Jordo!'s Intake Project

Jordo! · 08-25-2010, 06:24 PM

Here are some teaser shots of my intake project, currently in progress.

The goals are:

1. Better breathing, more airflow!

2. Correct metering of air mass so happy ECU and no off-idle lag.

3. Maintain OEM heatshielding and (nigh) OEM look.

4. Should sound a bit meaner too.

And all on a budget...

The details: I am using the OEM MAF sensor holder to maintain stock diameter for proper air mass readings, keeping (for now) the OEM intake tubes, and even making use of the OEM airboxes to block heat.

The filters are K&N RX3820 which has a nice open top and built in velocity stack. Note that the open top will be positioned perfectly for the OEM cool air duct (or at least it should once installed...)

I need to do something about the back to perfectly seal it against underhood heat tho...

I think some sort of reducer couper or rubber boot that is 6.5" to 4.5" would be perfect --anyone know where I can find something like that with those dimensions? (see example below)

ProfessorDave · 08-25-2010, 07:38 PM

Interesting project. You might find heating/ventilation duct adapters in the size you are looking for.

Jordo! · 08-25-2010, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProfessorDave

Interesting project. You might find heating/ventilation duct adapters in the size you are looking for.

Thanks

Good idea -- I'll have to get creative. If I can't hack up a nice rubber reducer to fit and bolt on, I'll have to try chopping up a coffee can.

Either way, so long as it's black and sealed, it should still look pretty stock to the casual eye (won't really be visibile from the top) and keep all the ambient heat out.

I have baseline dynos posted, so once I get the fine details sorted out, I'll install these and see what the dyno says in comparison to bone stock and to the K&N filters.

There may be a test tipe dyno that happens first, tho'...

christian370z · 08-25-2010, 09:49 PM

Really cool Jordo, this should be extremely interesting to see the final results. Do you think the bottle neck of the OEM intake is from the section from the box to the MAP then? From a practicality perspective, how would this be any better than throwing in a K&N panel filter?

Jordo! · 08-25-2010, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by christian370z

Really cool Jordo, this should be extremely interesting to see the final results. Do you think the bottle neck of the OEM intake is from the section from the box to the MAP then? From a practicality perspective, how would this be any better than throwing in a K&N panel filter?

No, I think the major "bottleneck" are the panel filters themselves. Cone filters just tend to flow air better than panel filters.

It's possible that some smooth intake tubes would help flow a bit too (and there is a mysterious resonator box that may or may not affect flow), but really, the goal here was just to have some better filters mounted, while maintaining proper metering of fuel and maintaining protection from heat.

As soon as you start monkeying with the location of the MAF snesor, bends in the tubing, diameter of the tubing, etc. you can run into problems with meauring air mass and thus affect the proper metering of fuel.

Modshack took this into account, and made a very slight variation (which apparently didn't adversely affect driveability) but it is unclear as to whether this improved power as he hasn't dynoed, at least to the best of my knowledge.

Of course, if you have tuning capability, you can recalibrate things or make corrections, but I can't do that yet, so I want to keep the general set-up as OEM as possible while improving flow as much as I can

Now whether or not this makes a positive difference all remains to be seen... dynos in due course.

JvKintheUSA · 08-25-2010, 10:22 PM

In for updates and results

christian370z · 08-26-2010, 12:21 AM

You make some good points, I was going to mention tuning correctability but it would definately be easier and more cost efficient to improve what is already there. Good luck, this should be interesting!

Jordo! · 08-26-2010, 03:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by christian370z

You make some good points, I was going to mention tuning correctability but it would definately be easier and more cost efficient to improve what is already there. Good luck, this should be interesting!

Sooner or later Uprev Osirus end-user friendly software will be brought into play, but probably not until the end of the year.

I'll keep ya guys posted -- should have this (or the test pipes) installed and a new dyno within the next few weeks

Gonna do one at a time to evaluate the effects independently.

Updates on the intake assembly will be posted here; dynos in my "proven power" thread, probably with a link to it here.

96bigbody · 08-27-2010, 04:21 PM

ProfessorDave · 08-27-2010, 11:20 PM

I'd like to see the dyno sheet on that carpet 96bigbody!

Jordo! · 08-28-2010, 02:22 AM

Found some cool plastic black boxes that I can modify and bolt to the rear of the OEM airbox housing (perhaps with a few L brackets?) in order to close it off. Then I just need a circular hole for the intake tube - done!

I'll share pics when it's completed

Q8y_drifter · 08-28-2010, 02:43 AM

Just to give you some ideas...

This is the intake that Nismo designed for the 380RS-C. The engine is a 400bhp VQ35HR stroked to 3.8L. Looking at the plenum it looks like it has ITB's. Anyhow, you can see how they used cone filters (which appear to be the short JWT-style ones), along with fully covered heat shields that seal all the way around and all the way to the air ducts. Thus any air entering the engine is fresh from the ducts only. Also note that the stock ribbed intake pipes are replaced with smooth aluminum piping that gets rid of the resonator boxes. You can get the Cobb intake pipes to replace the stock units.

