E85 with a Stillen supercharger?

phunk

The S1 kit will do about 600rwhp Dynojet with E85 with the Aeromotive pump and 1000cc injectors (maybe more?) pending everything else. It can be a little different from car to car. The higher boost pressure you need to make your power, the earlier you will max-out the fuel system setup (this is due to pressure differentials and pumps reduced output at higher operating pressures)... also the more conservative your tuning is, same thing.

The 370z is super sensitive to this stuff as 1 psi can be 30-40hp and 1 degree of timing can be 20hp. So imagine that a guy running 2-3 degrees more timing can make a lot more power on the same fuel volume.

But until I swapped to my S2-SE fuel system a couple months back, I was running a one-off setup that was lesser than my S1 kit, and I made 586rwhp at 9psi E85, and used to run a little more boost on the street. So I know its good for it.

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dmhenderson

Not if you're supercharged and you want dual maps for both E85 and pump gas it's not. My fuel pressure spiked to 71 psi on 93oct when the bigger fuel pump and injectors went in. Dremeling out the swirl her only dropped it to 68psi.

Edit: Phunk is probably right if you are ONLY going to run E85 but E85 stations are not all that common and you need to have a backup plan that doesn't involve a flatbed unless you get stranded (or you're building a dedicated track car)



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JWillis72

Are you saying I won't be able to have a pump gas tune and E85 at the same time?


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phunk

The answer to that is in the question: Has anyone tuned a 370z with gasoline/93 and 1000cc injectors?

I tried and wasnt able to get it to run clean... but it was also my very first time even opening up the UpRev software. Thats why I originally made the switch to E85, as a bandaid to water down my injectors since I wasnt able to get them to run clean. But I got hooked on it and never looked back.

I wouldnt be even remotely surprised if more experienced UpRev tuners have done it without a problem. Heck, I might even be able to if I tried again now.

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theDreamer

I believe DM is running a 93 tune and finishing up his e85 tune so he can run either if ever required.
Jwillis, you can run multiple tunes, but if going to e85 I would just go all the way to make it easier. Though need to evaluate your e85 stations and plans with the car.

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dmhenderson

Yep. I'm driving around like that right now
If you need help getting the tune straightened out, Frank Hill (Hill's Garage) wrote my maps from scratch. He's a whiz with Uprev.

You will need two separate tune maps for E85 and 93oct. Your car will be extremely unhappy with you if you try to run the wrong gas with the wrong tune. How unhappy? I don't know but I certainly don't intend to find out. Wrong timing = really bad things happen. Uprev holds 5 maps so once you get it set up right you can just flip back and forth provided you completely drain the tank before you flip.


FlexFinder is the one I tested out. It was accurate for the 3 stations I visited.
I also have one just called Flex-Fuel that I haven't really played with yet.

I wish Gasbuddy would add E85 but oh well.

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phunk

All the Fast Intentions data is crammed into one really long thread so I cannot dig it up within the hour lol... but on one of their projects they checked to see if the stock fuel pump was up for a bit of horsepower and it kept up with as far as they bothered to push it before swapping it out precautionary.

I think the stock pump would probably keep up. Its at least something I would do only if it wasnt holding, rather than proactively. That is, on a NA car. A fuel pump is always running at 100% in the Z since there is no resistor pack or anything... so its not any extra wear on the pump to use it for all its got. I just wouldnt want to run it to the max on a boosted application since environmental conditions and boost variances will cause fuel demands to have a bit larger swing.

But there is certainly no harm in upgrading the pump anyway. I think I am going way off topic here mixing up 2 active threads on E85. This one here is supposed to be about a supercharged application I suppose.

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LukasC

Ive been working on converting my car to e85 for a while. Should be able to get it done by next summer. Have a few small issues i ran into on my car since installing my supercharger. But once i fix it i plan on doing e85 my tuner also wants to do this badly. Im going to get a return fuel system and im going to run a dual fuel pump setup. I already have both pumps and i have id1000's in the car already.

dmhenderson

You need at the bare minimum:
-1000cc injectors
-320+ lph fuel pump
-full fuel return system
-a talented tuner who will have to write your maps from scratch

It's a huge pita and probably not worth it for SC applications. Makes more sense for turbos but I'm super stubborn. If you want to see the pain I went through trying to get this done, check out my build thread.

For reference I am using:
AEM 320lph fuel pump
Injector Dynamics 1000cc injectors
CJMptorsports stage 1.0 fuel return system

My final tune will be 10/15 and will post my dyno sheet results. I am shooting for ~530whp or so.

Edit: Let me tell you about how fun it was to load up four 5 gallon containers with E85 and haul them to my tuner...

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BGTV8

Well off-topic, but I am taking my race car to Philip Island tomorrow for a test day (been chasing a drive-line vibration for 2 meetings now) and my car uses 4 litres/lap (4.5km per lap), and the test plan for the day calls for 5 sessions of an out lap, 4 timed laps and an in lap, so I am expecting to use 80-100 litres, which is 5 20-litre tins (no E85 offered at the circuit fuel dump), so I understand your point precisely.

E85 is great for making good power and keeping the engine cool, but f4rk you use a lot of it !!!

phunk

Yes the fuel pump module needs modification to support the large fuel pumps, or you get the idle pressure spike! I have the Walbro 400 in there and I have pressure under control (50 psi at idle).

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dmhenderson

haha Phunk, I had no idea that was your design! It was between the CJM kit and the AAM kit and my tuner had a lot of nice things to say about you guys.

I was all over the place at idle. Once you got the motor warmed up it got ~tolerable~ but not "safe". I upgraded just to end the headache. It took a meeting of the minds between Hill's, CJM and Z1 to come to the conclusion that my original assessment (before we started the build) that I needed a FRS was correct. Even a stopped clock is right twice a day right?

Other stuff from this thread as I am getting caught up:

You are correct. This is why I went down the E85 road. That and being a "special snowlflake"/first to do something weird and (maybe) unnecessary. I am not expecting a huge power bump. If that happens though, you guys will be the first to know.

Agree that this is unlikely. My 645cc injectors were nowhere near sufficient.

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1slow370

It didn't work out so you bought a different car? holy crap lol

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JWillis72

I don't want E85 if it going to make me drive a FRS!


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dmhenderson

Fuel return system




This is correct. I want to be able to run both. 93oct on huge injectors with a beefy fuel pump likely caused a bunch of my issues.

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