MAZOC Firearms

eastwest2300 · 09-12-2011, 11:59 AM

I ordered my bipod and vertical forend for my AR-15 last night... yeahhh dawwwg.

b1adesofcha0s · 09-12-2011, 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

I like it! The RRA looks real nice. I might get get an RRA or a Stag or something, or I might even step up to full Mil-Spec like Spikes Tactical, Daniel Defense, Colt, etc. I've got a while to figure it out.

That shit must be serious, especially since he just got his 5.0

eastwest2300 · 09-12-2011, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b1adesofcha0s

That shit must be serious, especially since he just got his 5.0

hehe..

4r3s · 09-12-2011, 03:07 PM

gun show this weekend at the howard county fair grounds if anyone is interested

Directions to Silverado Gun Show

Thinking about paying it a visit, any one else is interested let me know!

m4a1mustang · 09-12-2011, 03:58 PM

Trooper & Kirk, about how much do you think it'd cost me to build a basic (but quality) AR myself? It'd be my first time so I'm sure there would be a specialty tool expense as well.

Considering the rifles I am looking at right now from CMMG, Stag Arms, Daniel Defense, Spikes, and RRA are in the $750-$1,000 range. I think there might not be much in the way of savings... I'd just have more options to build it exactly how I want.

TROOPER · 09-12-2011, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

Trooper & Kirk, about how much do you think it'd cost me to build a basic (but quality) AR myself? It'd be my first time so I'm sure there would be a specialty tool expense as well.

Considering the rifles I am looking at right now from CMMG, Stag Arms, Daniel Defense, Spikes, and RRA are in the $750-$1,000 range. I think there might not be much in the way of savings... I'd just have more options to build it exactly how I want.

HaHa, well there's the first issue.. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

"But Quality".. is a very broad spectrum LOL, but I can tell you I did save quite a bit, considering a prebuilt rifle I wanted to my specs was well over $2000, and I probably built it to my specs (minus optics/scope) for $1600 - $1700.

But as per your second point, I got it exactly how I wanted it, right from the start.

Why buy pre-built just to rip it apart, and replace parts.

If you're confident you can build one, or have a a friend on hand that can, you're good to go

No major tools really needed, except a roll pin punch and a upper receiver vice block (see brownells.com), oh and a vice LOL.

I'll be honest, having built my own rifle now, I don't think I'd ever buy a pre-build again.

It's like a car man, you'll just want to mod and customize it.

TROOPER · 09-12-2011, 04:30 PM

PS.. If you plan on building a carbine (less than 16") you'll be paying the ATF an additional $200.

You'll have to consider what you want to use the rifle for, that will be a big factor in which barrel to choose, and barrel length, and barrel twist.

MacCool · 09-12-2011, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

Trooper & Kirk, about how much do you think it'd cost me to build a basic (but quality) AR myself? It'd be my first time so I'm sure there would be a specialty tool expense as well.

Considering the rifles I am looking at right now from CMMG, Stag Arms, Daniel Defense, Spikes, and RRA are in the $750-$1,000 range. I think there might not be much in the way of savings... I'd just have more options to build it exactly how I want.

Grant at G&R Tactical sells the Colt 6920 for $990. I've seen too many RRA, CMMG, DPMS, Bushmasters crap out in high round-count courses that I'd never own such a consumer-grade weapon for the $200-$300 price difference over something that's professional grade. Sorry, I've spent too much time around people who shoot a lot and know the platform and who have shaped my biases.

Building a rifle isn't likely to save you much money when you take into account the tools that you'd have to buy to put it together. As to building it exactly how you want....how do you know what you want? How do you know what parts to buy, what works well together? IMHO, unless you're looking for just a range toy to put a couple of hundred round through per year and show off your new black "Army rifle", get the Colt, learn to shoot it, learn what works for you and what doesn't, then build your rifle.

This is often unpopular advice. I fully expect a rebuttal from the Bushmaster fans and the ArfCom crowd.

brian0128 · 09-12-2011, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MacCool

Grant at G&R Tactical sells the Colt 6920 for $990. I've seen too many RRA, CMMG, DPMS, Bushmasters crap out in high round-count courses that I'd never own such a consumer-grade weapon for the $200-$300 price difference over something that's professional grade. Sorry, I've spent too much time around people who shoot a lot and know the platform and who have shaped my biases.

