MAZOC Firearms

D.Stillwell

^^ Sounds like a bunch of BS and nothing is really going to change. No worries here...

VA will not be doing any open carry ban or round limit like MD, Richmond republicans old money will make sure of it.

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VABAM

Yep just another we are going enforce stuff we should have already been enforcing so it looks like we care statement.

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D.Stillwell

I'm still waiting for the day someone with a brain says you know....These kids getting shot, they needed a gun too, for self defense.

But Im not expecting anyone with a brain so.....I digress lol

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ZCarMan

Was looking at the various online ammo sites today and came across some really good ballistics testing information for short barreled handguns at Lucky Gunner. The site (linked) has a great data base spreadsheet that you can link to videos of the ballistics gel tests and gives you a quick ability to compare penetration of each vendor's particular offering. The video provides an overview of what and how it was all done.

Handgun Self-Defense Ammunition - Ballistic Testing Data

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Jon

Nixin

A BIG hello to the Z owners in the US. Here is what we regular folks carry in Canada...

Attached Images

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m4a1mustang

OK guys, I'm pretty sure I'm going to buy a Tavor. I used to have a BCM 16" mid-length AR which I loved, but I really enjoy the bullpup design and shorter OAL of the Tavor. I think it'd be great for fun as well as home defense crap.

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- Steve

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VABAM

So the big question is; How do you like your Tavor?

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m4a1mustang

Well, I just ordered it through my LGS. Should be in sometime next week.

Now to order ammo, mags, optic, etc. LGS recommended the Geiselle trigger pack but I said I wanted to shoot it first before I decide.

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- Steve

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VABAM

Which color did you get?

Magpul Pmags work great in the Tavor just make sure you get the most current version, the M3. The previous version M2/MOE will not drop free on an open bolt. Out of 20 M2 mags I had, 3 would kind of drop free. The rest needed to be pulled out. There is also a concern about the bolt hold open being slightly activated with a loaded M2 mag causing excessive wear and tear on the bolt and the hold open (google it if you want detailed info). I didn't see this with my M2s but considering the drop free issue and that Pmags don't cost much, I gave all my M2s to my dad and bought all new M3s for all my rifles.

Also the up coming Magpul D-60 Pmag, 60 round drum mag, will be the first drum mag that will be compatible with the Tavor. Because of how the Tavor's bolt is designed and how AR-15 drum mags normally work, this keep the bolt from closing on a Tavor with previous drum mags. Also the D-60 will be half the price. Most drum mags go for around $300 or more. The D-60 MSRP is $130.

If you don’t mind the stock trigger but would like it to be a little lighter, google on how to remove the secondary sear reset spring. It is easy and the best part it’s free. It will drop the trigger pull weight from about 11 pounds to about 7-8 pounds. The drop in weight was nice and I felt like I had better trigger control too. Supposedly there a few people saying that the trigger sometimes doesn’t reset properly and you have to do a manual sear reset (pushing the trigger forward) with this mod. I put a few thousand rounds through my Tavor with this trigger mod and had no issues what so ever. This included rapid fire and purposely inducing jams and double feeds for training purposes. A couple of on-line/YouTube reviewers have done this mod and also have reported no issues.

Other than Geissele; ShootingSight and Timney both make Tavor trigger packs. Timney’s trigger is single stage vice Geissele and ShootingSight being 2 stage. I’ve heard nothing but good things about ShootingSight’s trigger pack the TAV-D. However Timney's has had a soft primer strike issue with theirs which they have supposedly fixed in the Gen2.

Geissele’s trigger has 2 parts; the Tavor Super Sabra Trigger Pack and the Tavor Super Sabra Lighting Trigger Bow. They are meant to be run together but they can be used independently from one another. The trigger bow replaces the physical trigger up front and has an adjustment screw that reduces/eliminates the take up in the transfer bar. This makes it feel like an AR-15. Also the tactile feel of the trigger bow is very nice. The trigger bow was not bad to install but you do have to take off the barrel which is simple and easy (with the proper tools). Swapping out trigger packs on the Tavor is very easy. Pull two pins; move the bolt release out of the way and it slides right out. The only negative thing about the Geissele trigger pack is that the tolerances are much tighter than the OEM trigger pack. This makes the pins a little difficult to get in the first few times.

Damn I think that is enough for now.

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m4a1mustang

Thank you for all that!

I ordered it in black. I'm about to order some M3 PMags and Aimpoint PRO.

Next up will be finding some open land to shoot on, otherwise I just get to plink at 25 yards indoors.

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- Steve

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VABAM

25 yards is great for practicing for home defense. I do agree it is nice to get out on some open land. The public outdoor ranges in my area have gotten very restrictive on how you can shoot. No rifles on the 25 yard range even if they are pistol calibers. No standing and shooting rifles or shotguns, must be from a rested position. All this is due to idiots at the range.

Thankfully my dad is the member of a hunt club with a private range that goes out to 300 yards. Well, actually it is a dirt road out in the middle of no where.

Be aware the Tavor’s sight rail sits lower than on an AR-15 (with relationship to the stock). This is due to the charging handle on an AR-15. You might need a riser for your optic. Most guys (and gals ) who are used to the AR-15/M16/M4 find when mounting optics that would be standard height on an AR-15 are too low for them on a Tavor. It is all about where you rest your face on the stock. For me I like having the stock higher up on my check so standard AR-15 height sights work perfectly for me.

If you find you need your optics higher, the Bullpup Armory has some simple and cost effective solutions.

Also if you find that the Tavor’s grips are a little too slick like I did; Talon Grips make grip tape panels for the pistol grip and foregrip. They make them in a rubber texture and a granulated texture (aka sandpaper style like on skateboards). I got the rubber texture. A little bit of a PITA to get them on but they made a huge difference. Also they are not a permanent change so you can take them off or replace them later.

Talon Gun Grips Tavor Pistol Grip

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m4a1mustang

I'm a big fan of the talon grips. I have the rubber grip on my Kahr CM9.

I have the MI riser rail bookmarked in case the Aimpoint ends up being too low.

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- Steve

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ZCarMan

What Mike said. He pretty much covered all the high points.

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Jon

ZCarMan

Lionheart Industries will be having their once a year Black Friday sale starting the 23rd of November (Monday). If you've been looking at a LH-9 or any of the ones with Novak Night Sights and cerakoted, this is the best time to purchase as they normally run $750.00 and will be on sale for as low as $399.00

Lionheart Industries - 9MM Firearms, Holsters, and Accessories

Click the "Black Friday" link at the top of their homepage for the prices.

Here is a really good overview/review of the history of this firearm and what it has become.

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Jon

m4a1mustang

I watched the entire video. Looks like a nice pistol.

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- Steve

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