GTM stage 2 TT with FI 3" CBE

NOBLE|370Z · 02-16-2014, 12:51 PM

In 2012 I installed a GTM Stg 2 TT kit with Berk HFC and Stillen CBE on my 370Z. I'm using a tune Sam made me for 93 octane fuel since we have 94 octane here in Calgary.

Due to not having precise boost control with the internal wastegates and EBC I knew I had to upgrade to external poppet type. Therefore I recently installed 3" GTM downpipes (w/ ext wastegates) with a new 3" fast intentions CBE exhaust. I don't know why the internal wastegates on the turbo(s) were ineffective. It had something to do with the tightening of the actuator but it was never 100%. I'd set my EBC to 10psi and I would only get 9psi. Therefore I would have to uncomfortably set my EBC setting to 11psi to get to the 10psi target. I didn't mess with the auto calibration parameters as I preferred to do it manually. After countless adjustments by my mechanic I just have up. So that's why I went with external WGs and downpipes.

Anyways, this week my local shop charged me 20 flipping hours just to install the new downpipes and CBE. They claimed it was a part fitment issues. GTM stated it was a lousy mechanic issue. Sam did end up sending me new gaskets which helped the exhaust leak that was happening on the top side of the pipes. Then there was another leak detected so that escapade went on for days. Let's just say the 20+ hours to do the work resulted in a job that should be perfect now. ZR auto is the shop I took it to in Calgary. I'm still not sure if I will take it back to them ever again... If you trade one shop for another then you are often times just trading an old set of problems for a new set.

Anyways, as for the FI 3" CBE I did not get the option for resonators. Upon completion of the install as I drove my car away from the shop I immediately noticed that my car's personality instantly developed a Jekyll and Hyde complex lol. As a heads up to anyone considering a similar set up: the turbos do not muffle the sound as much as one may hope they would. Every time I take it to WOT it sounds like NASA is launching a rocket to the moon. It's pretty fun and the crazy loud sound makes it a head turner from 3 blocks up the road.

On a other note, I'm not sure why but now there is feedback into the radio to the speakers. It's especially noticeable when the radio is turned off and I'm on the highway. When I accelerate the speakers really make noise. I used to install car audio and typically that sort of noise would occur if the amp power wire was laid down under the carpet next to line level and speaker wires. Has anyone experienced their ridiculously loud exhausts causing their speakers to make noise?

In summary- GTM stepped up with great customer service by over night shipping some parts and helping my mechanic troubleshoot the downpipes fitment. I love the 3" Fast Intentions exhaust. However I have a feeling I'll have to weld on some resonators to prevent my ears from popping off my head LoL

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Chuck33079 · 02-16-2014, 02:07 PM

It's that loud? You recirculated the wastegates, right? Your description sounds more like open dumps. My experience with the FI 3" was the exact opposite. Mine is catted, but that's not going to result in that much of a difference. The shop that installed mt kit also reported fitment issues with the GTM stuff, but nothing some tweaking didn't fix. GTM is always going to blame the other guy.

Mr&Mrs · 02-16-2014, 02:21 PM

My car was pretty quiet with the same setup.

dimsler · 02-16-2014, 02:32 PM

The external dumps will scream, I mean common, if you're only boosting 6-10psi those dumps are opening up very early. So basically past 1800rpm its as if you didn't have a mufflers at all. ZR should have explained this to you.

Also thats the silliest reason to switching to external gates I've ever heard. You should go back to internal wastegates, I've never had any issue regulating boost on the internal gates that GTM provides, and if you don't like those you can also get dual port internal gates from any garret dealer.

I mean if you wanted just 10psi why didn't you just buy the 10psi wastegates from GTM and ran no boost controller at all?

GTM Motorsports*::*FORCED INDUCTION*::*Wastegates*::*GTM Internal Wastegate Actuator

I suggest you find a more competent shop to work with. Because its sounding like a case of user error.

NOBLE|370Z · 02-16-2014, 02:51 PM

Open dumps without recirculation set up that is correct. No cats either. Yeah the mechanic has a lot to learn I agree. Overall he does good work but other than bolting up stuff he's not the best given all the evidence. I had him try to make the internal wastegates work a few times. Finally I got fed up and did the extreme option of going external WG.

If someone can recommend a better shop in Calgary area let me know. I understand there is a good shop in Red Deer called Lightspeed performance that I may try. 1.5 hour drive but for this level of investment I may as well. Here in Calgary (Canada) the population is about 1,000,000. There aren't a lot of shops around because not many people buy what they consider impractical 2 seater cars like the 370z. Therefore not a ton of shops due to supply and demand that can work on these cars effectively. Had I live in California I would have lots to pick from...

