theDreamer's Z

rednek01 · 07-23-2010, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caravanshaka

he's not making MORE power with Less boost thought. He is making more power at the same level of boost than he would with stock exhaust though.

Basically. His efficient setup causes that pulley to only push 5.5 lbs of boost. If he replaced his exhaust with stock components, he would make 8 lbs of boost, and would make more power than his current setup. HOWEVER, if he gets his current setup up to 8 lbs of boost by way of a new pulley, he will make MORE power than the 8 lbs of boost did with stock exhaust.

He is finally making some torque at least!

JB-370z · 07-23-2010, 04:36 PM

We think these numbers are off guys. We are going to take it to a Dynojet ASAP.
Edit: Those TQ numbers dont sound right either.

Zat_Zuma · 07-23-2010, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theDreamer

Ok, got the phone call.

5.5PSI
371HP
343TQ

I'm disappointed with the results. Is that the stage 1 kit with a 8 psi pulley? I know your running the LTH's too ... but damn!

I hope the new dyno shows better results ..... but damn!

Going to install the stock headers and a high flow cat with CBE and see if it improves?

JB-370z · 07-23-2010, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zat_Zuma

I'm disappointed with the results. Is that the stage 1 kit with a 8 psi pulley? I know your running the LTH's too ... but damn!

I hope the new dyno shows better results ..... but damn!

Going to install the stock headers and a high flow cat with CBE and see if it improves?

That is on a Mustang dyno that reads much lower than a DynoJet

theDreamer · 07-23-2010, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zat_Zuma

I'm disappointed with the results. Is that the stage 1 kit with a 8 psi pulley? I know your running the LTH's too ... but damn!

I hope the new dyno shows better results ..... but damn!

Going to install the stock headers and a high flow cat with CBE and see if it improves?

I beg to differ, this is actually a great starting place right now.
The car is running an 8PSI pulley, combined with the long tube headers and aftermarket exhaust it is opening it a lot. Hopefully we can get a smaller pulley soon and jump back on a dyno to see how things improve when we run the car all the way up to 8PSI.

I know many of you want me to just throw back on the stock manifold and cats, but that is not going to be what is happening.
This setup is working very well, we are running an 8PSI pulley which was designed and tuned for stock manifold and cats. Nothing is disappointing or "wrong" currently, this is about what I expected with my setup. This puts us in a great position to work on this car and provide the best possible setup for what we have, and improve this platform beyond what anyone was expecting.

My setup from the start was not going to be an exact 1 to 1 copy of what GTM is producing. I have decided to go my own route with the long tube headers, and Sam at GTM is helping out tremendously on this and we hope to move forward with some great results soon.

Chriz · 07-23-2010, 05:55 PM

Awesome. Cant wait for new results

RCZ · 07-23-2010, 06:14 PM

Some of you guys are pretty clueless...just because its not hitting 8psi of boost, it doesnt mean he isnt flowing the same amount of air he would be at 8psi. Yes its more free flowing, thats why the boost doesnt build up. The problem is that he CAN'T just keep adding boost because that will add air volume. The real engine killer is flow, not psi. So for those of you who say "oh we can just add a 12psi pulley and it will even out" that is not the case. The motor wont last.

You are better off running 371whp at 5.5psi if that is what the car wants to do. I wouldn't push the stock block too far over 450whp on a dynojet on a car that will not be running race gas regularly.
371 on a mustang dyno is about 415-420 on a Dynojet, I guarantee thats what you're going to find. ( on a side note, stop rushing to find a dynojet because you think these numbers suck) The dynojet isnt going to make your car go faster or flow better. I know you want to see higher numbers..

FWIW...my advice would be to leave it as is and enjoy your car where its. Its safe, its making good power. Don't go risk something and waste more money just because you want to make people happy.

Zat_Zuma · 07-23-2010, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theDreamer

I beg to differ, this is actually a great starting place right now.
The car is running an 8PSI pulley, combined with the long tube headers and aftermarket exhaust it is opening it a lot. Hopefully we can get a smaller pulley soon and jump back on a dyno to see how things improve when we run the car all the way up to 8PSI.

