Calm man successfully buys tv and denies walmart receipt checkers (Long Read)

Isamu · 03-15-2011, 04:26 AM

Quote:

Rick is the Gandhi of receipt-check deniers. He writes in with a story of how he bought a 37 inch TV from Walmart and was able to successfully say no to the receipt checker blocking his way with his body. Rick did this by calmly and reasonably explaining his position to the assistant manager who showed up and by ignoring everyone around him who was trying to provoke him. Sometimes the quietest voice speaks the loudest.

Rick writes:

“
After work I stopped by the Walmart to pick up a TV for my girlfriend. After circling the whole store in search of the bathroom before realizing it was right next to the entrance, I made my way back to the Electronics section and picked out a TV quickly. I wanted a midsize Vizio, so I chose the 37" 1080p Eco model. I purchased the TV with my debit card at one of the rear registers about 20 feet away, and walked to the front of the store carrying the box in both hands.

I made it through the first set of doors into the front atrium of the store, but before reaching the outer doors I heard a man say "Sir?" I turned and faced Tony, the receipt checker.

Tony: May I see your receipt?
Me: No thanks!
Tony: Oh, ok.

I turned and continued walking towards to automatic doors. Tony called again, so I turned back.

Tony: No, I need to see your receipt.
Me: No thank you!
Tony: What do you mean?
Me: I mean no thanks; I'm walking to my car with my purchase.
Tony: Well, I need to see your receipt.
Me: I just purchased this TV in the back of the store. I don't need to show you a receipt.
Tony: Yes, you need to show me your receipt.
Me: Actually, state law dictates that once I pay for something, I don't need to show ownership of it. I just paid for this TV, the receipt is in my pocket, but my hands are full, and I don't feel like getting it out. I'm going to leave now, thank you.

At this point Tony has positioned himself between me and the door. As I step towards the door he places his hand on the box in my hands and lightly pushes back, preventing me from moving.

Me: You cannot prevent me from leaving the store with my purchase. Please move out of the way.
Tony: I can't just let you leave the store with a TV without checking your receipt.

At this point a woman, who has been standing with her family near some vending machine starts throwing snide comments at me such as "Just show him the receipt; it's not that hard" and "god, you don't have to be such a prick about it." This continues on for the rest of my "stay" here, but I choose to ignore her.

Me: Are you unlawfully detaining me?
Tony: I just want to need to see your receipt before you leave.
Me: I have paid for this, I have the receipt, but as I have said, state law protects my right to not need to prove ownership of something I have purchased. You cannot physically prevent me from leaving the store. I am now going to leave the store.

I try and step around Tony, but he again pushes on the box in my hands to prevent me from moving anywhere.

Me: Are you illegally detaining me?
Tony: Yeah, if that's what you want to call it. (Realizing he just said something bad) Listen, Walmart policy says that I need to check your receipt.
Me: Then Walmart's policy is in violation of Virginia state law. They should have informed you that you don'tneed to see a receipt.
Tony: (Misunderstanding me) How could they have told me already that you'd bought this?
Me: No, when Walmart trained you, they should have informed you that you can't force people to show their receipts. You can only ask.
Tony: I'm just a first-class worker, I don't know about any of that.

Now I am starting to fill like the prick the woman near us keeps calling me. This atrium has two exterior doors on opposite sides, so I turn around ready to walk towards the other door to leave, but another receipt checker has walked up at this time. I can't remember her name, so I'll refer to her as S, since I believe that's what her name started with.

S asks me what's going on, and I explain that I'd like to take my purchase to my car, but Tony is demanding me to show a receipt. S agrees with Tony that I need to show my receipt for "purchases like this". I give her the same explanation I gave Tony, that by state law, I don't need to prove ownership of something I just purchased.

Me: You are welcome to check the security tapes to verify that I just purchased this TV at one of the registers in the back, but I don't need to prove ownership.
S: You need to show your receipt before you leave the store.
Me: According to state law, I don't.
S: Well I'm sorry, sir, but that's Walmart policy.
Me: Then Walmart's policy is in violation of state law.
S: It's not that hard to show a receipt.
Me: No, it's not hard at all, but state law says I don't have to. I'm going to leave the store now.
S: No, the store manager is coming.
Me: When is the store manager coming?
S: The assistant store manager...
Me: When is the assistant store manager coming?
S: Yeah, she'll be right here.
Me: Ok.

I finally put the box on the floor. (Woman: "Now just take four fingers, put them in your pocket, take out the receipt..." I'm mentally yelling at her, but completely ignore her externally.) After waiting (what felt like) 2 minutes the assistant store manager appeared around the corner. S walked towards her, and I waved at the store manager to show I wasn't threatening nor uncomfortable with her arrival (in fact I welcomed it.) S pointed towards me and walked somewhere else, but Tony stayed behind me the whole time. I can't remember the assistant store manager's name, either, so I'll refer to her as M.