Building a rifle isn't likely to save you much money when you take into account the tools that you'd have to buy to put it together. As to building it exactly how you want....how do you know what you want? How do you know what parts to buy, what works well together? IMHO, unless you're looking for just a range toy to put a couple of hundred round through per year and show off your new black "Army rifle", get the Colt, learn to shoot it, learn what works for you and what doesn't, then build your rifle.

This is often unpopular advice. I fully expect a rebuttal from the Bushmaster fans and the ArfCom crowd.

I'm going to have to agree with Mac on this one. If it's your first AR then you need to pick one up so you can get a few thousand rounds downrange using iron sights. Can't beat 990 for a Colt if that is the barrel length and gas system that you want. I'm partial to the mid length gas system but for you first rifle, get something that you won't ever want to get rid of. Keep it simple since you'll end up building one the way you want eventually. You can always use the Colt lower for any build in the future.

Kirkster · 09-12-2011, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4r3s

gun show this weekend at the howard county fair grounds if anyone is interested

Directions to Silverado Gun Show

Thinking about paying it a visit, any one else is interested let me know!

I might. Need to pick up some ammo for the Garand...

eastwest2300 · 09-12-2011, 05:53 PM

Steve, I personally think if you build it yourself, you're more likely to go over $1000..I've looked around and thought about doing it, and when I added it all up, it was over $1000, I didnt want to spend any more than that, I didnt want to go all crazy with the modifications.

m4a1mustang · 09-12-2011, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MacCool

Grant at G&R Tactical sells the Colt 6920 for $990. I've seen too many RRA, CMMG, DPMS, Bushmasters crap out in high round-count courses that I'd never own such a consumer-grade weapon for the $200-$300 price difference over something that's professional grade. Sorry, I've spent too much time around people who shoot a lot and know the platform and who have shaped my biases.

Building a rifle isn't likely to save you much money when you take into account the tools that you'd have to buy to put it together. As to building it exactly how you want....how do you know what you want? How do you know what parts to buy, what works well together? IMHO, unless you're looking for just a range toy to put a couple of hundred round through per year and show off your new black "Army rifle", get the Colt, learn to shoot it, learn what works for you and what doesn't, then build your rifle.

This is often unpopular advice. I fully expect a rebuttal from the Bushmaster fans and the ArfCom crowd.

But... but... BUT!!!

I like the idea of building my own and my dad has quite a bit of experience with them so I don't think building one would be a big issue for us.

I remember from previous conversations you recommended Colt, Noveske, LMT, Daniel Defense, and possibly even Spike's Tactical, all of which I have looked at. I am not the level of shooter you are, so I doubt I would ever be able to push one of those rifles to the edge, which is why I started considering some of the commercial grade rifles (Stag, etc) because saving $200 here or there could go to some more 5.56.

I think the key here is that I am not on your tactical level, so my rifles wouldn't need to be able to withstand the same torture you might put them through. So I most certainly would be well served by one of the commercial grade pieces, or something I put together myself provided I don't f*ck it up.

Though in that $750-$1000 price range the savings really aren't that substantial. $750 for a Stag vs. $850 for a Spike's Tactical vs. $990 for the 6920 vs. $1000 even for a Daniel Defense...

Rambling now, but I do appreciate your advice and will consider it as I continue to research.

MacCool · 09-12-2011, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

But... but... BUT!!!

I think the key here is that I am not on your tactical level, so my rifles wouldn't need to be able to withstand the same torture you might put them through. So I most certainly would be well served by one of the commercial grade pieces, or something I put together myself provided I don't f*ck it up.

I understand. It's a commonly-made point. OTOH, I'm not a professional mechanic, but my power tools are Milwaukee, not Harbor Freight. And, I opted to buy a 370Z instead of a Pontiac Solstice or an S2000. Just sayin'...

Here's my take, FWIW. Getting an AR15 or M4 variant just to have it, play with it, modify it, or plink with it... that's one thing. If you're going to shoot it, enough to be good at it, you're going to want instruction and you're going to put a lot of rounds through it. Buying or building Tier 3 weapons won't achieve that goal. If that's a goal. If not, then have at it. IMHO, if I'm going to buy a pistol, or a rifle, or a power drill, I'd buy a good one that doesn't take a budget, corner-cutting approach to trying to live up to its design purpose.

