't that nimble. Just like the current 370Z the 240's had some problems with engine heat. My 240 would overheat (water) on hot days when I sustained over 60mph. Now the world has changed drastically. Limits on engine displacement have changed so that now a Z can race a 'vette or a porsche. My 370 is pretty close to a muscle car with a 200 hp/ton power ratio. The 240 was well under 200hp. All sorts of new things are discussed here because our Z's are now powerful cars that can be discussed along with Porsche and 'Vette. It's not fair to compare cabin tech with the 240. Most of the radio stations were AM back then. The fact that the Z was air conditioned was a big deal (it didn't do too much good on really hot days). It is fair to say that as I remember it, the 240 was very nimble and would compare favorably to the 370. It's top speed certainly wasn't close to 155. I think I once got my 240 up to 100mpg. It may have been able to go faster, but I didn't try. So now the car that cost $3500 costs over $40,000, and the Porsche now can go for well over $100k. What I find most interesting is that since the sports car market has largely shaken out all of the lower-end sports cars (even the MR2 is gone, just the Miata is left), the Z finds itself in comparisons with cars that cost over twice as much. I think the 370 does just fine in those comparisons. Of course Nissan couldn't build a Porsche for $40,000. It had to cut some corners (like an oil cooler). But just like the 240 I had 40 years ago, my 370 is pure fun to drive. And when you get down to it, that's exactly what it was made to be. What do you think?

10-27-2010, 02:25 PM	#3 (permalink)
PapoZalsa A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Not in Sunny Florida Posts: 6,358 Drives: 16 Nismo w/Tech Pack Rep Power: 4500	With all the complains some of us have about the 370Z, to me is the best bang for the buck! I do not think that you can compare the 370Z on that same category with any other car, the Z will win. Most comparison are with muscle cars and so on. __________________ 2009 370Z MB Base w/Sport Package 6MT Modshack's Custom Air Intakes /3M Clear Bra/ Illuminated Kick Plates / F. I CBE w/12" resonators / EVO-R Front Lip / Rear Hatch Wing / Tein S-Tech Springs /Ilegal Tint in the Rep. of VA/4x20mm Z1 Spacers/ Vinyl Roof/Liquid Carbon Designs

10-27-2010, 04:31 PM	#7 (permalink)
waaaasabi Enthusiast Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: New York City Posts: 491 Drives: '10 Civic (FG1) 5AT Rep Power: 17	OP, your post reminded me of Andy Rooney; now I can't stop reading your post with his voice in my head haha. Very interesting insight into the 240Z though. __________________ That's SOOOO not Raven!

10-28-2010, 09:21 AM	#15 (permalink)
ProfessorDave A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Scranton, PA Posts: 1,580 Drives: In the fairway Rep Power: 19	Great post, OP! One of the things I like about the Z line is that they stayed (mostly) true to the original concept. You can't say that about many of the others we often compare the Z to (e.g., Mustang went through some miserable designs in the 70's and 80's, Camaros fell off the face of the earth along with Firebirds, and don't even get me started on the last attempt at a GTO!). Another line that has been true to its roots is the Miata (like the Z, a 2 seater that has not tried to be the fastest and blends good power with handling). I find myself reviewing all the American muscle that now rest in peace: Firebird/Trans AM GTO/Lemans AMC Javelin/AMX Olds 442 Nova SS Chevelle SS Plymouth Satellite/Super Bee/Road Runner/GTX Barracuda __________________ Rain, snow, sleet, hail: 2009 Mazda 3 sGT HB Everything else: 2009 370z, PW Touring 6MT

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10-27-2010, 02:24 PM	#2 (permalink)
ImportConvert A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: SWMO Posts: 4,454 Drives: 2019 CX5 GT Reserve Rep Power: 7627	I think that a 332bhp car cannot be discussed with a lighter 430bhp car in terms of acceleration one bit. Other than that, I think you summed it up well! The 370Z is powerful compared to the 240 you had, but it is still stuck in the late '90s regarding its power/weight ratio. Handling-wise, it's right there with the best of them. Modern "muscle-cars" run deep into the 12's now-days. The Z is still a light-weight, easily tossable in the corners, fun-to-drive car that doesn't command a steep price. Nothing has really changed, just evolved.

10-27-2010, 02:39 PM	#4 (permalink)
kenchan A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: N/A Posts: 76,801 Drives: N/A Rep Power: 141521	i think we need to get 8-tracks back. thanks for the read.

10-27-2010, 02:46 PM	#6 (permalink)
kenchan A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: N/A Posts: 76,801 Drives: N/A Rep Power: 141521	i thought the G37 sedans had the best bang for buck for lux sedans? genesis... you pay more than $30K you have to explain to your neighbors every time why you spent that kind of money on a hyundai/kia. hahaha.

10-27-2010, 07:06 PM	#10 (permalink)
Dwight Frye Enthusiast Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Occupied California Posts: 423 Drives: '09 Tour/Sport/6MT Rep Power: 16	Seattlelion, I think you show the wisdom that comes with age. Hopefully some of it will rub off on others.

10-27-2010, 07:58 PM	#12 (permalink)
specZ Enthusiast Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 336 Drives: On The Weekends Rep Power: 23	wow this is great, I feel like I just sat through a short 6o minute segment - This certainly made me happier to be a Z owner.

10-28-2010, 12:43 AM	#14 (permalink)
Rooskey Track Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: South Carolina Posts: 974 Drives: 2014 Alpha7 GTR Rep Power: 16	My best friend owned a 1977 260 back in the day and that car was so much fun to drive! He had the first old school cars of all my friends. I really liked the guages too. I think nissan did the best retro with the 370z than all the other car manufactures out there. The body lines, side windows, and the guages really represent the old z.