F.I. Long Tube Headers Vs. PPE Long Tube Headers

edub370 · 08-07-2013, 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XwChriswX

Since this is open ended, it doesn't really help...

Do you mean more peak power, or more low end power? Different users might want different results.

below, pretty much answers it

Quote:

Originally Posted by Megan370z

from my understanding of both, PPE should have a little more power in the higher powerband than the F.I. but a little less in the lower end

but it wasn't proved yet .. hehe

should be like any long tube set up, and really help mid to upper rpm range power

Sh0velMan · 08-07-2013, 09:40 AM

Hmmm.

Want top end power, get the PPE's, want mid-low power, get FI's.

PPEHeaders · 08-07-2013, 11:53 AM

Our headers make good midrange and top end power gains. Our larger runners offer more flow, and we use a hand made merge collector with a choke/transition that brings up the midrange without loosing top end power gains. (Our new 2000 degree black ceramic coating also helps increase exhaust velocity too add a little more performance too)

Obviously I am a bit biased, but we have had several Pro race teams choose our headers including CWV-Rallysport, DWW Motorsports, and SFR Enterprises.

edub370 · 08-07-2013, 11:53 AM

tbh i imagine both will make similar gains in the same areas (mid to high powerband), not saying fi's aren't great. i just am willing to say PPE's would make SLIGHTLY more because of their stepped design.

just my

Sh0velMan · 08-07-2013, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by edub370

tbh i imagine both will make similar gains in the same areas (mid to high powerband), not saying fi's aren't great. i just am willing to say PPE's would make SLIGHTLY more because of their stepped design.

just my

They really won't. The FI headers are great street parts, but their runners are too small to see large gains at the top of the rev range like the PPEs do.

SS_Firehawk · 08-07-2013, 02:15 PM

I love F.I.'s exhaust, but the PPE headers are on a different level. The merge collector is a work of art. 15 degree angle, 5" smooth transition, they were tuned to a specific length to match the powerband of the motor, the black coating is just hawt. There is no bottom end loss, minimal gains, but the mid and top end lustworthy for an NA mod.

I refused to remove them when I wanted to go forced induction, so I spent more money to get something that fits around my PPE's

XwChriswX · 08-07-2013, 03:28 PM

Agreed with what's been said above. My low end gains were nice with the F.I.'s, but sacrifice top end numbers.

nismomo · 04-13-2014, 09:41 AM

Can someone post dyno sheets? I'd like to compare curve patterns, I saw a PPE sheet with similar flattening at the top. I also read mixed articles on the benefits (or lack of) stepping. Both companies provided different info. Having said that, there is a local shop that works on many Zs. They've installed both FI and PPE and they are saying PPE are delivering better gains. This thread has not helped me pick one over the other. FI has a great reputation and I think Tony would be interested in evolving his header design if he thought they could be better. People above my post are making claims about collectors, materials, etc... Are these just opinions? Let the charts tell the story.

Sh0velMan · 04-13-2014, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nismomo

Can someone post dyno sheets? I'd like to compare curve patterns, I saw a PPE sheet with similar flattening at the top. I also read mixed articles on the benefits (or lack of) stepping. Both companies provided different info. Having said that, there is a local shop that works on many Zs. They've installed both FI and PPE and they are saying PPE are delivering better gains. This thread has not helped me pick one over the other. FI has a great reputation and I think Tony would be interested in evolving his header design if he thought they could be better. People above my post are making claims about collectors, materials, etc... Are these just opinions? Let the charts tell the story.

FI LTH power curve: (ignoring the actual numbers because of dyno variance)

( Click to show/hide )

To one from my PPE's (sorry, chart is a little 'busy' hard to see the traces)

( Click to show/hide )

nismomo · 04-13-2014, 10:32 AM

Thanks, much appreciated. I see the PPE's continued to climb while FI plateau at 7k rpm. I see PPE's file says Nismo CAI, was the FI dyno run with a CAI as well? I've read that CAI helps at the very top of the band. If the FI run did not have a CAI, could this be the reason why it plateaus compared to the PPE?

takjak2 · 04-13-2014, 11:50 AM

Most of the HP gains from either header mentioned here are from deleting the cats. Other than that you are losing some weight but the the power gains alone are not worth the install costs.

nismomo · 04-13-2014, 12:02 PM

around $2450 including parts, labor, uprev license and tune vs resonated test pipes. Hard to justify the extra $ for the extra hp you get.

G37sHKS · 04-13-2014, 12:52 PM

Another interesting dyno result
First mod: PPE Headers... +35WHP

Sh0velMan · 04-13-2014, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nismomo

Thanks, much appreciated. I see the PPE's continued to climb while FI plateau at 7k rpm. I see PPE's file says Nismo CAI, was the FI dyno run with a CAI as well? I've read that CAI helps at the very top of the band. If the FI run did not have a CAI, could this be the reason why it plateaus compared to the PPE?

The other car is equipped very similarly. Same exhaust, comparable intakes, etc.

The PPE's flattening out after 7300rpm is actually an intake manifold/throttle body restriction. (You can see the 'quenching' action this restriction has starting at ~6400rpm. A linear fall off of torque, that's what it looks like when you put a restrictor plate on an engine.)

I'll be addressing that eventually and then the top end will be even more dramatic.

Yeah the cost isn't worth it for a street car if you have to pay someone else to do it.

