The NISMO redeems itself...ish

phelan · 10-13-2009, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theDreamer

First, please use full words and sentences, makes your arguments a bit better and easier for others.
Second, you come in here stating "facts" that Nissan Japan cars using lighter material but with no links to real facts. Provide some, current, data on this and we will believe it but until then..well you see what happens.

Quote:

Originally Posted by chief_Roka

Huh...they use more lightweight materials because safety regulations in Japan are far less stringent, therefore their cars are lighter. I'm not attacking him, I'm just stating facts. Maybe if he wasn't telling me to slap people in the face and make racial comments it wouldn't have come out the way it did, but what's your point? I'm just being real. Speak with respect and you will be respected, talk down to people and expect the same. I'm not attacking him, I'm just giving back what I've received.

^fix'd per theDreamer request

course I had no idea how to recover that last section...hard to grammar correct "being real", because y'know, it's gangsta and all that

BTW, numbers for the JDM that I found have the weights ranging from 3,262 lbs to 3,373 lbs. In fact, this website (y“úŽY VŒ^ ƒtƒFƒAƒŒƒfƒBZ VŽÔî•ñz40”N–Ú‚ÌNEW Z‚Íu‘–‚èv‚Ìi‰»‚É“Á‰»‚µ‚½I 6‘ã–Ú VŒ^uƒtƒFƒAƒŒƒfƒBZvAƒfƒrƒ…[I :: CORISM) has it at 3351 lbs. I do expect that reported weight to be heavier than what it currently is, considering the article was in 12/2008, so since then there has been some small weight shaving and refinement of the vehicle.

Compare that to US spec: 3,232 to 3,300 for base 370Z to Nismo 370Z, respectively, I think it's within 'noise'. That is, the weights are comparatively equal, and your argument just went out the door.

TX_370 · 10-13-2009, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phelan

Compare that to US spec: 3,232 to 3,300 for base 370Z to Nismo 370Z, respectively, I think it's within 'noise'. That is, the weights are comparatively equal, and your argument just went out the door.

I have spent the last 20 minutes searching for Japanese motor vehicle safety regulations with any relation to what was stated and havent found anything... except that they are some of the most strict in the world.

Technik330 · 10-13-2009, 12:19 PM

....

I can appreciate the points that the "chief" is trying to make, but the car isn't going to be hundreds of pounds lighter,200+ lbs, period. If for some reason it is, you wont see it in the 370 price range.

This can be exemplified in several car manufacturers. Subaru has a Spec C STI which utilizes a "lighter" aluminum trunk then the US Spec GDB-D/E/F/G chasis. It reduces the trunk lid weight by an extremely generous, maybe 4-5+ lbs(Check Japanparts.com). The seats may be lighter as well, but overall you might shed 60-80, maybe even 100lbs at most, collectively, with the trunk, seats, etc.

BMW actually went pretty extreme with the CSL, but the weight reduction, I believe, wasn't sevreal hundred lbs. The CSL utilized a carbon roof, a plastic trunk, carbon shell'd seats and door panels...no a/c or power seats, radio, etc. The end result was maybe 100-150lbs, net loss. Keep in mind the car gained weight from the SMG transmission, larger more aggressive brakes, and larger wheels / tires as well. So collectively you're net weight loss isn't insane, but it's definitely there.

Again, I appreciate the points being brought up, and respect them. I, as a newer member on this forum, want facts. I'm aware some of my info may be slightly off, a couple pounds, maybe more, but I can assure you my accuracy is far closer than that of other presented information.

Feel free to check Japanparts.com for info on the STI Spec C Parts, for weights, and check M3forum for info on the CSL. I've been a member of the BMW, Subaru, and Honda communities, again, feel free to search what I posted. I'm not seeking to disrespect anyone, not by any means, I just want the correct info.

Thanks,

-Chris

rednek01 · 10-13-2009, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Technik330

....

I can appreciate the points that the "chief" is trying to make, but the car isn't going to be hundreds of pounds lighter,200+ lbs, period. If for some reason it is, you wont see it in the 370 price range.

This can be exmaplified in several car manufacturers. Subaru has a Spec C STI which utilizes a "lighter" aluminum trunk then the US Spec GDB-D/E/F/G chasis. It reduces the trunk lid weight by an extremely generous, maybe 4-5+ lbs(Check Japanparts.com). The seats may be lighter as well, but overall you might shed 60-80, maybe even 100lbs at most, collectively, with the trunk, seats, etc.

BMW actually went pretty extreme with the CSL, but the weight reduction, I believe, wasn't sevreal hundred lbs. The CSL utilized a carbon roof, a plastic trunk, carbon shell'd seats and door panels...no a/c or power seats, radio, etc. The end result was maybe 100-150lbs, net loss. Keep in mind the car gained weight from the SMG transmission, larger more aggressive brakes, and larger wheels / tires as well. So collectively you're net weight loss isn't insane, but it's definitely there.