I know many of you want me to just throw back on the stock manifold and cats, but that is not going to be what is happening.
This setup is working very well, we are running an 8PSI pulley which was designed and tuned for stock manifold and cats. Nothing is disappointing or "wrong" currently, this is about what I expected with my setup. This puts us in a great position to work on this car and provide the best possible setup for what we have, and improve this platform beyond what anyone was expecting.

My setup from the start was not going to be an exact 1 to 1 copy of what GTM is producing. I have decided to go my own route with the long tube headers, and Sam at GTM is helping out tremendously on this and we hope to move forward with some great results soon.

It does sound like a good plan and I wish you all the best in your results.

I am following this thread closely because this is the direction I wish to go too ...... if I EVER get delivery of the SC before the end of summer.

Out of curiousity .... what is the diameter of the 8 psi pulley? and I'm assuming this is the stage 1 SC?

Thanks

theDreamer · 07-23-2010, 07:08 PM

RCZ, definitely in no rush to find a dyno jet, it will just be something on the to do list once I get everything back and things settle down a bit. I am very excited to get the car back tomorrow, it is being sent over to the audio shot to fix a slight bulge in the screen and after that it is mine.

Zat Zuma, this is the stage one SC kit, on the size of the pulley I will have to get back to you on that, or if someone else can chime in and answer that would be great.

And for those in Houston, it will be at Planet Zero tomorrow for the Access Zero meet if you want to see it.

JB-370z · 07-23-2010, 08:18 PM

Everyone in here is nuts to think those TQ numbers are normal. I could be wrong for sure, but they look real high.

LiquidZ · 07-23-2010, 09:41 PM

Dreamer, I think you have the right idea and you make a very good point. The tune you were provided by Sam was for stock manifolds and cats. Adjusting the tune to include the long tubes will make up for some of that difference.

An example of a long tube header installation on a supercharged vehicle was a Kooks long tube header setup on a supercharged Saleen S281 Mustang. I have included the video below. After bolting on the headers, the installers retuned the vehicle to account for the new headers and made an additonal 40 rwhp and 35 lb-ft of torque.

RCZ, I'm not sure I agree with air flow being the killer of an engine. Your engine can be thought of as an air pump. In order to make gobs and gobs of power, you want to inhale and exhale as much as air as possible. This in turn means you can burn more fuel. This is where forced induction comes into play as turbocharger and supercharger kits will increase the mass flow rate of air into an engine. However, when picking a forced induction kit, you need to ask yourself one question; "at what PSI can I meet the required mass flow rate of air to reach my goal for XYZ rwhp?" More often than not, stock rotating assemblies will be the limiting factor in reaching your horsepower goals. The additional PSI will raise your peak cylinder pressures which not only means added compressive force on your pistons, but increased cylinder temperatures which leads to detonation.

JB-370z · 07-23-2010, 10:26 PM

How was this tune based off stock headers again??? I could be wrong but Sam built this tune in a 4-5 stage process because the first tune would not start. In turn a whole new tune needed to be built around Dreamers ECU in 4-5 stages. Once again I could be wrong but this tune was not based on the stock headers but Dreamers current config. I really think the mustang dyno is NOT giving us the data we need and I will talk more on this later. Once again I could be wrong but until the car gets to a dynojet I cannot say much more for this matter. Dreamer, if I have to pay for the dyno myself I will, but lets put this thing on a dynojet, we need more pure data. .

Edit: For the note, the current tune that is on the car could not have been better built. The car is running perfect in every way and the data proves it. The numbers are oviously off in conjunction with the psi levels, and I have my doubts on the config of the mustang dyno as well. I am sure everyone has their own idea's at this point and everyone's input is apperciated!

Edit 2: Dreamer, get a suspension and clean your engine bay!

