Camaro board "Z only real competitor"

[toxik]

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

Yeah but isn't that the attitude that got you herpes?

[m4a1mustang]

Originally Posted by frost

It was a mild case of the drips, you're such an exaggerator.

[ThoriumHotdog]

Somehow, the discussion of STDs and Camaros go hand in hand.

[m4a1mustang]

Originally Posted by ThoriumHotdog

Somehow, the discussion of STDs and Camaros go hand in hand.

[Red__Zed]

Originally Posted by ThoriumHotdog

Somehow, the discussion of STDs and Camaros go hand in hand.

Sad but true.

[mick]

i hope the z28 will look different than the 2ss.

[Shamu]

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

Yeah, they beat the M3 around Laguna Seca by over 3 seconds on the first lap out. And 3 seconds on Laguna is a LOT of time.

Ford team has a long time Porsche racer on their suspension team. He was out testing the Mustang on Laguna Seca over a year ago and called it a M3 beater. However it doesnt suprise me that they beat the M3 as Laguna Seca is primarily a power course. Boss Mustang has hp advantage from first straight until they get to top of the hill into the corkscrew. As a guy who has chased high hp cars on that track it doesnt tell me much about a cars handling potential, but clearly Mustangs are getting much better. Also critical to look at what tires were on cars at time test occurred. Sometimes tires can make all the difference in the world.

I'd love to see more track comparos of the 370Z nismo verses Cayman S, base model Vette, Mustang Boss, Camaro SS, BMW 135i M, RX8, etc.

Randy Pobst put a new generation Cayman S around track over 3 seconds faster than a 370Z Nismo on Laguna Seca. I think that says a whole lot about how superior handling in Cayman is as the two cars have nearly identical power to weight ratios.

2009 Nissan Nismo 370Z Laps Laguna Seca - 2009 Motor Trend Best Driver's Car Competition Feature - Motor Trend Video

2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS Hot Lap At Laguna Seca - 2009 Best Driver's Car Feature - Motor Trend Video

2009 Porsche Cayman S Laps Laguna Seca - 2009 Best Driver's Car Video



I could have bought a used Cayman S but I liked the Nismo version of the 370 Z better. I think with a little setup work the Nismo can actually be faster than a stockish Cayman. Nissans tunning potential is much greater. Porsche is squeezing a lot of HP from those little 3.4 liter flat sixes and there isnt much you can do other than very expensive turbo kit to get more HP. Nismo on the other hand will reward intakes, free flowing cats, etc with some real HP gains.

[Mt Tam I am]

Originally Posted by Shamu

Ford team has a long time Porsche racer on their suspension team. He was out testing the Mustang on Laguna Seca over a year ago and called it a M3 beater. However it doesnt suprise me that they beat the M3 as Laguna Seca is primarily a power course. Boss Mustang has hp advantage from first straight until they get to top of the hill into the corkscrew. As a guy who has chased high hp cars on that track it doesnt tell me much about a cars handling potential, but clearly Mustangs are getting much better. Also critical to look at what tires were on cars at time test occurred. Sometimes tires can make all the difference in the world.

I'd love to see more track comparos of the 370Z nismo verses Cayman S, base model Vette, Mustang Boss, Camaro SS, BMW 135i M, RX8, etc.

Randy Pobst put a new generation Cayman S around track over 3 seconds faster than a 370Z Nismo on Laguna Seca. I think that says a whole lot about how superior handling in Cayman is as the two cars have nearly identical power to weight ratios.

2009 Nissan Nismo 370Z Laps Laguna Seca - 2009 Motor Trend Best Driver's Car Competition Feature - Motor Trend Video

2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS Hot Lap At Laguna Seca - 2009 Best Driver's Car Feature - Motor Trend Video

2009 Porsche Cayman S Laps Laguna Seca - 2009 Best Driver's Car Video



I could have bought a used Cayman S but I liked the Nismo version of the 370 Z better. I think with a little setup work the Nismo can actually be faster than a stockish Cayman. Nissans tunning potential is much greater. Porsche is squeezing a lot of HP from those little 3.4 liter flat sixes and there isnt much you can do other than very expensive turbo kit to get more HP. Nismo on the other hand will reward intakes, free flowing cats, etc with some real HP gains.