M: Hello, sir, how are you today?
Me: I'm doing fine, but I'd like to leave the store with my purchase.
M: Well, what's the problem?
Me: Tony, here, says I can't leave unless I show my receipt.
M: Do you have your receipt?
Me: Yes, but I just purchased the TV in the back of the store and had my hands full with the box, so I didn't want to take it out. Tony physically prevented me from leaving the store. Now I'm refusing to show me receipt for the principle of the matter. State law dictates that I do not need to prove ownership of something I have purchased, meaning I do not need to show a receipt.
M: Hmm. (She thinks for a bit.) Where did you buy the TV?
Me: In the back of the store.
M: (Thinks a bit more.) There are two registers in the back.
Me: *sigh* I purchased the TV at the register closest to the front of the store. There was a man checking out with his family at the register nearest the rear of the store. I paid for the TV with my debit card, and then picked up the TV myself. The cashier asked if I was going to carry it, and I said "yes, it's light." I then walked to the front of the store.
M: (Thinks a bit more, taken aback at the detailed report.) Ok, sir, it is your choice to leave the store with your purchase.
Me: Thank you.

I pick up the box, turn around, and tell Tony to "have a good night" as I exit the store.

The thing is, I bear no ill will towards the Walmart employees. They were simply not educated as to their role and lawful restrictions. I thought Walmart would have fixed this issue after all of the heat they've gotten about it over the years, but clearly this store didn't get an internal memo. The situation could have definitely gotten worse. I'm almost glad the second checker arrived, as I don't know what Tony would have done had I tried to exit the store through the other door. (He is an older gentleman, so I don't think he would have tried to tackle me, but if he had actually placed a hand on me or otherwise gotten more physical, I would have been placed in a very awkward position.)

I don't think an email to a Walmart executive will do anything. I'm open to any advice on how to inform this store's management about the situation, so that they can properly train their employees. I feel badly about my interaction with Tony and M, since the honestly believed they were doing their jobs. I feel like I should stop by and give them gift cards for performing admirably in the tough situation Walmart has put them in, but that might be received poorly.

http://consumerist.com/2011/03/calm-...-checkers.html

TongMan · 03-15-2011, 04:48 AM

That consumer is a big *******, but that specific Walmart does need to revise and educate its receipt checking policy. In legality, Walmart employees does not have the right to detain the person. Loss prevention, on the other hand, can tackle his *** and arrest him for failure to comply with their store policy. According to Virginia laws, theft of a product worth of $200+, constitutes a larceny.

Larceny is the act of depriving someone of the use of, or otherwise stealing or theft of property, goods or money. Shoplifting in Virginia falls under Virginia larceny laws.

Different classes of larceny include:

Grand Larceny: Theft of $200 or more (Felony)
Petite Larceny: (Petty Larceny) Theft of less than $200 (Misdemeanor)
Receiving Stolen Property: Felony ($200 and above) or Misdemeanor (less than $200)
Theft of Services
Writing Bad Checks
Unauthorized Use of a Vehicle

The 37" Vizio television is sure over $200. If that consumer failed to provide an original receipt, he would be booked and charged with the crime of grand larceny.

Isamu · 03-15-2011, 05:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TongMan

That consumer is a big *******, but that specific Walmart does need to revise and educate its receipt checking policy. In legality, Walmart employees does not have the right to detain the person. Loss prevention, on the other hand, can tackle his *** and arrest him for failure to comply with their store policy. According to Virginia laws, theft of a product worth of $200+, constitutes a larceny.

Larceny is the act of depriving someone of the use of, or otherwise stealing or theft of property, goods or money. Shoplifting in Virginia falls under Virginia larceny laws.

Different classes of larceny include:

Grand Larceny: Theft of $200 or more (Felony)
Petite Larceny: (Petty Larceny) Theft of less than $200 (Misdemeanor)
Receiving Stolen Property: Felony ($200 and above) or Misdemeanor (less than $200)
Theft of Services
Writing Bad Checks
Unauthorized Use of a Vehicle

The 37" Vizio television is sure over $200. If that consumer failed to provide an original receipt, he would be booked and charged with the crime of grand larceny.

im willing to bet, they cannot LEGALLY tackle anyone.. and would be sued if they laid a hand on someone... I know LP can detain if there is suspision of theft! however, I know at Best Buy they can't tackle anyone.. When I worked at Best Buy, part of the training was LP, and LP duties... and non-LP personal were only allowed to call the LP desk. We weren't even allowed to approach a suspected thief. As an LP worker. you could detain them to an extent, but you were in no way allowed to get "physical". if they left, you were to go outside, and get the plate number, make and model of the vehicle and to call the police.
Im not saying he is right or wrong.. as im sure there will be arguments on both sides, such as "he is upholding his rights", and "if you don't use them, you lose them", or perhaps just, "man, that guy is an A-Hole"

TongMan · 03-15-2011, 05:44 AM

If someone is stealing from a retail store, they are more than likely not going to pay a lawyer thousands of dollars to uphold his/her constitutional rights because they were handled roughly while trying to get away. Legally, yes, loss prevention officers can not tackle someone down, but it happens all so often.

