100hp / Liter

pulpmelon_Z · 10-19-2011, 04:06 AM

The Civic is pretty heavily tuned, but luckily I know an 'easy going garage' for the MOT

Jordo! · 10-19-2011, 05:29 AM

On the average, about 307-310 to the tire on a dynojet should be in that ball park at the crank, but really short of removing the motor and placing on an engine dyno, it's an educated guess at best.

On a dynojet, full bolt-ons' plus tune will get you in that ball park, give or take transient factors like intake temps and correction factor. You may exceed it with pulleys (IMO, not recommended) and long tube headers (big job).

Other kinds of dynamometers typically have numerous settings that can be adjusted, so depending on how they are calibrated, it's hard to say. Dynojets are generally very, very consistent from one to the other, where correction factor is only major X factor.

But really, that specific output per liter isn't anything special. You can build N/A motors that will exceed it, and with forced induction go well beyond it.

pulpmelon_Z · 10-19-2011, 06:13 AM

My two local dyno's are a MAHA and a Dyna-Pack

TBH I dont really care what the headline number is so long as its 40hp above the base line - job done

Jordo! · 10-19-2011, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pulpmelon_Z

My two local dyno's are a MAHA and a Dyna-Pack

TBH I dont really care what the headline number is so long as its 40hp above the base line - job done

Pick one, get a baseline, work out the change from the claimed 332 bhp, add bolt-on's and see what you gain

Is MAHA a rolling road? Never heard of it.

Cmike2780 · 10-19-2011, 02:34 PM

Just get twin turbo's and leave the 370hp figure in the dust. At the end of the day, 370 is just a thoeretical number in your head since you can't get an accurate number @ the crank without pulling the engine off the chassis. Full bolt-on's and an UpRev tune can def get you close to that number considering its theoretically just a 38hp increase. If the claims are anywhere near true, just the Stillen Gen 3's and Stillen CBE is "suppose" to net 35.5hp @ the wheels. Which would translate to a few more at the crank.

pulpmelon_Z · 10-19-2011, 02:41 PM

Its a TAT sun dyno with maha rollers in truth.

Jordo! · 10-19-2011, 10:11 PM

Hmm. Must be a kind of roling road then. If it's load holding the numbers you make will have a lot to do with how they have it calibrated for your car.

You should get a whp and estimate for bhp based on coast down. be interesting to see what you make stock and modded.

Lemers · 10-19-2011, 10:39 PM

The 100hp/liter is a performance goal for the industry for high performance cars.

pulpmelon_Z · 10-20-2011, 04:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jordo!

Hmm. Must be a kind of roling road then. If it's load holding the numbers you make will have a lot to do with how they have it calibrated for your car.

You should get a whp and estimate for bhp based on coast down. be interesting to see what you make stock and modded.

Correct, It uses inertia run down mode to work out a drive loss figure, and DIN or SAE correction for environmental factors.

The crank figures this dyno gives are supprisingly accurate.

After i've paid for a new kitchen roof, the Z is gunna get tuned up

Jordo! · 10-20-2011, 09:18 AM

Cool -- keep us posted!

John@Z1 · 10-20-2011, 09:42 AM

Gen 3 intakes, headers and testpipe or Long tube headers and a really good exhaust system. The tune will clean it up after the upgrades.

Pelican170 · 10-20-2011, 11:20 AM

Ive read in the past that the difference from WHP to Crank HP is about 15%. So i would think that if you dyno at 315 whp, that would be around the 370 crank HP.. of course as mentioned all dynos are different and a Dynojet will read higher than Mustang dynos as well, so who knows if it is ever accurate. But then again, how do they agree upon the 370z have 331 hp in the first place??

Jordo! · 10-20-2011, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pelican170

...a Dynojet will read higher than Mustang dynos as well...

Not necessisarily... all depends how they calibrate it. They can "break hearts" or "lift spirits" depending on the settings.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pelican170

...how do they agree upon the 370z have 331 hp in the first place??

Presumably, on an engine dyno.

Then we might wonder whether they're claiming ps units (probably) or hp units, which is a bit different (ps units are a few % lower).

Then again, there's usually additional fudge factors either to round up (selling point) or under rate (happier customers when they go to chassis dynos) that are applied behind the scenes.

Only way to really know is to break-in the motor, make sure all is good, remove it and put it on an engine dyno.

Oh, and it's allegedly 332 bhp

Cmike2780 · 10-20-2011, 03:07 PM

I came up with this a while back, which kind of gives you a ballpark figure comparing engine hp vs rwhp.

Basically need at least 3 known variables.
1.A baseline engine (assuming 332hp)
2.A baseline @ the wheels on a rolling dyno (stock)
3.A final number @ the wheels on a rolling dyno (with all bolt-on mods, etc.)

Quote:

Assuming 332hp @the crank & 275hp baseline @the wheels.