I still can not believe that the Camero gets round the track ahead of the Z. These cars never get round the turns in the real world. Hats off to the driver .

[ImportConvert]

I think the mustang 5.0 is a good competator for the Camaro. Moreso than the 370Z. The 370Z was aimed more at the base Cayman and Boxter S market.

Originally Posted by Mt Tam I am

I still can not believe that the Camero gets round the track ahead of the Z. These cars never get round the turns in the real world. Hats off to the driver .

Where the Camaro suffers in the corners, the Z suffers in the straights. Find a slow, tight track, and the Z will trump the Camaro. Find a long, fast track, vis-versa.

[Endgame]

Originally Posted by Shamu

Ford team has a long time Porsche racer on their suspension team. He was out testing the Mustang on Laguna Seca over a year ago and called it a M3 beater. However it doesnt suprise me that they beat the M3 as Laguna Seca is primarily a power course. Boss Mustang has hp advantage from first straight until they get to top of the hill into the corkscrew. As a guy who has chased high hp cars on that track it doesnt tell me much about a cars handling potential, but clearly Mustangs are getting much better. Also critical to look at what tires were on cars at time test occurred. Sometimes tires can make all the difference in the world.

I'd love to see more track comparos of the 370Z nismo verses Cayman S, base model Vette, Mustang Boss, Camaro SS, BMW 135i M, RX8, etc.

Randy Pobst put a new generation Cayman S around track over 3 seconds faster than a 370Z Nismo on Laguna Seca. I think that says a whole lot about how superior handling in Cayman is as the two cars have nearly identical power to weight ratios.

2009 Nissan Nismo 370Z Laps Laguna Seca - 2009 Motor Trend Best Driver's Car Competition Feature - Motor Trend Video

2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS Hot Lap At Laguna Seca - 2009 Best Driver's Car Feature - Motor Trend Video

2009 Porsche Cayman S Laps Laguna Seca - 2009 Best Driver's Car Video



I could have bought a used Cayman S but I liked the Nismo version of the 370 Z better. I think with a little setup work the Nismo can actually be faster than a stockish Cayman. Nissans tunning potential is much greater. Porsche is squeezing a lot of HP from those little 3.4 liter flat sixes and there isnt much you can do other than very expensive turbo kit to get more HP. Nismo on the other hand will reward intakes, free flowing cats, etc with some real HP gains.

i do not think it is the Cayman S's suspension in as much as it is weight and PDK. I bet a tuned base Z with Sport pack will be much closer to the new Cayman S. The regular Z weighs more than a Cayman S, but the Nismo weighs even more than the standard Z. Drop 50 pounds from the non Nismo, exhaust, intake, suspension mods and better tires. Game on (at least a little more); and at less cost than the CS.

[Shamu]

Originally Posted by Endgame

i do not think it is the Cayman S's suspension in as much as it is weight and PDK. I bet a tuned base Z with Sport pack will be much closer to the new Cayman S. The regular Z weighs more than a Cayman S, but the Nismo weighs even more than the standard Z. Drop 50 pounds from the non Nismo, exhaust, intake, suspension mods and better tires. Game on (at least a little more); and at less cost than the CS.

I would say it goes far beyond suspension advantage as the Cayman S has superior rear mid engine configuration, better chassis dynamics and very good brakes. Also think we have to keep conversations stock to stock as a Cayman S with good coil over system, intake , exhaust and light wheels would rock a 370z.

