Post your pets!

Hotrodz · 06-02-2020, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FL 4Motion

I think I wasn’t clear before, I wasn’t advocating for an expanded definition of what kinds of animals can be service animals, rather I am advocating that what types of disabilities qualify for service animals should be expanded. To my knowledge there are no service dogs for ptsd and tbi, only emotional support dogs and the training isn’t standardized for support animals and this is where #hit starts to break down and some folks take advantage.

Also, I’m just going to say it even though I may come off as being thin skinned, when you say dogs, pets etc are all emotional support animals and help their humans, while true, in the context o& this particular discussion comes off, at least to me as belittling and demeaning folks with real psychiatric and brain disabilities.

Your not thin skin at all, you just don't have a complete perspective. I never meant to demean people who that have or use support dogs, cats or horses as the benefits are huge. I was purely stating the lawful difference between the two. Support animals exist because there a reason many of us have "pets" so those in the behavioral mental health field recognized the benefits of owning a pet and gave it a name to help people that would benefit from having a companion that provides unconditional love. We are in total agreement surrounding that.

That said if you own service animal, support animal or pet. I am with Jar it needs to be under control at all times.

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FL 4Motion · 06-02-2020, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hotrodz

Your not thin skin at all, you just don't have a complete perspective. I never meant to demean people who that have or use support dogs, cats or horses as the benefits are huge. I was purely stating the lawful difference between the two. Support animals exist because there a reason many of us have "pets" so those in the behavioral mental health field recognized the benefits of owning a pet and gave it a name to help people that would benefit from having a companion that provides unconditional love. We are in total agreement surrounding that.

That said if you own service animal, support animal or pet. I am with Jar it needs to be under control at all times.

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It’s a lot more than unconditional love tho, there is a service being rendered when for example, Someone gets overwhelmed bc of too much info to process and their tbi, ptsd, brain lesions, neurodegenerative issues overwhelmn them and their dog is able to keep them from hurting themselves, or someone else. In that moment, the dog is no different than an antipsychotic or mood stabilizer or cognitive behavioral therapy. But that is classified as an emotional support animal, really that’s about as much of a service dog as you can get, helps with disease/injury and improves persons quality of life.

We all a agree that there is no free pass for a poorly behaved animal regardless of it’s official or unofficial status and that includes the human owners too.

My issue is that what qualifies an individual for having a service dog is too narrow sometimes, it’s not just seizures, blindness, paralysis aka the obvious ones, that’s all.

Hotrodz · 06-02-2020, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FL 4Motion

It’s a lot more than unconditional love tho, there is a service being rendered when for example, Someone gets overwhelmed bc of too much info to process and their tbi, ptsd, brain lesions, neurodegenerative issues overwhelmn them and their dog is able to keep them from hurting themselves, or someone else. In that moment, the dog is no different than an antipsychotic or mood stabilizer or cognitive behavioral therapy. But that is classified as an emotional support animal, really that’s about as much of a service dog as you can get, helps with disease/injury and improves persons quality of life.

We all a agree that there is no free pass for a poorly behaved animal regardless of it’s official or unofficial status and that includes the human owners too.

My issue is that what qualifies an individual for having a service dog is too narrow sometimes, it’s not just seizures, blindness, paralysis aka the obvious ones, that’s all.

The list is long and I just provide the obvious for sake of discussion. A dog that is not trained to provide a service and is not certified no matter what it is is not a service animal by definition!

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FL 4Motion · 06-02-2020, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hotrodz

The list is long and I just provide the obvious for sake of discussion. A dog that is not trained to provide a service and is not certified no matter what it is is not a service animal by definition!

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I agree, but not everyone that could use a service dog can get one, there are shortages of trained dogs a lot of times, but they can get and train an emotional support dog which can can provide a lot of the same support/service. Heck, a lot of times, the calming, steady emotional support IS the service.

With physical issues like stroke, paralysis etc, the service dog is opening doors, turning on lights etc, with psychiatric issues, it really is emotional support, as well as alerting on the stress etc. the training requirements or certification isn’t going to be at the same level, most household dogs with good obedience and socializing training could probably to it.

The VA treats ptsd service dogs as second class service dogs and does not provide the same level of support to them (Ex. vet coverage) compared to physical service dogs. I suppose this issue triggers me bc when I hear “all dogs provide emotional support” or something to that effect, it goes in the same line as when someone treats combat related brain damage and psychiatric injuries as somehow not the same as physical wounds.

Hotrodz · 06-02-2020, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FL 4Motion

I agree, but not everyone that could use a service dog can get one, there are shortages of trained dogs a lot of times, but they can get and train an emotional support dog which can can provide a lot of the same support/service. Heck, a lot of times, the calming, steady emotional support IS the service.

With physical issues like stroke, paralysis etc, the service dog is opening doors, turning on lights etc, with psychiatric issues, it really is emotional support, as well as alerting on the stress etc. the training requirements or certification isn’t going to be at the same level, most household dogs with good obedience and socializing training could probably to it.

The VA treats ptsd service dogs as second class service dogs and does not provide the same level of support to them (Ex. vet coverage) compared to physical service dogs. I suppose this issue triggers me bc when I hear “all dogs provide emotional support” or something to that effect, it goes in the same line as when someone treats combat related brain damage and psychiatric injuries as somehow not the same as physical wounds.

The issue is not that you can't get a service dog for some of the things you speak of the problem is the lack of trained and certified dogs. All the programs which provide such dogs survive on donations and it takes a long time to train a dog effectively and then not all dogs are capable of being trained.

I get what you are saying including knowing a little about training dogs as I trained upland bird dogs with a professional dog trainer for years.

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Spooler · 06-02-2020, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hotrodz

The issue is not that you can't get a service dog for some of the things you speak of the problem is the lack of trained and certified dogs. All the programs which provide such dogs survive on donations and it takes a long time to train a dog effectively and then not all dogs are capable of being trained.

I get what you are saying including knowing a little about training dogs as I trained upland bird dogs with a professional dog trainer for years.

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Yeap, professionally trained service dogs are very hard to get and very expensive. I think his issue is the way the VA classifies them. It strikes a nerve because of their lack of providing care for said dogs when the Veteran is in need.

Hotrodz · 06-02-2020, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spooler

Yeap, professionally trained service dogs are very hard to get and very expensive. I think his issue is the way the VA classifies them. It strikes a nerve because of their lack of providing care for said dogs when the Veteran is in need.

Agreed!

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