TreeSemdyZee · 03-15-2011, 05:47 AM

An extremely simple change to Walmart policy could fix this. A proprietary, brightly colored sticker placed on the box at the time of purchase would solve the issue.
Sorry, but Rick was being a d***. while adhering to the letter of the law, he had no proof that he just "purchased" the TV. Due to the fact that he bought the TV at a remote register, there was no visible means of verification to people at the door.
You can't believe the number of people that just try to walk out if the front of the store without purchasing. I saw a woman at Target a few years ago, bust out of the door with a cart full of stuff.
Sticker would solve the problem.

Oh. And whatever just happened to common courtesy?

TongMan · 03-15-2011, 06:01 AM

Or just have large postings throughout the store saying "All customers are subject to show proof of purchase before leaving the store premises. Thank you."

leighspped · 03-15-2011, 06:15 AM

I would have called the cops and called it a day. They tried to kidnap you by detaining you which is a felony. anyways it couldn't have been thief because there product had yet to leave the store by my understanding
open, closed

he also should have been trained better! That was unacceptable! I wish you could bill them for wasting your time

Isamu · 03-15-2011, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TongMan

If someone is stealing from a retail store, they are more than likely not going to pay a lawyer thousands of dollars to uphold his/her constitutional rights because they were handled roughly while trying to get away. Legally, yes, loss prevention officers can not tackle someone down, but it happens all so often.

I would not put it past a crook.. remember the guy who broke into someones house and he injured himself and won a lawsuit against the home owner.. LOL

Isamu · 03-15-2011, 06:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TongMan

Or just have large postings throughout the store saying "All customers are subject to show proof of purchase before leaving the store premises. Thank you."

assuming that there is even such a law... state law trumps store rules every time

Isamu · 03-15-2011, 06:49 AM

don't get me wrong, the guy was a **** for sure..

theDreamer · 03-15-2011, 10:32 AM

I love these stories and hearing peoples responses. One gets posted each year and then 2 weeks later will get forgotten.
For those saying, put up a sign. You cannot legally do that unfortunately, there are only a few places which can legally check your purchase as you leave and those are membership clubs (Sam's, Costco, etc.).

On the topic of him being an a$$, sorry but it is far from it. Why should he be called out for just wanting leave, sure the front door man may not have seen him purchase the television but at the same time he has no legal right to stop the customer. For the poster saying 'tackle' him or to that, every store tells its employees they are not allowed to follow, detain, tackle, etc. a customer even if they know for 100% fact they have stolen property. This is why stores have insurance, the employee needs to use his eyes to follow the thief and record everything he sees. And if an employee does go after a thief, you can bet yourself they (the thief) will sue.

theDreamer · 03-15-2011, 10:34 AM

And if anyone wants more specific answers I can ask a co-worker as he worked security for Best Buy and a few other companies which try to bypass state laws, but even then they have no legal ground.

Isamu · 03-15-2011, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theDreamer

every store tells its employees they are not allowed to follow, detain, tackle, etc. a customer even if they know for 100% fact they have stolen property. This is why stores have insurance, the employee needs to use his eyes to follow the thief and record everything he sees. And if an employee does go after a thief, you can bet yourself they (the thief) will sue.

exactly....

Liquid_G · 03-15-2011, 12:57 PM

good for him.. I hate those receipt checker clowns.. Maybe instead of having some moron stand by the door and draw a pink line on your receipt, they can put them on a fking register and get people through the lines faster.

And Tongman, there are so many things wrong with your posts I don't even know where to start.

shadoquad · 03-15-2011, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Isamu

exactly....

This is true. When I worked retail, I was told not to "play the hero" and just let the theft happen while compiling a detailed report.

The guy's not a jerk or whatever. He's just asserting his rights.