Again, I appreciate the points being brought up, and respect them. I, as a newer member on this forum, want facts. I'm aware some of my info may be slightly off, a couple pounds, maybe more, but I can assure you my accuracy is far closer than that of other presented information.

Feel free to check Japanparts.com for info on the STI Spec C Parts, for weights, and check M3forum for info on the CSL. I've been a member of the BMW, Subaru, and Honda communities, again, feel free to search what I posted. I'm not seeking to disrespect anyone, not by any means, I just want the correct info.

Thanks,

-Chris

While that may be true for BMW, Subaru and Honda it has no bearing on the 370z. Also if you look those are special models and are not models offered in the U.S. where on the other hand the Nismo is a model offered both here and in Japan. I understand what you are saying and agree that some manufactures do take advantage of the lower safety standards in other countries however I have yet to see Nissan doing this in the Nismo 370z or any 370z for that matter and possibly even in the GT-R but dont quote me on that I haven't researched it.

JoeD · 10-13-2009, 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Technik330

....

I can appreciate the points that the "chief" is trying to make, but the car isn't going to be hundreds of pounds lighter,200+ lbs, period. If for some reason it is, you wont see it in the 370 price range.

This can be exemplified in several car manufacturers. Subaru has a Spec C STI which utilizes a "lighter" aluminum trunk then the US Spec GDB-D/E/F/G chasis. It reduces the trunk lid weight by an extremely generous, maybe 4-5+ lbs(Check Japanparts.com). The seats may be lighter as well, but overall you might shed 60-80, maybe even 100lbs at most, collectively, with the trunk, seats, etc.

BMW actually went pretty extreme with the CSL, but the weight reduction, I believe, wasn't sevreal hundred lbs. The CSL utilized a carbon roof, a plastic trunk, carbon shell'd seats and door panels...no a/c or power seats, radio, etc. The end result was maybe 100-150lbs, net loss. Keep in mind the car gained weight from the SMG transmission, larger more aggressive brakes, and larger wheels / tires as well. So collectively you're net weight loss isn't insane, but it's definitely there.

Again, I appreciate the points being brought up, and respect them. I, as a newer member on this forum, want facts. I'm aware some of my info may be slightly off, a couple pounds, maybe more, but I can assure you my accuracy is far closer than that of other presented information.

Feel free to check Japanparts.com for info on the STI Spec C Parts, for weights, and check M3forum for info on the CSL. I've been a member of the BMW, Subaru, and Honda communities, again, feel free to search what I posted. I'm not seeking to disrespect anyone, not by any means, I just want the correct info.

Thanks,

-Chris

This post is a fail, not because you are wrong, but because you are addressing the guy's point incorrectly.

In his nonsensical tirade, he mentioned cars over-seas being 300-500 lbs. lighter due to the "lack of safety regulations" and "metallurgy." He really is under the impression that cars in Japan don't have bumper-supports, side-impact beams, or perhaps even frame-rails.

You are correct, though...there are lighter, more race-oriented trims levels sold elsewhere, and the Spec-C and CSL are good examples. They are not, however, related to his profound and eloquent points of view.

Technik330 · 10-13-2009, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeD

This post is a fail, not because you are wrong, but because you are addressing the guy's point incorrectly.

In his nonsensical tirade, he mentioned cars over-seas being 300-500 lbs. lighter due to the "lack of safety regulations" and "metallurgy." He really is under the impression that cars in Japan don't have bumper-supports, side-impact beams, or perhaps even frame-rails.

You are correct, though...there are lighter, more race-oriented trims levels sold elsewhere, and the Spec-C and CSL are good examples. They are not, however, related to his profound and eloquent points of view.

LMAO, a fail is lame, I'd go with a factual tangent-

I should've posted a little more specifically, the cars I mentioned are cars that aren't available here due to our DOT regulations, which make them lighter, more agile, quicker etc becuase they can avoid these regulations.

I was going to use the glass in JDM Hondas; of which I wouldn't call safe glass, like we have here. It's lighter, but breaks into sharper pieces, not like DOT glass here. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong- The cars I noted are cogent examples of what he's eluding to, less safety, better materials, higher cost

Thanks,

-Chris

Nismo_370 · 10-13-2009, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Technik330

LMAO, a fail is lame, I'd go with a factual tangent-

I should've posted a little more specifically, the cars I mentioned are cars that aren't available here due to our DOT regulations, which make them lighter, more agile, quicker etc becuase they can avoid these regulations.

