Nissan 370Z Forum - K&N Filters on HKS Intake?

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- - K&N Filters on HKS Intake? (http://www.the370z.com/intake-exhaust/26748-k-n-filters-hks-intake.html)

K&N Filters on HKS Intake?

I have been brainstorming for awhile on intakes, but for some reason this idea just keep popping up in my head.

Do you guys think there is enough room to replace the foam HKS filters with K&N cone type filters?

http://i418.photobucket.com/albums/p...hks_intake.jpg

i'm gonna guess not< unless you angle it more pointing down. when i took out my airbox i didnt see allot of room...

Possibly -- you might need to cut the intake tube tho'.

If you can't find a K&N with the right flange size, try AEM dryflow or Apexi.

They have different size cone shaped filters. You can try the one of the S2K. It is fairly thin, but long. (Insert "yeah...that's what she said" joke here)

why would you want to change the filter on the HKS intake? i'd be rather fabricating a heatshield for them instead... :confused:

also i doubt you can find a KN cone that would match that dimension?

Because research has shown that the HKS filter is a peice of crap when filtering. K&Ns rate much higher. I'm sure the intake tubing is 2.5" or 3" in diameter, which a K&N filter will fit.

Just brainstorming, but what about selling the intake altogether and buying a Stillen intake or something similar?

Quote:

Originally Posted by JDW1479 (Post 777557)

Because research has shown that the HKS filter is a peice of crap when filtering. K&Ns rate much higher. I'm sure the intake tubing is 2.5" or 3" in diameter, which a K&N filter will fit.

Oh i see. Thx for the info cause i was thinking about getting their hyper drop ins for my other car. those tubes appear too long to fit any other filter(?).

Quote:

Originally Posted by JDW1479 (Post 777557)

Because research has shown that the HKS filter is a peice of crap when filtering. K&Ns rate much higher. I'm sure the intake tubing is 2.5" or 3" in diameter, which a K&N filter will fit.

Are you refering to that test that was done like 10 years ago with a vaccuum claener and is still pasted on some Supra forum lol? They were selling parts private label to OEM's and to meet certain standards had to redesign those elements. This was several years ago and the filter is much better now. Where is the current research?

I think this is what you are reffering to. Notice the text at the bottom that states: - Extracts of this article have been transcribed from a Japanese article featured in Revspeed Magazine, August 1999.

With all due respect not trying to pick on you at all. I think you could still argue some filters like AEM and K&N could show differences in filtering but I think you have to be fair. There is something called progress and that info is old. To answer your question I think it will be hard as the HKS filter is very compact length wise.

Here is the research or past issues:

HKS RS INTAKE - can it filter enough ??? - evolutionm.net

Attn Hks Filter Users! - evolutionm.net

http://www.mkiv.com/techarticles/filters_test/2/ (yes, the article you posted)

Opinion on HKS style mushroom intake filters? - MX-5 Miata Forum

HKS or K&N filters and why? - NAGTROC - The Nissan GT-R Owners Club

I could probably keep going all night about people having issues with the HKS foam filter. Now they could be on a case by case basis, but I would rather not run the risk on my own car. Grant it, HKS might have changed the design of the filter for the better, and thats great, but again, I'm not going to take the risk.

First let me say I respect your choice to use the other filter. It's decent too however I can find you posts and vendors on the M3 forums for example where I used to belong saying the same about K&N and prefer AFE. Second I think you must have googled "HKS filter problem" and just posted those links. Did you read them all?

I used to own and EVO 9 MR and was part of that forum. If you read your first link from '06, even the original poster goes on to say

Quote:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Z1 Performance
a catch can is not going to help a heavily oiled/dirty MAF sensor - that comes from age, and lack of care in changing/cleaning the air filter - it does help though

On the HKS filters they need to be changed every 10k miles or so - very few people actually do this.
true - most are never changed

OP
I think the catch can can help reduce oil build up if you start using one from day one

You are looking at turbo cars with blow-by and are going to have oil in the intake anyway with no catch tank in a lot of cases. HKS also sells different filters types. If you just go and buy the race one (single layer) run no under tray and not change it for 26k miles that's not reasonable expectations for the product. They have a 3 layer and it's meant to be changed in intervals. Also if you don't make sure the foam is even at the bottom of the cage you will have gaps all around letting dirt in.

Totally disregarded link 2 from 2003.

Totally disregarded link 3 which is the exact think I referenced in my reply from '99 on the Supra forums.

Link 4 from '06. Not much there except a few opinions for and against and one guy who sounds like he left the filter on so long it started to fall apart...