Jordo! · 08-28-2010, 02:55 AM

^^^ Thanks for that

Yeah, eventually the OEM intake hoses will have to go.

As to the intakes on the 3.8 stroker themselves, they appear to be those "mushroom" style filters with the foam elements; they flow well, but provide terrible filtration.

K&N also offers a universal sealed element set-up, but it's a bit pricey. I wanted to try and make use of the OEM airboxes, which already duct cool air in from the bumper, and already fit under the hood perfectly (although I will have to modify the back a bit).

I'd really like to get those nice Apexi filters under there, but it was too difficult to get them to fit where I wanted.

These K&N's I selected should have more surface area than the ones Stillen are using for their SC set up (and a nice open top!) -- therefore should be more than sufficient for N/A.

That said, an alternate idea would be to build airboxes out of heatshielded coffee cans (painted black, or maybe wrapped in that 3M cf stuff) with duct work going to the fangs. But then I need to make some sort of bracketry to hold it all in place as well as build ducting from the bumper... I'll try the OEM airboxes first and see how it goes...

Jordo! · 10-06-2010, 07:10 PM

Still in progress, but here is an update.

Essentially, I am rebuilding the back of the airbox to allow more room for the K&N filters. Still looks a bit rough, but it's coming together...

Will probably have to cut about 1" of material off of the top part of airbox back I've built for the passenger side intake to make room for the power steering fluid reservoir, but this gives you an idea of what I'm attempting to accomplish...

So far, so good -- with a bit of insulation material to make up for imperfect sealing between plastic components, should maintain OEM heat shielding and cool air ducting, while addding a better flowing set-up that would be achieved with just a panel filter.

Moreover, after I clean it up a bit, to a casual oberver it should look pretty stock once installed.

More updates soon with dynos to determine whether it was worth all the trouble...

GZ3 · 10-07-2010, 03:56 PM

I highly recommend the HPS intake pipes, i got these to smooth out airflow over the corrogurated stock tubes. 110Shipped! also you said these k&n come with a velocity stack? is there anyway you can snap a pic?? thanks man, no wories if your to busy

08-25-2010, 07:38 PM	#2 (permalink)
ProfessorDave A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Scranton, PA Posts: 1,580 Drives: In the fairway Rep Power: 19	Interesting project. You might find heating/ventilation duct adapters in the size you are looking for. __________________ Rain, snow, sleet, hail: 2009 Mazda 3 sGT HB Everything else: 2009 370z, PW Touring 6MT

08-25-2010, 09:49 PM	#4 (permalink)
christian370z A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Newport Beach Posts: 3,900 Drives: 2010 370Z/Saab 900se Rep Power: 432	Really cool Jordo, this should be extremely interesting to see the final results. Do you think the bottle neck of the OEM intake is from the section from the box to the MAP then? From a practicality perspective, how would this be any better than throwing in a K&N panel filter? __________________ -320whp / 259wftlbs- SP Rays -- RE-11s -- SpecialtyZ Tune -- Swift Springs -- Stillen 25R Oil Cooler -- Stillen G3 Intakes -- Berk HFCs -- F.I. 12" CBE -- Stillen Sway Bars -- Es14 Spring -- INGS+1 lip -- CF Spoiler -- GTR Start Button -- VLED Parking Lights -- PWJDM V2 shift knob

08-25-2010, 10:22 PM	#6 (permalink)
JvKintheUSA Enthusiast Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Canton, GA Posts: 465 Drives: 2013 Shelby GT500 Rep Power: 428	In for updates and results __________________

08-26-2010, 12:21 AM	#7 (permalink)
christian370z A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Newport Beach Posts: 3,900 Drives: 2010 370Z/Saab 900se Rep Power: 432	You make some good points, I was going to mention tuning correctability but it would definately be easier and more cost efficient to improve what is already there. Good luck, this should be interesting! __________________ -320whp / 259wftlbs- SP Rays -- RE-11s -- SpecialtyZ Tune -- Swift Springs -- Stillen 25R Oil Cooler -- Stillen G3 Intakes -- Berk HFCs -- F.I. 12" CBE -- Stillen Sway Bars -- Es14 Spring -- INGS+1 lip -- CF Spoiler -- GTR Start Button -- VLED Parking Lights -- PWJDM V2 shift knob

08-27-2010, 04:21 PM	#9 (permalink)
96bigbody Base Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Houston Posts: 138 Drives: 09 nissan 370z pw/a7 Rep Power: 16	__________________ 09 370z Pw 7at touring sport nav... 02 Som trans am ws7.. 408 & T76 96 black impala ss.. 396 & juice Last edited by 96bigbody; 08-27-2010 at 04:31 PM.