I was going to use the glass in JDM Hondas; of which I wouldn't call safe glass, like we have here. It's lighter, but breaks into sharper pieces, not like DOT glass here. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong- The cars I noted are cogent examples of what he's eluding to, less safety, better materials, higher cost

Thanks,

-Chris

Don't worry man... he would still find a way to poop on your post even if you specified it better...he is a pro

Modshack · 10-13-2009, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nismo_370

Don't worry man... he would still find a way to poop on your post even if you specified it better...he is a pro

You still don't get it. You took what could have been a learning moment and turned it into a "You against the world" attitude. I saw occasional glimmers of
"Ah Ha's" in some of your posts but you kept on with the denial stuff, you're right, we're wrong. That thread is closed because of your attitude, not because of anyone Hatin on you.. Your best bet is to re-invent yourself with a new forum handle and maybe some of those guys you pissed off will forget who you (really) are...

Good luck.

Technik330 · 10-13-2009, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nismo_370

Don't worry man... he would still find a way to poop on your post even if you specified it better...he is a pro

It's alright, the points were cogent enough for some to benefit, so it was worth it.

Modshack · 10-13-2009, 01:05 PM

Since this thread has deteriorated into a discussion of weight, you might want to see what it really means in real life application. 100lbs = only a tenth of a second in the quarter.
Per the calculator it takes 10hp to make up that 100lbs...Drop a few lbs or add a few HP, it's all the same in the end..

Play with your own numbers here: 1/4 Mile ET Calculator

Technik330 · 10-13-2009, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Modshack

Since this thread has deteriorated into a discussion of weight, you might want to see what it really means in real life application. 100lbs = only a tenth of a second in the quarter.
Per the calculator it takes 10hp to make up that 100lbs...Drop a few lbs or add a few HP, it's all the same in the end..

Play with your own numbers here: 1/4 Mile ET Calculator

That's a valid fact, but weight reduction goes further than "drag" racing- lighter weight is beneficial in braking, handling, and general acceleration in and out of turns, etc.

I agree add a little power, take some weight out, and you get

Modshack · 10-13-2009, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Technik330

That's a valid fact, but weight reduction goes further than "drag" racing- lighter weight is beneficial in braking, handling, and general acceleration in and out of turns, etc.

I agree....I'm not a drag racer, but it's the only way to factually determine the cars acceleration potential and the true differences weight has on the overall situation so it may be of use to some. Too many guys here are either Quarter mile or horsepower focused. Makes me think I'm on the Corvette forum...

Dropping unsprung weight, chassis balance and the things you mention are more important to me but that falls on a lot of deaf ears when you start into the HP wars (witness the now closed Nismo dyno thread).

Ah well...

10-13-2009, 12:19 PM	#3 (permalink)
Technik330 Base Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: SoCal Posts: 53 Drives: 05' BMW 330Ci ZHP Rep Power: 16	.... I can appreciate the points that the "chief" is trying to make, but the car isn't going to be hundreds of pounds lighter,200+ lbs, period. If for some reason it is, you wont see it in the 370 price range. This can be exemplified in several car manufacturers. Subaru has a Spec C STI which utilizes a "lighter" aluminum trunk then the US Spec GDB-D/E/F/G chasis. It reduces the trunk lid weight by an extremely generous, maybe 4-5+ lbs(Check Japanparts.com). The seats may be lighter as well, but overall you might shed 60-80, maybe even 100lbs at most, collectively, with the trunk, seats, etc. BMW actually went pretty extreme with the CSL, but the weight reduction, I believe, wasn't sevreal hundred lbs. The CSL utilized a carbon roof, a plastic trunk, carbon shell'd seats and door panels...no a/c or power seats, radio, etc. The end result was maybe 100-150lbs, net loss. Keep in mind the car gained weight from the SMG transmission, larger more aggressive brakes, and larger wheels / tires as well. So collectively you're net weight loss isn't insane, but it's definitely there. Again, I appreciate the points being brought up, and respect them. I, as a newer member on this forum, want facts. I'm aware some of my info may be slightly off, a couple pounds, maybe more, but I can assure you my accuracy is far closer than that of other presented information. Feel free to check Japanparts.com for info on the STI Spec C Parts, for weights, and check M3forum for info on the CSL. I've been a member of the BMW, Subaru, and Honda communities, again, feel free to search what I posted. I'm not seeking to disrespect anyone, not by any means, I just want the correct info. Thanks, -Chris Last edited by Technik330; 10-13-2009 at 12:27 PM.

10-13-2009, 01:05 PM	#10 (permalink)
Modshack A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Greenville NC Posts: 2,883 Drives: 370Z Sport Rep Power: 977	Since this thread has deteriorated into a discussion of weight, you might want to see what it really means in real life application. 100lbs = only a tenth of a second in the quarter. Per the calculator it takes 10hp to make up that 100lbs...Drop a few lbs or add a few HP, it's all the same in the end.. Play with your own numbers here: 1/4 Mile ET Calculator __________________ Steal my car! (SOLD)...Now Porsche Cayman S Oil Cooler DIY: Here! Last edited by Modshack; 10-13-2009 at 01:09 PM.

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