Megan370z · 04-13-2014, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by takjak2

Most of the HP gains from either header mentioned here are from deleting the cats. Other than that you are losing some weight but the the power gains alone are not worth the install costs.

unless you do it yourself which is free

08-07-2013, 09:40 AM	#32 (permalink)
Sh0velMan A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Dallas/Ft.Worth Posts: 3,349 Drives: Noisily. Rep Power: 20	Hmmm. Want top end power, get the PPE's, want mid-low power, get FI's. __________________ Buy My Car! \| Build Thread

08-07-2013, 11:53 AM	#33 (permalink)
PPEHeaders Base Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Tempe, AZ Posts: 6 Drives: none Rep Power: 15	Our headers make good midrange and top end power gains. Our larger runners offer more flow, and we use a hand made merge collector with a choke/transition that brings up the midrange without loosing top end power gains. (Our new 2000 degree black ceramic coating also helps increase exhaust velocity too add a little more performance too) Obviously I am a bit biased, but we have had several Pro race teams choose our headers including CWV-Rallysport, DWW Motorsports, and SFR Enterprises. cdoxp800, Megan370z and Sh0velMan like this. __________________ https://sphotos-a-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net/h...89584762_n.jpg *Race Proven Headers!* 370Z, 350ZHR, 350ZDE www.ppeengineering.com Facebook

08-07-2013, 11:53 AM	#34 (permalink)
edub370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2011 Location: KCMO Posts: 3,458 Drives: 09 370z S/T 6MT Rep Power: 20	tbh i imagine both will make similar gains in the same areas (mid to high powerband), not saying fi's aren't great. i just am willing to say PPE's would make SLIGHTLY more because of their stepped design. just my __________________ 09 370Z ST 6MT//Injen CAI//Greddy CBE//TP//TSW's//Swifts//Stillen lip//Whiteline sways 326whp/268tq

08-07-2013, 02:15 PM	#36 (permalink)
SS_Firehawk Premium Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Tampa Posts: 4,142 Drives: 13' Magma Red Nismo Rep Power: 7335	I love F.I.'s exhaust, but the PPE headers are on a different level. The merge collector is a work of art. 15 degree angle, 5" smooth transition, they were tuned to a specific length to match the powerband of the motor, the black coating is just hawt. There is no bottom end loss, minimal gains, but the mid and top end lustworthy for an NA mod. I refused to remove them when I wanted to go forced induction, so I spent more money to get something that fits around my PPE's XwChriswX and Sh0velMan like this. __________________ Old Car:GTM TSC'd 550whp / 410lbft tq @ 11.88PSI New Car: Under Construction

08-07-2013, 03:28 PM	#37 (permalink)
XwChriswX WFLYIDNNE Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: In The Fastlane Posts: 50,648 Drives: 02 GDB WRX Rep Power: 452	Agreed with what's been said above. My low end gains were nice with the F.I.'s, but sacrifice top end numbers. beauz likes this. __________________ Bonnie - Stage 2, Audio build coming this fall! R.I.P. Abby 3/29/10 - 3/30/14

04-13-2014, 09:41 AM	#38 (permalink)
nismomo Base Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: il Posts: 54 Drives: 11 nismo Rep Power: 12	Can someone post dyno sheets? I'd like to compare curve patterns, I saw a PPE sheet with similar flattening at the top. I also read mixed articles on the benefits (or lack of) stepping. Both companies provided different info. Having said that, there is a local shop that works on many Zs. They've installed both FI and PPE and they are saying PPE are delivering better gains. This thread has not helped me pick one over the other. FI has a great reputation and I think Tony would be interested in evolving his header design if he thought they could be better. People above my post are making claims about collectors, materials, etc... Are these just opinions? Let the charts tell the story.

04-13-2014, 10:32 AM	#40 (permalink)
nismomo Base Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: il Posts: 54 Drives: 11 nismo Rep Power: 12	Thanks, much appreciated. I see the PPE's continued to climb while FI plateau at 7k rpm. I see PPE's file says Nismo CAI, was the FI dyno run with a CAI as well? I've read that CAI helps at the very top of the band. If the FI run did not have a CAI, could this be the reason why it plateaus compared to the PPE?

04-13-2014, 11:50 AM	#41 (permalink)
takjak2 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Sterling, VA Posts: 1,922 Drives: Legit Racecar 370Z Rep Power: 142	Most of the HP gains from either header mentioned here are from deleting the cats. Other than that you are losing some weight but the the power gains alone are not worth the install costs. __________________ Mods \| Stuff \| Things \| Seat Time \| Nismo facebook.com/TeamSparrowSpeed

04-13-2014, 12:02 PM	#42 (permalink)
nismomo Base Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: il Posts: 54 Drives: 11 nismo Rep Power: 12	around $2450 including parts, labor, uprev license and tune vs resonated test pipes. Hard to justify the extra $ for the extra hp you get.

04-13-2014, 12:52 PM	#43 (permalink)
G37sHKS A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Dubai Posts: 1,183 Drives: 09 G37S Coupe 7AT Rep Power: 20	Another interesting dyno result First mod: PPE Headers... +35WHP __________________ G37 BUILD UNDER CONSTRUCTION

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
FI Long Tube Headers...	JrumMusic	Intake/Exhaust	8	04-12-2011 07:35 PM
Long Tube Headers	Mozen	PPE Engineering LLC	0	02-09-2011 03:34 PM
MCR Long tube headers	Valentino	Intake/Exhaust	7	09-01-2010 08:52 PM
PPE Long Tube Headers?	dnasty370z	Intake/Exhaust	11	08-23-2010 01:30 PM
FI Long Tube Headers	docaam	Parts for sale (Private Classifieds)	9	03-31-2010 02:01 PM