wstar's Journal

wstar · 09-17-2012, 12:38 PM

CL Front Pads arrive sometime tomorrow. Gonna see if they can clean up these rotors or if I need to chuck rotors again

. Then I need to see how RC6 + XP8 works for front/rear balance, but I bet it's pretty ok. I was tempted to order some rear RC5+ with them, but I'm a little scared they'd be too aggressive in the rear for this car and get me back into heavy ice-mode issues.

ChrisSlicks · 09-18-2012, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wstar

CL Front Pads arrive sometime tomorrow. Gonna see if they can clean up these rotors or if I need to chuck rotors again

. Then I need to see how RC6 + XP8 works for front/rear balance, but I bet it's pretty ok. I was tempted to order some rear RC5+ with them, but I'm a little scared they'd be too aggressive in the rear for this car and get me back into heavy ice-mode issues.

I actually think the co-efficient of friction is higher on the XP8's than it is on the RC5+. I believe XP8 is around 0.58-0.60 and the RC5+ is about 0.4. Problem is I think the RC6 is about 0.5, so with 0.6 is the rear it could be trouble. The ABS likes the low friction a lot better but the rear has to be the same or lower than the front.

wstar · 09-18-2012, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisSlicks

I actually think the co-efficient of friction is higher on the XP8's than it is on the RC5+. I believe XP8 is around 0.58-0.60 and the RC5+ is about 0.4. Problem is I think the RC6 is about 0.5, so with 0.6 is the rear it could be trouble. The ABS likes the low friction a lot better but the rear has to be the same or lower than the front.

Oh I didn't realize the XP8 was so high. The XP10/12/16 must be insane then; even the 10 felt pretty high to me in the front. Have you tried RC5+ in the rear as an option?

ChrisSlicks · 09-18-2012, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wstar

Oh I didn't realize the XP8 was so high. The XP10/12/16 must be insane then; even the 10 felt pretty high to me in the front. Have you tried RC5+ in the rear as an option?

They don't make RC5+ in the AP Racing size unfortunately. Up front I have used RC6, 6E and 8.

VoBoy · 09-17-2012, 11:00 PM

Hey Brandon! It's Tim. Good to see you again at the track. Are you signed up for November? I'll be there.

Here's some footage I got from our last session. Pretty interesting to watch our screw ups!

wstar · 09-18-2012, 12:04 AM

Yeah I'll be there in November for sure.

I had to go back and watch again once I realized I could use your right mirror to see when I was close after that first pass. After you went back in the lead the second time I seem to vanish though. Let me dig through my list of excuses...

It's funny that in two places we made pretty much the same mistake but on different laps (going too deep in the U-turn after the front straight, and kicking the tail out on the sweeper to the back straight). I was kinda slipping all over the place that run, but it was a fun end to a long weekend

I don't think I've ever heard my own car going all out before, from an outside perspective. 5:10 into the vid, love that sound. Fast Intentions exhaust is awesome

VoBoy · 09-18-2012, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wstar

Yeah I'll be there in November for sure.

I had to go back and watch again once I realized I could use your right mirror to see when I was close after that first pass. After you went back in the lead the second time I seem to vanish though. Let me dig through my list of excuses...

It's funny that in two places we made pretty much the same mistake but on different laps (going too deep in the U-turn after the front straight, and kicking the tail out on the sweeper to the back straight). I was kinda slipping all over the place that run, but it was a fun end to a long weekend

I don't think I've ever heard my own car going all out before, from an outside perspective. 5:10 into the vid, love that sound. Fast Intentions exhaust is awesome

Haha yeah I noticed the same thing! Funny how having some friendly competition with people ya know brings out some bad driving practices! I know was scaring my instructor a bit, throwing almost everything he taught me over the weekend out the window for a lap or two there!

As for after the second pass, I'm sure you had a ton of feedback to digest from your instructor and then traffic!

We need to line up more often... I'm not sure why we didn't earlier in the weekend. Our cars are pretty evenly matched.. or drivers! At least until one of us gets a 1up mod on each other haha.

Yeah I haven't heard my exhaust from the outside, and I get a lot of compliments this time around with this new exhaust than the previous single.

Hopefully you'll have your gadgets working right at the next event and you can record my cars funky sounds.

wstar · 09-18-2012, 02:55 PM

Well, I'll give it a go and see what happens

VDC_OFF · 09-18-2012, 03:10 PM

I need to get out there with you guys to try out this thing called "traction". But with all the issues of brake pads and oil temps, sounds like it will just add to the list of mods to buy since I dont have problems with those parts just yet.

wstar · 09-18-2012, 03:43 PM

It's really not as scary as it seems if you just go out for a light weekend once in a blue moon. It's when you get addicted and start pushing things a bit further that all your money disappears

VDC_OFF · 09-18-2012, 03:44 PM

mine started disappearing when I purchased the car

wstar · 10-05-2012, 09:43 AM

Interim update on braking stuff: I did get the CL brake pads in (RC6 front, RC5+ rear). I like the look of the pads so far. I lightly sanded the front rotors and hit them with a Brake Hone before the pad swap to try to help eliminate vibration issues from plain deposits.

