NOVA/DC/MD - Z's & Coffee Saturday's at 10AM in Fairfax, VA & Columbia, MD

Red__Zed · 01-16-2013, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

Drive them and you'll see that it's a vast difference. Like Red__Zed mentioned the breakaway characteristics at the limit are FAR better on the PSS than they are with the PZero. PZero might run a quick lap but it's not going to compete with PSS over multiple.

not to mention the way the breakaway characteristics dramatically change the way you would drive (on the street).

Say, for instance, someone was cruising along hot. If they had Pzeros on, they might not know they needed to slow down, as the tires wouldn't give much feedback. The PSS on the other hand, gives plenty of feedback. There's fair warning before they let go...so, if you were...say...hauling *** along the edge of a cliff, a wise driver would SLOW DOWN RATHER THAN TRYING TO KILL US ALL TO DEMONSTRATE THAT PSS' GRIP WELL ON GRASS TOO

b1adesofcha0s · 01-16-2013, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

not to mention the way the breakaway characteristics dramatically change the way you would drive (on the street).

Say, for instance, someone was cruising along hot. If they had Pzeros on, they might not know they needed to slow down, as the tires wouldn't give much feedback. The PSS on the other hand, gives plenty of feedback. There's fair warning before they let go...so, if you were...say...hauling *** along the edge of a cliff, a wise driver would SLOW DOWN RATHER THAN TRYING TO KILL US ALL TO DEMONSTRATE THAT PSS' GRIP WELL ON GRASS TOO

Red__Zed · 01-16-2013, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by italy3541

well im not saying you are wrong.. but i do find it hard to believe that there is a vast difference.. when professional drivers tested the tires the comparison is close.. not that everyone doesnt value the opnions of all others on this site.. but if the pros say they are close then im gonna have to go with what they say...

again didnt say pirelli is better. i just offered what i like as a option.. but lesson learned i will just keep my opnions to myself....

pirelli was a fine brand, but they've got very little in the way of serious offerings in the range we'd be shopping.

The fact is, Pzeros (which steve had on his car prior to the PSS') are not far off in terms of raw grip. They're actually a decent tire, but the way they feel does not inspire confidence. That's fine when the pro's are testing, but if you're not dialed into your car, the limits on the pzeros feel MUCH lower.

m4a1mustang · 01-16-2013, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by italy3541

here is the chart of all the tires used in f1.. for a while they used different brands then switched to just 1.

Formula One tyres - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Yup.

The trouble with multiple tire suppliers is managing competition and safety.

All race series want to have good racing. Tire compound is a big factor in how competitively cars will race. When everyone is on the same compound (or at least has the same compound options) it keeps competition closer.

Also, tire wars can get out of hand. It happened in NASCAR when Hoosier and Goodyear were both suppliers. They battled to make the grippiest, fastest tire possible... it turned out to be terribly unsafe. The Hoosier tires were blowing out often resulting in massive crashes. At the peak of the tire war a decision was made to go back to one supplier for the sake of safety and competition.

When you've got just one supplier they can work on balancing speed and safety, instead of just focusing on speed.

italy3541 · 01-16-2013, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

not to mention the way the breakaway characteristics dramatically change the way you would drive (on the street).

Say, for instance, someone was cruising along hot. If they had Pzeros on, they might not know they needed to slow down, as the tires wouldn't give much feedback. The PSS on the other hand, gives plenty of feedback. There's fair warning before they let go...so, if you were...say...hauling *** along the edge of a cliff, a wise driver would SLOW DOWN RATHER THAN TRYING TO KILL US ALL TO DEMONSTRATE THAT PSS' GRIP WELL ON GRASS TOO

ok show me where on any chart that shows this VAST difference.. id love to see.. the charts i see show them all very close.. maybe for you and your driving style there is a vast difference.. but i doubt u are at the same level as the pros...

so again i will agree that overall yes the pss are a better tire..(I NEVER SAID THEY WERENT.) all i did was give a alternative for a tire that i like.. that in ever chart i look at is very very close to the pss even tho its a older dated material..

Red__Zed · 01-16-2013, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by italy3541

ok show me where on any chart that shows this VAST difference.. id love to see.. the charts i see show them all very close.. maybe for you and your driving style there is a vast difference.. but i doubt u are at the same level as the pros...

so again i will agree that overall yes the pss are a better tire..(I NEVER SAID THEY WERENT.) all i did was give a alternative for a tire that i like.. that in ever chart i look at is very very close to the pss even tho its a older dated material..

the word vast is nowhere in my post, so stop trying to strawman.