08-27-2010, 11:20 PM	#10 (permalink)
ProfessorDave A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Scranton, PA Posts: 1,580 Drives: In the fairway Rep Power: 19	I'd like to see the dyno sheet on that carpet 96bigbody! __________________ Rain, snow, sleet, hail: 2009 Mazda 3 sGT HB Everything else: 2009 370z, PW Touring 6MT

08-28-2010, 02:22 AM	#11 (permalink)
Jordo! A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2010 Location: nirvana Posts: 6,394 Drives: 2023 NATM Rep Power: 418	Found some cool plastic black boxes that I can modify and bolt to the rear of the OEM airbox housing (perhaps with a few L brackets?) in order to close it off. Then I just need a circular hole for the intake tube - done! I'll share pics when it's completed __________________ Enjoy it. Destroy it. Last edited by Jordo!; 08-28-2010 at 02:24 AM.

08-28-2010, 02:43 AM	#12 (permalink)
Q8y_drifter Enthusiast Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 306 Drives: 08 Infiniti G35 5AT Rep Power: 15	Just to give you some ideas... This is the intake that Nismo designed for the 380RS-C. The engine is a 400bhp VQ35HR stroked to 3.8L. Looking at the plenum it looks like it has ITB's. Anyhow, you can see how they used cone filters (which appear to be the short JWT-style ones), along with fully covered heat shields that seal all the way around and all the way to the air ducts. Thus any air entering the engine is fresh from the ducts only. Also note that the stock ribbed intake pipes are replaced with smooth aluminum piping that gets rid of the resonator boxes. You can get the Cobb intake pipes to replace the stock units. __________________ 08 G35 5AT Sedan \| Stillen CBE \| Invidia HFC \| Injen CAI \| Uprev Tune \| Akebono BBK \| Tanabe Coilovers \| Hotchkis Sway Bars \| GTSpec FSB \| Black Headlights & Grille \| Volk GT-F Wheels \| Hankook V12 Evo Tires

08-28-2010, 02:55 AM	#13 (permalink)
Jordo! A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2010 Location: nirvana Posts: 6,394 Drives: 2023 NATM Rep Power: 418	^^^ Thanks for that Yeah, eventually the OEM intake hoses will have to go. As to the intakes on the 3.8 stroker themselves, they appear to be those "mushroom" style filters with the foam elements; they flow well, but provide terrible filtration. K&N also offers a universal sealed element set-up, but it's a bit pricey. I wanted to try and make use of the OEM airboxes, which already duct cool air in from the bumper, and already fit under the hood perfectly (although I will have to modify the back a bit). I'd really like to get those nice Apexi filters under there, but it was too difficult to get them to fit where I wanted. These K&N's I selected should have more surface area than the ones Stillen are using for their SC set up (and a nice open top!) -- therefore should be more than sufficient for N/A. That said, an alternate idea would be to build airboxes out of heatshielded coffee cans (painted black, or maybe wrapped in that 3M cf stuff) with duct work going to the fangs. But then I need to make some sort of bracketry to hold it all in place as well as build ducting from the bumper... I'll try the OEM airboxes first and see how it goes... __________________ Enjoy it. Destroy it. Last edited by Jordo!; 08-28-2010 at 03:05 AM.

10-06-2010, 07:10 PM	#14 (permalink)
Jordo! A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2010 Location: nirvana Posts: 6,394 Drives: 2023 NATM Rep Power: 418	Still in progress, but here is an update. Essentially, I am rebuilding the back of the airbox to allow more room for the K&N filters. Still looks a bit rough, but it's coming together... Will probably have to cut about 1" of material off of the top part of airbox back I've built for the passenger side intake to make room for the power steering fluid reservoir, but this gives you an idea of what I'm attempting to accomplish... So far, so good -- with a bit of insulation material to make up for imperfect sealing between plastic components, should maintain OEM heat shielding and cool air ducting, while addding a better flowing set-up that would be achieved with just a panel filter. Moreover, after I clean it up a bit, to a casual oberver it should look pretty stock once installed. More updates soon with dynos to determine whether it was worth all the trouble... __________________ Enjoy it. Destroy it. Last edited by Jordo!; 10-07-2010 at 05:04 AM.

10-07-2010, 03:56 PM	#15 (permalink)
GZ3 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: SATX Posts: 3,296 Drives: Z Rep Power: 22	I highly recommend the HPS intake pipes, i got these to smooth out airflow over the corrogurated stock tubes. 110Shipped! also you said these k&n come with a velocity stack? is there anyway you can snap a pic?? thanks man, no wories if your to busy __________________ 09 GT-R 12' 370Z 7AT HANDED DOWN 12'+13' 5.0 SOLD

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