The new pads pretty quickly wiped the rotors back to shiny clean bare metal driving them cold on the street, no Carbotech material left at all. Front's still got a steering wheel judder though, which I assume means I already created hotspots and thickness/hardness variation in these rotors at the last track weekend (and/or the street driving on the deposits afterwards) and there's not much to be done about it. It could also just be mounting issues: they used too much of some "high temp" paint on the Z1 hats, and it melted near the lugs and made a bit of a mess. I tried to sand that back flat before re-installing, but I couldn't get it all off since it's pretty tough stuff at room temp. Whatever, just tired of messing with those rotors anyways.

Ordered a new set of 1-piece DBA-4000 front rotors through kamispeed, they arrive monday, hoping this combo will survive a bit better than the last, but only time will tell

. I left the rear rotors alone (the cheap slotted 1-piece from Z1) since they seem healthy for now.

The feel on the new pads is pretty nice so far, at least on the street. It doesn't have the extra-grabby initial bite of the XP-10 front on light pedal application, but seems to have plenty of torque once you lay into the pedal a bit, and seems easier to modulate too. Can't wait to see how they perform back at the track.

ChrisSlicks · 10-05-2012, 10:33 AM

Wait until you get them up to operating temp, you'll be loving it

Takes 2 corners for me and then they're good to go.

Maybe more street driving can sand away the judder on the current rotors, but hopefully the DBA's will work out for you - better cooling efficiency theoretically.

I wish I knew what was ultimately causing your brake shudder issues, very annoying.

VoBoy · 10-06-2012, 03:58 AM

If the DBA's are don't solve the issue, I'd say go for cheap blanks from Rockauto.com and consider it a wear item. Or maybe splurge on some Stoptechs?

wstar · 10-06-2012, 08:36 AM

Well there are really only two other possibilities if the DBAs get screwed up quickly: one is that a caliper piston is sticking and causing uneven heating. I did a caliper rebuild earlier on in the debugging process though, so even if you assume I'm capable of screwing up the rebuild, I'd be unlikely to see the same problem both before and after the rebuild I'd think. But I'm pretty sure I don't have a sticking piston.

The other possibility of that sort is that one or both of my front caliper bodies is bad (fatigued and not holding shape, or slightly bent outwards from the original shape or something. I think even very small hard-to-see amounts of that sort of thing could be big issues).

09-17-2012, 12:38 PM	#1 (permalink)
wstar A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,024 Drives: too slow Rep Power: 3595	CL Front Pads arrive sometime tomorrow. Gonna see if they can clean up these rotors or if I need to chuck rotors again . Then I need to see how RC6 + XP8 works for front/rear balance, but I bet it's pretty ok. I was tempted to order some rear RC5+ with them, but I'm a little scared they'd be too aggressive in the rear for this car and get me back into heavy ice-mode issues. __________________ 7AT Track Car! Journal thread / Car setup details Last edited by wstar; 09-17-2012 at 01:08 PM.

09-17-2012, 11:00 PM	#5 (permalink)
VoBoy Base Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Chicago/Houston Posts: 37 Drives: 06 350z Rep Power: 17	Hey Brandon! It's Tim. Good to see you again at the track. Are you signed up for November? I'll be there. Here's some footage I got from our last session. Pretty interesting to watch our screw ups! Last edited by VoBoy; 09-17-2012 at 11:13 PM.

09-18-2012, 12:04 AM	#6 (permalink)
wstar A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,024 Drives: too slow Rep Power: 3595	Yeah I'll be there in November for sure. I had to go back and watch again once I realized I could use your right mirror to see when I was close after that first pass. After you went back in the lead the second time I seem to vanish though. Let me dig through my list of excuses... It's funny that in two places we made pretty much the same mistake but on different laps (going too deep in the U-turn after the front straight, and kicking the tail out on the sweeper to the back straight). I was kinda slipping all over the place that run, but it was a fun end to a long weekend I don't think I've ever heard my own car going all out before, from an outside perspective. 5:10 into the vid, love that sound. Fast Intentions exhaust is awesome __________________ 7AT Track Car! Journal thread / Car setup details Last edited by wstar; 09-18-2012 at 12:22 AM.