There's no chart for breakaway characteristic, but if you've driven on both tires it is immensely clear.

m4a1mustang · 01-16-2013, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

pirelli was a fine brand, but they've got very little in the way of serious offerings in the range we'd be shopping.

The fact is, Pzeros (which steve had on his car prior to the PSS') are not far off in terms of raw grip. They're actually a decent tire, but the way they feel does not inspire confidence. That's fine when the pro's are testing, but if you're not dialed into your car, the limits on the pzeros feel MUCH lower.

The PZeros had massive grip (relative to something like an RE050A) but don't feel as good as the PSS at the limit. They also ride harsher, wear faster, and are louder.

PSS is really a great example of new tire technology and what's to come. I'm sure Pirelli will be refreshing their lineup with new goodies soon.

b1adesofcha0s · 01-16-2013, 10:41 AM

Steef go answer my tires size question on FB

italy3541 · 01-16-2013, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

The PZeros had massive grip (relative to something like an RE050A) but don't feel as good as the PSS at the limit. They also ride harsher, wear faster, and are louder.

PSS is really a great example of new tire technology and what's to come. I'm sure Pirelli will be refreshing their lineup with new goodies soon.

i agree with new tire technology.. but one of the things i saw many times in all comparisons about the pss is that they wish it had a softer ride... also going back to the charts all the areas you just said when compaired by pros the difference is very slight...

b1adesofcha0s · 01-16-2013, 10:44 AM

I think what he means is that for the pros it's not very different, but for us non-pros it is different.

Red__Zed · 01-16-2013, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b1adesofcha0s

I think what he means is that for the pros it's not very different, but for us non-pros it is different.

and even more so, street driving vs not.

I would never drive the pzeros near the limit on the street. breakaway is far too unpredictable, relative to something like the PSS that has even terrible drivers like steve taking to the limit of their on-grass adhesion

italy3541 · 01-16-2013, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

the word vast is nowhere in my post, so stop trying to strawman.

There's no chart for breakaway characteristic, but if you've driven on both tires it is immensely clear.

sorry about the miss quote.. im not the best with typeing..

anyway i have driven both. iv owned both (not on the 370z).. for me i liked the pirellis better.. again my opnion... but when i pushed my car i felt i had way more grip with the pirellis, which gave me more confidence allowing me to push my car harder..

Red__Zed · 01-16-2013, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by italy3541

sorry about the miss quote.. im not the best with typeing..

anyway i have driven both. iv owned both (not on the 370z).. for me i liked the pirellis better.. again my opnion... but when i pushed my car i felt i had way more grip with the pirellis, which gave me more confidence allowing me to push my car harder..

which tires?

comparing brands is ridiculous. they leapfrog each other every couple years.

aniceh · 01-16-2013, 10:52 AM

I think you all need to adopt the spelling "tyres." Makes it more fun.

MightyBobo · 01-16-2013, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by italy3541

sorry about the miss quote.. im not the best with typeing..

anyway i have driven both. iv owned both (not on the 370z).. for me i liked the pirellis better.. again my opnion... but when i pushed my car i felt i had way more grip with the pirellis, which gave me more confidence allowing me to push my car harder..

Italy - playing a little catch-up here, but just curious: have you ever tracked or Auto-X-ed? Or are you basing a lot of this off of just an occasional spirited drive?

01-16-2013, 10:41 AM	#7253 (permalink)
b1adesofcha0s A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: MD Posts: 40,963 Drives: HypeTrain Choo Choo! Rep Power: 141	Steef go answer my tires size question on FB __________________ Project: b1adeZmobile (2009 370Z) \| Uprev Tune by AAM Competition \| Berk Exhaust Project: b1adeZmobile 2.0 (2014 C7 Z51) \| Corsa Xtreme Exhaust

01-16-2013, 10:44 AM	#7255 (permalink)
b1adesofcha0s A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: MD Posts: 40,963 Drives: HypeTrain Choo Choo! Rep Power: 141	I think what he means is that for the pros it's not very different, but for us non-pros it is different. __________________ Project: b1adeZmobile (2009 370Z) \| Uprev Tune by AAM Competition \| Berk Exhaust Project: b1adeZmobile 2.0 (2014 C7 Z51) \| Corsa Xtreme Exhaust

01-16-2013, 10:52 AM	#7259 (permalink)
aniceh A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2012 Location: Parts Unknown Posts: 7,216 Drives: '12 GM 7AT S/T Rep Power: 41	I think you all need to adopt the spelling "tyres." Makes it more fun. m4a1mustang and b1adesofcha0s like this.

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