332 bhp x Y (whp gain)/275 whp= X (bhp gain)

Example 1:
for a 20 whp gain on the final dyno reading with all mods

332 bhp x 20whp/275 whp= 24.15 bhp gain
332 bhp + 24.15 bhp gain= 356.15 bhp @ crank

Example 2:
5 whp gain on the final dyno reading with all mods

332 bhp x 5whp/275 whp= 6.04 bhp gain
332 bhp + 6.04 bhp gain= 338.04 bhp @ crank

Methodical4u · 10-20-2011, 03:47 PM

370 at the crank wouldn't be nearly as hard... now 370 at the wheels? That's a little different story.

10-19-2011, 05:29 AM	#17 (permalink)
Jordo! A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2010 Location: nirvana Posts: 6,394 Drives: 2023 NATM Rep Power: 418	On the average, about 307-310 to the tire on a dynojet should be in that ball park at the crank, but really short of removing the motor and placing on an engine dyno, it's an educated guess at best. On a dynojet, full bolt-ons' plus tune will get you in that ball park, give or take transient factors like intake temps and correction factor. You may exceed it with pulleys (IMO, not recommended) and long tube headers (big job). Other kinds of dynamometers typically have numerous settings that can be adjusted, so depending on how they are calibrated, it's hard to say. Dynojets are generally very, very consistent from one to the other, where correction factor is only major X factor. But really, that specific output per liter isn't anything special. You can build N/A motors that will exceed it, and with forced induction go well beyond it. __________________ Enjoy it. Destroy it.

10-19-2011, 02:34 PM	#20 (permalink)
Cmike2780 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Long Island Posts: 5,059 Drives: slowwww Rep Power: 29	Just get twin turbo's and leave the 370hp figure in the dust. At the end of the day, 370 is just a thoeretical number in your head since you can't get an accurate number @ the crank without pulling the engine off the chassis. Full bolt-on's and an UpRev tune can def get you close to that number considering its theoretically just a 38hp increase. If the claims are anywhere near true, just the Stillen Gen 3's and Stillen CBE is "suppose" to net 35.5hp @ the wheels. Which would translate to a few more at the crank. __________________ [09][MB][6-Spd MT][Touring][Stillen Gen III][K&N][Borla CBE][Evo-R] [ArchitTEK Photography]

10-19-2011, 10:11 PM	#22 (permalink)
Jordo! A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2010 Location: nirvana Posts: 6,394 Drives: 2023 NATM Rep Power: 418	Hmm. Must be a kind of roling road then. If it's load holding the numbers you make will have a lot to do with how they have it calibrated for your car. You should get a whp and estimate for bhp based on coast down. be interesting to see what you make stock and modded. __________________ Enjoy it. Destroy it.

10-19-2011, 10:39 PM	#23 (permalink)
Lemers A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Izmir, Turkey Posts: 15,371 Drives: 2012 Traverse LTZ Rep Power: 52	The 100hp/liter is a performance goal for the industry for high performance cars. __________________ 2010 Black Cherry Touring/Sport/Nav Now - 2012 Travese LTZ until I leave for Turkey

10-20-2011, 09:18 AM	#25 (permalink)
Jordo! A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2010 Location: nirvana Posts: 6,394 Drives: 2023 NATM Rep Power: 418	Cool -- keep us posted! __________________ Enjoy it. Destroy it.

10-19-2011, 04:06 AM	#16 (permalink)
pulpmelon_Z Base Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: UK Posts: 23 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 14	The Civic is pretty heavily tuned, but luckily I know an 'easy going garage' for the MOT

10-19-2011, 06:13 AM	#18 (permalink)
pulpmelon_Z Base Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: UK Posts: 23 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 14	My two local dyno's are a MAHA and a Dyna-Pack TBH I dont really care what the headline number is so long as its 40hp above the base line - job done

10-19-2011, 02:41 PM	#21 (permalink)
pulpmelon_Z Base Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: UK Posts: 23 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 14	Its a TAT sun dyno with maha rollers in truth.

10-20-2011, 09:42 AM	#26 (permalink)
John@Z1 The370Z.com Sponsor Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: GA Posts: 1,589 Drives: Turbos Rep Power: 20	Gen 3 intakes, headers and testpipe or Long tube headers and a really good exhaust system. The tune will clean it up after the upgrades. __________________ Z1 Motorsports will beat any advertised price on Nissan OEM Parts! 770-838-7777 ext 311 AIM: JohnatZ1 email: John@Z1motorsports.com

10-20-2011, 11:20 AM	#27 (permalink)
Pelican170 Track Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Sandy Hook, CT Posts: 972 Drives: Nissan 370z Nismo Rep Power: 16	Ive read in the past that the difference from WHP to Crank HP is about 15%. So i would think that if you dyno at 315 whp, that would be around the 370 crank HP.. of course as mentioned all dynos are different and a Dynojet will read higher than Mustang dynos as well, so who knows if it is ever accurate. But then again, how do they agree upon the 370z have 331 hp in the first place?? __________________ Fast Intentions CF Exhaust - Fast Intentions HFC's - HPS Tubes w/ AFE Dry Flow Filter's

10-20-2011, 03:47 PM	#30 (permalink)
Methodical4u A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Maryland Posts: 1,393 Drives: 11 370 6mt pw w/sp Rep Power: 16	370 at the crank wouldn't be nearly as hard... now 370 at the wheels? That's a little different story.

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