Tune needed?

ImportConvert

Do you need a tune for HFC's and a Cat-back? How "adaptive" are these cars? I know the factory tune is conservative (as are all factory tunes), but does HFC+Catback throw the tune off, or do people get tunes just to raise the rev-limiter and get a few extra horsepower by being a tad less conservative than OEM?

Any A/F included dyno's of a car with HFC/Catback and no tune?

6MT

There are 4 factory ECU "tunes" for the 2009 (not sure about the 2010's). Some say that with these "bolt-ons", that you need to fiddle with the A/F ratio. I never did and I don't have any issues (never had after 10K kms). My dyno showed improvement over the base-line (factory) numbers.

IMHO no, you don't need a tune. But some will say that it would help. I have never seen the need for one.

(please keep the flaming low.... I know this is a hot-button issue with some.)

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Andrew

2009 370Z Sport/Touring 6MT sold
2013 Honda Civic Si coupe D/D

Nitex

A tune will likely net you a few more HP/tq, as well as get your AF ratios to a desired level. Slight performance increase with a possible increase or decrease in MPG depending on were your AF lands. Our ECU is fairly adaptive, as my car has a safe AF ratio and made some good power from the bolt on mods and im still on stock tune.

If you are not messing with the intake you absolutely do not need a tune. In fact i would not waste your money unless you do.

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2013 Drivers ED GTI | Stage 2 Unitronic

theDreamer

The best thing to do is find a shop with a good accurate dyno, get a AF reading and see how things are.

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ImportConvert

So basically, a tune on a stock car is worth the same % gain as a tune on a modded car, as the ECU is adaptive enough that you get the same % power from your mods either way, pretty much?

PS. You layed down 299 whp on a MUSTANG dyno SAE corrected? Is that what I am seeing? Mods at the time?

PSS. After looking at your dyno graph and A/F, it looks like avg. hp/tq could SLIGHTLY benefit from a tune, but not a whole ton. Mainly the car might feel a bit "smoother", but it doesn't drop off bad at all when your A/F dips. Nice!

Is "Syncrorev" still "accurate"? Or is it jerky now?

Nitex

^^ i don't doubt that its close, however as edited in my first post, i wouldn't worry about it till you mess with the intake

Yes 299 on a mustang dyno with Gen 3 intakes, Berk HFC and Stillen CBE w/stock tune.

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2013 Drivers ED GTI | Stage 2 Unitronic

ImportConvert

Why? Is this because smoothing out intake flow will raise the A/F and possibly create a lean condition while un-corking the exhaust will create a rich ("safe") condition? Or is it that the ECU doesn't respond well without a tune to mods on the front half?

I honestly don't think a tune would be worth much (5whp?) if all was being done was correcting your A/F here.

Does the car surge or feel less smooth than before the mods?

Nitex

Lean condition is a possible worry. I threw a lean code shortly after installing my intakes. Thats why i opted for a dyno pull to see if things were checking out. I would say 5hp is a good guess on gains from a tune with bolt on's. It has been to long for me to comment on smoothness of power delivery pre and post mods.

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2013 Drivers ED GTI | Stage 2 Unitronic

ImportConvert

I presume that you did the HFC and the CB first, then the intakes? Any drivability issues with just the exhaust?

Which provided the biggest SOTP performance increase, or was I/E equal? I really don't think I would mess with intakes for less than 10whp. (me personally)

Nitex

Sorry for the slow reply, work got busy and i was forced to do something! Rude i know, its like they actually want to build this plane finally (787 dreamliner).

I cant comment first hand on SRM as i heel and toe, plus i purchased base-base so i wouldn't be tempted with SRM laziness. Also with my upgrade plans i would have wasted a lot of the sport package. I did do the HFC and CB first, then the CAI. There was no issues with that setup that i noticed. In fact after first installing the intakes and throwing the lean code i was tempted with going back to stock intakes. But after cutting my car up for them there was no turning back. Plus it adds some wow factor under the hood. SOTP feel seemed fairly similar between the 2 stage upgrade. But the real grin factor came from the sound. And HFC + CBE will get you there in that regards

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2013 Drivers ED GTI | Stage 2 Unitronic

ImportConvert

I know what you mean! They won't even let me get on here at work. Something about our patients requiring monitoring of their cardiac drips and telemetry and other such nonsense. (I don't carry an iPhone because I would be tempted to reply to e-mails at work for that reason. I don't want to be like all the other people I see who have their face buried in their phone all the time).

I have looked, and the back-side of the engine is worth 25whp at most. Any one mod will get about 18whp.

If that mod is a cat-back, 18whp. If it is a set of HFC's, 18whp. However, if you do HFC and THEN cat-back, the CB is worth 5-8whp, and vis-versa.

From what I understand, 1 mod is worth 18whp give or take, the 2nd about 6.

I will skip the HFC's and just get an FI CB if I do decide to go this route and buy the car/get the mod. That way warranty is in NO WAY compromised. Compromising warranty for 6whp. Seriously fail.

Nitex

I think your close, but there is something missing. As my full setup gained +40whp over the avg baseline with the intakes. I would agree that if you only gain 6hp with the addition of HFC then its not worth it. Its possible that CBE = +18 alone HFC = +18 alone HFC+CBE = 24 and intake gives +16ish ? Of course elevation, ambient temps and other factors can change this. But as a general assumption i think its pretty close.

In regards to the HFCs, i would say the best attribute was the sound. However, the worst part about the HFC is also the sound. Let me explain. Addition of the HFC added aN aggressive note, very deep and almost mean sounding. Unfortunately this also amplified the sound of the decel hiss. You will notice the hiss with the CBE alone. But soon as you toss the HFC on, it will become very prominent. Its all subjective to personal preferences of course. I would suggest finding someone local that has the mods your looking to install and go from there gl

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2013 Drivers ED GTI | Stage 2 Unitronic

fullmonty

You won't need a tune for a CB and HFC. If you get one you may get some more power out of it all, but you won't need to get one

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Loges

I have K&N drop ins and Z1 MAF tubes installed now with the intentions of getting Motordyne ART pipes and Fast Intentions CBE (not sure yet on 12" vs 18" resonators but def one of the two, NOT going non-resonated).

Will this require a tune? I know obviously it would help but I'm concerned on whether or not I will run the risk of running too lean and possibly damaging the engine. Once my warranty is up though I'm all for a tune

Tipin4moe

Have you had any engine issues with your mods and not running the tune? I have so far ? Or did you end up tuning your Z?