Chriz · 07-24-2010, 12:34 PM

How long are you staying at PZ till? i might stop by

RCZ · 07-24-2010, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LiquidZ

RCZ, I'm not sure I agree with air flow being the killer of an engine. Your engine can be thought of as an air pump. In order to make gobs and gobs of power, you want to inhale and exhale as much as air as possible. This in turn means you can burn more fuel. This is where forced induction comes into play as turbocharger and supercharger kits will increase the mass flow rate of air into an engine. However, when picking a forced induction kit, you need to ask yourself one question; "at what PSI can I meet the required mass flow rate of air to reach my goal for XYZ rwhp?" More often than not, stock rotating assemblies will be the limiting factor in reaching your horsepower goals. The additional PSI will raise your peak cylinder pressures which not only means added compressive force on your pistons, but increased cylinder temperatures which leads to detonation.

I'm not guessing, I was told this by my tuner who knows what he is doing and understands how the engine/boost works better than any of us. More air means more fuel means more energy. You said it yourself, you are looking for a target CFM...

Yes btw, that torque number looks off. I would expect something lower from the mustangdyne. More like 290.

theDreamer · 07-24-2010, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chriz

How long are you staying at PZ till? i might stop by

I should be there most of the night, usually if we leave it is around 11 or 11.30.
RCZ, not sure, going to pick the car up now and look over everything and see how it looks and such. Oh, and of course drive it.

07-23-2010, 04:36 PM	#482 (permalink)
JB-370z A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Houston, Tx Posts: 1,859 Drives: Stage 2 Twin Turbos Rep Power: 19	We think these numbers are off guys. We are going to take it to a Dynojet ASAP. Edit: Those TQ numbers dont sound right either. __________________ ll Baker Tuning ll GTM ll Powerhouse Amuse ll HKS ll Up-Rev ll iForged ll AP Racing ll Pioneer ll SPL ll Bride ll Top Secret ll OS Giken ll GTM Stage 2 Twin Turboed 370z (First in Texas, Thanks To Baker Tuning)

07-23-2010, 05:55 PM	#486 (permalink)
Chriz Track Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Houston TX Posts: 626 Drives: '10 370z PW 7AT Rep Power: 17	Awesome. Cant wait for new results __________________ PW 7AT w/Sports Pkg Hook Em!

07-23-2010, 06:14 PM	#487 (permalink)
RCZ A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Miami Posts: 6,403 Drives: '09 370Z Rep Power: 1119	Some of you guys are pretty clueless...just because its not hitting 8psi of boost, it doesnt mean he isnt flowing the same amount of air he would be at 8psi. Yes its more free flowing, thats why the boost doesnt build up. The problem is that he CAN'T just keep adding boost because that will add air volume. The real engine killer is flow, not psi. So for those of you who say "oh we can just add a 12psi pulley and it will even out" that is not the case. The motor wont last. You are better off running 371whp at 5.5psi if that is what the car wants to do. I wouldn't push the stock block too far over 450whp on a dynojet on a car that will not be running race gas regularly. 371 on a mustang dyno is about 415-420 on a Dynojet, I guarantee thats what you're going to find. ( on a side note, stop rushing to find a dynojet because you think these numbers suck) The dynojet isnt going to make your car go faster or flow better. I know you want to see higher numbers.. FWIW...my advice would be to leave it as is and enjoy your car where its. Its safe, its making good power. Don't go risk something and waste more money just because you want to make people happy. Last edited by RCZ; 07-23-2010 at 06:17 PM.