Link 5 skimmed over the first 2 pages. Mostly a discussion on ow they feel the HKS may not flow better than the stock induction system on a GTR. Then there is a guy who states this about K&N:

Quote:

What you said is true, but it makes for a rather narrow reading of a filter's function:

Fpr example, paper elements have holes of various sizes - some small, some large. When the filter is new, it flows quite well because of the large holes. But after a few thousand miles, less under dusty conditions, that changes fast. Once the large holes plug up, air restriction increases.

K&N and AFE filters (my favorite) are not affected by dirt for a very long interval, because the dirt sits on top of the media, and air can move around it easily - rather like boulders at the mouth of a cave.

I am somewhat skeptical of the re-useability claim for K&N. We have strong optical and Scanning electron scopes in our R&D lab, and I examined a cleaned and re-oiled K&N. I found that the little wisps of the cotton gauze that were there when the filter was new were much less prevalent when the filter was serviced - and yes, I carefully re-oiled the filter (I was a K&N dealer as part of my Corvette company for many years). Since the filters are not expensive, I would just buy new ones.

Also, sometimes K&N's do not make good contact with the air box - the rather cheap plastisol gasketing sometimes is not tight. So I would suggest putting a dab of axle grease just inside the airbox, downwind from the filter, and then check to see if there is dirt in it. There should be very little if any. If there is, then it is likely the filter is not sealing well. K&N used to use better materials, both in the cotton and the gaskets.

AFE filters are better in the 3 areas of a gauze filter's performanceL
1) More pleats = more surface area
2) high quality gasket material
3) excellent cotton (I believe they use Egyptian cotton, the best)

www.afefilters.com

Don't know if they make one for the GT-R, but if enough of us call, they will.

My 2 cents.

Right after a guy who says something about the flow rate of HKS, not much about filtering and it's never discussed what element they are using.

In the end again I'm not saying HKS is the best filter but I get a little annoyed at the old misinformation and just try to offer alternative info so people can make their own choice. JDW I don't blame you at all, I saw in a couple of those post the same link to the '99 filter test from the Supra forum, where by the way I also used to belong. I see can totally relate how you said you feel you don't want to take a risk after reading all that. I can understand how you came to this conclusion and run whatever you feel most confident in.

HKS could certainly do a better job about putting peoples minds to ease but I think its marketed poorly in terms of the intakes. I've run their multi-layer filer, installed it correctly and replaced it at recommended service intervals and never had an issue. That's my personal experience though. Here's a shot of one on my 600 WHP Supra, it worked fine for me and I never had a problem with dirt or oil:

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/f...sCarEngine.jpg

In general, foam filters flow well, but filter poorly. Just the nature of the material...

I know what you are saying that has been the stereotype for a long time. Again just putting some info out there so people can make a more educated decision.

Both HKS types use more than 1 layer to trap particles of different sizes. Also their 3 layer doesn't use oil so there's no issue with that one. Again it depends on what you get from them. I have nothing against the other filters either, I've had other intakes besides HKS on other cars. I actually helped AEM recently letting them use my car so their washer bottle bracket would fit on the Nismo. I am running that at the moment.

Taken from the HKS site:

Quote:

HKS replacement Filter Elements are available in a dry 3-layer, triple density or wet 2-layer, dual density construction. The dry 3-layer type is standard in SMF Reloaded Intake kits, and is designed for superior filtration while still providing excellent airflow. The wet 2-layer type is included in Racing Suction kits and is focused on maximizing airflow for performance, yet still keeping harmful particles from the engine. If your vehicle is in a high dust area, HKS recommends using dry 3-layer elements.

I think the HKS intake with their filters or with another filter would be a good intake for JDW either way.

I have nothing against the hks intake, just the foam filters. I just don't trust them 100%. I have used K&N in all my cars and never had a problem, even the oil on the MAF was never an issue. Maybe I should take the leap and try the foam out or stick with what I know best.

Mainly I just wanted to get the info out there because on the other forums they either don't have it or don't take the time to post it.

Get what you feel good about. On a side I know we all have pretty new cars but cleaning the MAF was a popular thing on the E46 M3 forum. When guys went to upgrade their intake on a car that was a few years old they would clean it with this:

CRC Mass Air Flow Cleaner

http://www.ipdusa.com/uploads/images_skus/12358.jpg

Some people reported noticing a difference. Might be a good thing to do annually? You can get it at most auto stores. Just thought I'd throw that out there since you mentioned some concerns with oil type filters.