I also get a kick out of the belief that a 370z with same size wheels is significantly lighter than a Nismo. For track work I think the Nismo aero dynamics are superior as well. 50lbs on a car like 370z with high hp isn't going to impact lap times significantly. I'd say suspension, power, chassis stiffening and aero of the Nismo can more than justify the few lbs the car weighs over the standard car.

[Endgame]

Keep in mind the 370Z was extremely close to the privious Cayman S on the track, and turned better lap times than the CS in Best Motoring's debut comparo. The newer Cayman S's have the exact same suspension, brakes, and wheels as did the 2008. The only thing that is different is PDK. That is why the newer one is so much faster on the track now. I am tossing in the CS from a cost perspective. I say you can mod a Z to be better than the CS and still have $20k to play with. Most CS's I see are stock anyway....

I disagree with you on the weight. A modded Z can get enough aero downforce for the track with less weight. If the 'base + sport' Z is faster than the old CS on Tskuba, I wager a base+sport, tuned Z would be closer to the new PDK CS than the Nismo. You cannot beat lighter weight with as much as, if not more than the power of a Nismo. Most of these tuned base+sport are doing 370-380 crank HP.

IMO. BTW What is up with the Orca? Pretty cool...

[Shamu]

Originally Posted by Endgame

Keep in mind the 370Z was extremely close to the privious Cayman S on the track, and turned better lap times than the CS in Best Motoring's debut comparo. The newer Cayman S's have the exact same suspension, brakes, and wheels as did the 2008. The only thing that is different is PDK. That is why the newer one is so much faster on the track now. I am tossing in the CS from a cost perspective. I say you can mod a Z to be better than the CS and still have $20k to play with. Most CS's I see are stock anyway....

I disagree with you on the weight discussion. A modded Z can get enough aero downforce for the track with less weight. If the 'base + sport' Z is faster than the old CS on Tskuba, I wager a base+sport, tuned Z would be closer to the new PDK CS than the Nismo. You cannot beat lighter weight with as much as, if not more than the power of a Nismo. Most of these tuned base+sport are doing 370-380 crank HP.

IMO. BTW What is up with the Orca? Pretty cool...

Actually you are mistaken about the Cayman S and upgrades in 2009. In 2009 Cayman S was significantly upgraded with far more than just PDK option. Suspensions were improved with slight tweaks to spring rates, steering rack improved, A LSD was offered for the first time ever in the Cayman, engine was improved with direct injection adding 25 HP over 2008 car. Its all that combined that made the car faster than the 2008 CS. Also do you know if cars tested against the 370 Z had PASM or not? That makes a difference as well. I know because if I could have afforded a 2009 I might have bought one over the Nismo! LOL!

We can a agree to disagree on 370Z vs Nismo weight and aero discussion. Having spent a fair amount of time on the track I have a healthy respect for aerodynamics. You'd have to install aftermarket parts to get similar effects as Nismo bodywork. I'd venture to say Nismo bodywork cuts through air more efficiently than standard sport does - which should add top speed at end of straights. I also would contend that a Nismo doesnt haul around all that much more weight than a Sport if you were to do similar modifications to both cars. But again I'm looking at stock verses stock as I wouldnt buy a 370Z Sport and then spend a ton of money on coilovers, swaybars, body kits, wing, intakes, exhaust system, ECU tune, bracing, etc that I got on the Nismo as part of the sales price of the car, $36K. Dealers were much more willing to discount Nismo than standard cars so it just seemed like a better deal to me than buying a base car and modifying at great expense and time with untested parts. I have been doing this car performance car thing for a while and the Nismo crew did a very good job with this car. Nice to have it all together from the dealer. I hate doing aftermarket crud on street cars. Thats what race cars are for. I like keeping my street car relatively stock.

Orca? Oh yes Shamu is my pet name for the 370 Z because they are a bit hefty compared to most sports cars I have driven. But they are still dangerous and fast for their size. Hence Shamu is my nick name for the car. My car sort of looks like an Orca too with that whale tail.