03-15-2011, 04:48 AM	#2 (permalink)
TongMan A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: NorCal Posts: 1,297 Drives: 2013 Nissan GTR Rep Power: 715	That consumer is a big *****, but that specific Walmart does need to revise and educate its receipt checking policy. In legality, Walmart employees does not have the right to detain the person. Loss prevention, on the other hand, can tackle his * and arrest him for failure to comply with their store policy. According to Virginia laws, theft of a product worth of $200+, constitutes a larceny. Larceny is the act of depriving someone of the use of, or otherwise stealing or theft of property, goods or money. Shoplifting in Virginia falls under Virginia larceny laws. Different classes of larceny include: Grand Larceny: Theft of $200 or more (Felony) Petite Larceny: (Petty Larceny) Theft of less than $200 (Misdemeanor) Receiving Stolen Property: Felony ($200 and above) or Misdemeanor (less than $200) Theft of Services Writing Bad Checks Unauthorized Use of a Vehicle The 37" Vizio television is sure over $200. If that consumer failed to provide an original receipt, he would be booked and charged with the crime of grand larceny. Last edited by TongMan; 03-15-2011 at 04:51 AM.

03-15-2011, 05:47 AM	#5 (permalink)
TreeSemdyZee Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Kentuck-IANA Age: 60 Posts: 4,885 Drives: '09 370 & ‘14 Juke Rep Power: 27408	An extremely simple change to Walmart policy could fix this. A proprietary, brightly colored sticker placed on the box at the time of purchase would solve the issue. Sorry, but Rick was being a d**. while adhering to the letter of the law, he had no proof that he just "purchased" the TV. Due to the fact that he bought the TV at a remote register, there was no visible means of verification to people at the door. You can't believe the number of people that just try to walk out if the front of the store without purchasing. I saw a woman at Target a few years ago, bust out of the door with a cart full of stuff. Sticker would solve the problem. Oh. And whatever just happened to common courtesy? Last edited by TreeSemdyZee; 03-15-2011 at 05:54 AM.*

03-15-2011, 10:32 AM	#11 (permalink)
theDreamer A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 30,879 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 4210	I love these stories and hearing peoples responses. One gets posted each year and then 2 weeks later will get forgotten. For those saying, put up a sign. You cannot legally do that unfortunately, there are only a few places which can legally check your purchase as you leave and those are membership clubs (Sam's, Costco, etc.). On the topic of him being an a$$, sorry but it is far from it. Why should he be called out for just wanting leave, sure the front door man may not have seen him purchase the television but at the same time he has no legal right to stop the customer. For the poster saying 'tackle' him or to that, every store tells its employees they are not allowed to follow, detain, tackle, etc. a customer even if they know for 100% fact they have stolen property. This is why stores have insurance, the employee needs to use his eyes to follow the thief and record everything he sees. And if an employee does go after a thief, you can bet yourself they (the thief) will sue. __________________ theDreamer's Z // Fast Intentions // Uprev // GTM // HKS // TEIN theDreamer's Silvia // URAS // GREDDY Houston Zs // Facebook // Twitter // Instagram

03-15-2011, 10:34 AM	#12 (permalink)
theDreamer A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 30,879 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 4210	And if anyone wants more specific answers I can ask a co-worker as he worked security for Best Buy and a few other companies which try to bypass state laws, but even then they have no legal ground. __________________ theDreamer's Z // Fast Intentions // Uprev // GTM // HKS // TEIN theDreamer's Silvia // URAS // GREDDY Houston Zs // Facebook // Twitter // Instagram

03-15-2011, 12:57 PM	#14 (permalink)
Liquid_G A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Chicago Burbs Posts: 1,439 Drives: 09 370z Supercharged Rep Power: 44	good for him.. I hate those receipt checker clowns.. Maybe instead of having some moron stand by the door and draw a pink line on your receipt, they can put them on a fking register and get people through the lines faster. And Tongman, there are so many things wrong with your posts I don't even know where to start. __________________

03-15-2011, 05:44 AM	#4 (permalink)
TongMan A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: NorCal Posts: 1,297 Drives: 2013 Nissan GTR Rep Power: 715	If someone is stealing from a retail store, they are more than likely not going to pay a lawyer thousands of dollars to uphold his/her constitutional rights because they were handled roughly while trying to get away. Legally, yes, loss prevention officers can not tackle someone down, but it happens all so often.

03-15-2011, 06:01 AM	#6 (permalink)
TongMan A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: NorCal Posts: 1,297 Drives: 2013 Nissan GTR Rep Power: 715	Or just have large postings throughout the store saying "All customers are subject to show proof of purchase before leaving the store premises. Thank you."

03-15-2011, 06:15 AM	#7 (permalink)
leighspped Enthusiast Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Morristown Posts: 444 Drives: US Rep Power: 14	I would have called the cops and called it a day. They tried to kidnap you by detaining you which is a felony. anyways it couldn't have been thief because there product had yet to leave the store by my understanding open, closed he also should have been trained better! That was unacceptable! I wish you could bill them for wasting your time

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