07-23-2010, 07:08 PM	#489 (permalink)
theDreamer A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 30,879 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 4210	RCZ, definitely in no rush to find a dyno jet, it will just be something on the to do list once I get everything back and things settle down a bit. I am very excited to get the car back tomorrow, it is being sent over to the audio shot to fix a slight bulge in the screen and after that it is mine. Zat Zuma, this is the stage one SC kit, on the size of the pulley I will have to get back to you on that, or if someone else can chime in and answer that would be great. And for those in Houston, it will be at Planet Zero tomorrow for the Access Zero meet if you want to see it. __________________ theDreamer's Z // Fast Intentions // Uprev // GTM // HKS // TEIN theDreamer's Silvia // URAS // GREDDY Houston Zs // Facebook // Twitter // Instagram

07-23-2010, 08:18 PM	#490 (permalink)
JB-370z A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Houston, Tx Posts: 1,859 Drives: Stage 2 Twin Turbos Rep Power: 19	Everyone in here is nuts to think those TQ numbers are normal. I could be wrong for sure, but they look real high. __________________ ll Baker Tuning ll GTM ll Powerhouse Amuse ll HKS ll Up-Rev ll iForged ll AP Racing ll Pioneer ll SPL ll Bride ll Top Secret ll OS Giken ll GTM Stage 2 Twin Turboed 370z (First in Texas, Thanks To Baker Tuning) Last edited by JB-370z; 07-23-2010 at 08:35 PM.

07-23-2010, 09:41 PM	#491 (permalink)
LiquidZ A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 1,940 Drives: Mag. Black 2009 370Z Rep Power: 705	Dreamer, I think you have the right idea and you make a very good point. The tune you were provided by Sam was for stock manifolds and cats. Adjusting the tune to include the long tubes will make up for some of that difference. An example of a long tube header installation on a supercharged vehicle was a Kooks long tube header setup on a supercharged Saleen S281 Mustang. I have included the video below. After bolting on the headers, the installers retuned the vehicle to account for the new headers and made an additonal 40 rwhp and 35 lb-ft of torque. RCZ, I'm not sure I agree with air flow being the killer of an engine. Your engine can be thought of as an air pump. In order to make gobs and gobs of power, you want to inhale and exhale as much as air as possible. This in turn means you can burn more fuel. This is where forced induction comes into play as turbocharger and supercharger kits will increase the mass flow rate of air into an engine. However, when picking a forced induction kit, you need to ask yourself one question; "at what PSI can I meet the required mass flow rate of air to reach my goal for XYZ rwhp?" More often than not, stock rotating assemblies will be the limiting factor in reaching your horsepower goals. The additional PSI will raise your peak cylinder pressures which not only means added compressive force on your pistons, but increased cylinder temperatures which leads to detonation. __________________

07-23-2010, 10:26 PM	#492 (permalink)
JB-370z A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Houston, Tx Posts: 1,859 Drives: Stage 2 Twin Turbos Rep Power: 19	How was this tune based off stock headers again??? I could be wrong but Sam built this tune in a 4-5 stage process because the first tune would not start. In turn a whole new tune needed to be built around Dreamers ECU in 4-5 stages. Once again I could be wrong but this tune was not based on the stock headers but Dreamers current config. I really think the mustang dyno is NOT giving us the data we need and I will talk more on this later. Once again I could be wrong but until the car gets to a dynojet I cannot say much more for this matter. Dreamer, if I have to pay for the dyno myself I will, but lets put this thing on a dynojet, we need more pure data. . Edit: For the note, the current tune that is on the car could not have been better built. The car is running perfect in every way and the data proves it. The numbers are oviously off in conjunction with the psi levels, and I have my doubts on the config of the mustang dyno as well. I am sure everyone has their own idea's at this point and everyone's input is apperciated! Edit 2: Dreamer, get a suspension and clean your engine bay! __________________ ll Baker Tuning ll GTM ll Powerhouse Amuse ll HKS ll Up-Rev ll iForged ll AP Racing ll Pioneer ll SPL ll Bride ll Top Secret ll OS Giken ll GTM Stage 2 Twin Turboed 370z (First in Texas, Thanks To Baker Tuning) Last edited by JB-370z; 07-23-2010 at 10:38 PM.

07-24-2010, 12:34 PM	#493 (permalink)
Chriz Track Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Houston TX Posts: 626 Drives: '10 370z PW 7AT Rep Power: 17	How long are you staying at PZ till? i might stop by __________________ PW 7AT w/Sports Pkg Hook Em!