IMHO. My approach isn't for everyone.

m4a1mustang · 09-12-2011, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MacCool

I understand. It's a commonly-made point. OTOH, I'm not a professional mechanic, but my power tools are Milwaukee, not Harbor Freight. And, I opted to buy a 370Z instead of a Pontiac Solstice or an S2000. Just sayin'...

Here's my take, FWIW. Getting an AR15 or M4 variant just to have it, play with it, modify it, or plink with it... that's one thing. If you're going to shoot it, enough to be good at it, you're going to want instruction and you're going to put a lot of rounds through it. Buying or building Tier 3 weapons won't achieve that goal. If that's a goal. If not, then have at it. IMHO, if I'm going to buy a pistol, or a rifle, or a power drill, I'd buy a good one that doesn't take a budget, corner-cutting approach to trying to live up to its design purpose.

IMHO. My approach isn't for everyone.

Good points.

For me, 99% of the time I will just be taking it to the range for fun time. I just don't see myself doing any serious classes any time soon... But if I ever decided to do that, I'd gladly pony up and get a military grade rifle if I decided that's what I needed to participate.

Kind of like why I ended up buying my 370Z over a Cayman S. "It's almost as quick, almost as nimble, and looks just as good. Since I'm just going to be driving on the street 99% of the time, I'll pocket the other $30k."

Again, thanks for your thoughts. Much appreciated.

eastwest2300 · 09-12-2011, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

Good points.

For me, 99% of the time I will just be taking it to the range for fun time. I just don't see myself doing any serious classes any time soon... But if I ever decided to do that, I'd gladly pony up and get a military grade rifle if I decided that's what I needed to participate.

Kind of like why I ended up buying my 370Z over a Cayman S. "It's almost as quick, almost as nimble, and looks just as good. Since I'm just going to be driving on the street 99% of the time, I'll pocket the other $30k."

Again, thanks for your thoughts. Much appreciated.

Steve, I got your back no matter what you do, bro.

09-12-2011, 11:59 AM	#166 (permalink)
eastwest2300 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2010 Location: South FL Posts: 91,019 Drives: '16QX70/'21 Supra3.0 Rep Power: 2684551	I ordered my bipod and vertical forend for my AR-15 last night... yeahhh dawwwg. __________________ Infiniti QX70 & Toyota Supra 3.0 Premium

09-12-2011, 03:58 PM	#170 (permalink)
m4a1mustang A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Northern VA Posts: 55,385 Drives: on two wheels Rep Power: 6963	Trooper & Kirk, about how much do you think it'd cost me to build a basic (but quality) AR myself? It'd be my first time so I'm sure there would be a specialty tool expense as well. Considering the rifles I am looking at right now from CMMG, Stag Arms, Daniel Defense, Spikes, and RRA are in the $750-$1,000 range. I think there might not be much in the way of savings... I'd just have more options to build it exactly how I want. __________________ - Steve Zs & Coffee - Saturdays at 10AM in Fairfax, VA and Columbia, MD (Click the banner!) LIKE us on Facebook!

09-12-2011, 04:30 PM	#172 (permalink)
TROOPER A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 1,297 Drives: Your Tax Dollars Rep Power: 17	PS.. If you plan on building a carbine (less than 16") you'll be paying the ATF an additional $200. You'll have to consider what you want to use the rifle for, that will be a big factor in which barrel to choose, and barrel length, and barrel twist. __________________ Darren "Guv Motors Passion Wagon"

09-12-2011, 05:53 PM	#176 (permalink)
eastwest2300 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2010 Location: South FL Posts: 91,019 Drives: '16QX70/'21 Supra3.0 Rep Power: 2684551	Steve, I personally think if you build it yourself, you're more likely to go over $1000..I've looked around and thought about doing it, and when I added it all up, it was over $1000, I didnt want to spend any more than that, I didnt want to go all crazy with the modifications. __________________ Infiniti QX70 & Toyota Supra 3.0 Premium

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09-12-2011, 03:07 PM	#169 (permalink)
4r3s A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: MD Posts: 2,077 Drives: Touring 370z Rep Power: 25	gun show this weekend at the howard county fair grounds if anyone is interested Directions to Silverado Gun Show Thinking about paying it a visit, any one else is interested let me know!