09-18-2012, 02:55 PM	#8 (permalink)
wstar A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,024 Drives: too slow Rep Power: 3595	Well, I'll give it a go and see what happens __________________ 7AT Track Car! Journal thread / Car setup details

09-18-2012, 03:10 PM	#9 (permalink)
VDC_OFF A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Houston (Pearland) Age: 45 Posts: 1,205 Drives: 2011 370Z M6 Rep Power: 17	I need to get out there with you guys to try out this thing called "traction". But with all the issues of brake pads and oil temps, sounds like it will just add to the list of mods to buy since I dont have problems with those parts just yet. __________________ DRIFTING JOURNAL \| Follow me on Instagram \| Facebook \| Houston Halos

09-18-2012, 03:43 PM	#10 (permalink)
wstar A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,024 Drives: too slow Rep Power: 3595	It's really not as scary as it seems if you just go out for a light weekend once in a blue moon. It's when you get addicted and start pushing things a bit further that all your money disappears __________________ 7AT Track Car! Journal thread / Car setup details

09-18-2012, 03:44 PM	#11 (permalink)
VDC_OFF A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Houston (Pearland) Age: 45 Posts: 1,205 Drives: 2011 370Z M6 Rep Power: 17	mine started disappearing when I purchased the car __________________ DRIFTING JOURNAL \| Follow me on Instagram \| Facebook \| Houston Halos

10-05-2012, 09:43 AM	#12 (permalink)
wstar A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,024 Drives: too slow Rep Power: 3595	Interim update on braking stuff: I did get the CL brake pads in (RC6 front, RC5+ rear). I like the look of the pads so far. I lightly sanded the front rotors and hit them with a Brake Hone before the pad swap to try to help eliminate vibration issues from plain deposits. The new pads pretty quickly wiped the rotors back to shiny clean bare metal driving them cold on the street, no Carbotech material left at all. Front's still got a steering wheel judder though, which I assume means I already created hotspots and thickness/hardness variation in these rotors at the last track weekend (and/or the street driving on the deposits afterwards) and there's not much to be done about it. It could also just be mounting issues: they used too much of some "high temp" paint on the Z1 hats, and it melted near the lugs and made a bit of a mess. I tried to sand that back flat before re-installing, but I couldn't get it all off since it's pretty tough stuff at room temp. Whatever, just tired of messing with those rotors anyways. Ordered a new set of 1-piece DBA-4000 front rotors through kamispeed, they arrive monday, hoping this combo will survive a bit better than the last, but only time will tell . I left the rear rotors alone (the cheap slotted 1-piece from Z1) since they seem healthy for now. The feel on the new pads is pretty nice so far, at least on the street. It doesn't have the extra-grabby initial bite of the XP-10 front on light pedal application, but seems to have plenty of torque once you lay into the pedal a bit, and seems easier to modulate too. Can't wait to see how they perform back at the track. __________________ 7AT Track Car! Journal thread / Car setup details Last edited by wstar; 10-05-2012 at 09:45 AM.

10-05-2012, 10:33 AM	#13 (permalink)
ChrisSlicks A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: North East Posts: 6,203 Drives: 09 370Z Sport M6 Rep Power: 654	Wait until you get them up to operating temp, you'll be loving it Takes 2 corners for me and then they're good to go. Maybe more street driving can sand away the judder on the current rotors, but hopefully the DBA's will work out for you - better cooling efficiency theoretically. I wish I knew what was ultimately causing your brake shudder issues, very annoying. __________________ Hotchkis ARB \| Stillen CAI \| Art Pipes \| Berk CBE \| Stillen AP Racing Brakes \| AE Performance Oil Cooler \| BC Racing ER Coilovers \| Doran Control Arms

10-06-2012, 03:58 AM	#14 (permalink)
VoBoy Base Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Chicago/Houston Posts: 37 Drives: 06 350z Rep Power: 17	If the DBA's are don't solve the issue, I'd say go for cheap blanks from Rockauto.com and consider it a wear item. Or maybe splurge on some Stoptechs?

10-06-2012, 08:36 AM	#15 (permalink)
wstar A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,024 Drives: too slow Rep Power: 3595	Well there are really only two other possibilities if the DBAs get screwed up quickly: one is that a caliper piston is sticking and causing uneven heating. I did a caliper rebuild earlier on in the debugging process though, so even if you assume I'm capable of screwing up the rebuild, I'd be unlikely to see the same problem both before and after the rebuild I'd think. But I'm pretty sure I don't have a sticking piston. The other possibility of that sort is that one or both of my front caliper bodies is bad (fatigued and not holding shape, or slightly bent outwards from the original shape or something. I think even very small hard-to-see amounts of that sort of thing could be big issues). __________________ 7AT Track Car! Journal thread / Car setup details

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