I want to have boost control between 6psi to 10psi and the EBC provides that option. I knew the car set up was going to be a bit loud but I have the turbos too much expectation that they'd muffle. In hindsight I should have got the re-circ option.

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Chuck33079 · 02-16-2014, 03:21 PM

The external gates will always be a better option. They may not be necessary, but they give much better boost control. As far as the exhaust goes, it's not the FI catback that's loud. It's the open dumps. Get them recirculated into the exhaust and it will be nice and quiet. Open dumps scream. It's pretty cool for a toy car, but it would get old quick on a car you drive often.

Dembflyr · 02-16-2014, 06:57 PM

Like Chuck said, your car is not loud due to the exhaust rather it's due to the lack of one. When the WG's are open (when you are on the boost) the exhaust is bypassing the turbos. Your sound level would be equal to open headers.

Installing the GTM down pipes with the recirculating WG pipes is a difficult task to get it to align properly.
I fought with mine for months before I got them to align. I tried about five different times to get them aligned. I was convinced that there was something wrong with the pipes. Sam sent me a complete new set even though he felt that it was an install issue which it turns out it was. I went open dumps until I got them in.
Now that I know how to do it it would take me 2 hours tops to remove and reinstall.

You need to get the WG's recirculated. It refines the sound to an exotic level. Not too loud even under full throttle.

TerribleONE · 02-16-2014, 07:07 PM

Completely agree about getting the wastegates recirculated. I really didn't like the way my car sounded when it was on the open dumps. I didn't mind the volume but it didn't sound good at all IMO.

1slow370 · 02-16-2014, 07:41 PM

he could always try muffling the wategate pipes, a small glass pack or spark super trap works great, that is if you don't want to go recirc.

1slow370 · 02-16-2014, 07:43 PM

something like this

NOBLE|370Z · 02-17-2014, 01:09 AM

Dembflyr is your FI exhaust resonated? I find the exhaust is still loud even when there is no boost...

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F.I. Inc. · 02-17-2014, 01:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NOBLE|370Z

Dembflyr is your FI exhaust resonated? I find the exhaust is still loud even when there is no boost...

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Noble,

I just put resonators in Nklear's 3" exhaust last week and he says it makes a world of a difference for him. Most of what you are hearing is due to the external dumps though!

Thanks, Tony

Boosted Performance · 02-17-2014, 02:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1slow370

something like this

Those work very well. I have a couple of customers with them:

You want the bottom right (3") they are sized for 1.75" and 2.0" diameter pipes, perfect for wastegates.

This is probably the easiest/cheapest way to silence those open dump wastegates.

1slow370 · 02-17-2014, 05:20 AM

Also depending on how much gate you need you may get some creep with a super trapp on the dump, but with the trapp you can add more plates to it to increase its flow.

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Mr&Mrs · 02-17-2014, 06:30 AM

I now own Dembflyr's car and the exhaust was non resonated.

02-16-2014, 12:51 PM	#1 (permalink)
NOBLE\|370Z Base Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Calgary AB Posts: 61 Drives: 09 Nissan 370Z Rep Power: 14	GTM stage 2 TT with FI 3" CBE In 2012 I installed a GTM Stg 2 TT kit with Berk HFC and Stillen CBE on my 370Z. I'm using a tune Sam made me for 93 octane fuel since we have 94 octane here in Calgary. Due to not having precise boost control with the internal wastegates and EBC I knew I had to upgrade to external poppet type. Therefore I recently installed 3" GTM downpipes (w/ ext wastegates) with a new 3" fast intentions CBE exhaust. I don't know why the internal wastegates on the turbo(s) were ineffective. It had something to do with the tightening of the actuator but it was never 100%. I'd set my EBC to 10psi and I would only get 9psi. Therefore I would have to uncomfortably set my EBC setting to 11psi to get to the 10psi target. I didn't mess with the auto calibration parameters as I preferred to do it manually. After countless adjustments by my mechanic I just have up. So that's why I went with external WGs and downpipes. Anyways, this week my local shop charged me 20 flipping hours just to install the new downpipes and CBE. They claimed it was a part fitment issues. GTM stated it was a lousy mechanic issue. Sam did end up sending me new gaskets which helped the exhaust leak that was happening on the top side of the pipes. Then there was another leak detected so that escapade went on for days. Let's just say the 20+ hours to do the work resulted in a job that should be perfect now. ZR auto is the shop I took it to in Calgary. I'm still not sure if I will take it back to them ever again... If you trade one shop for another then you are often times just trading an old set of problems for a new set. Anyways, as for the FI 3" CBE I did not get the option for resonators. Upon completion of the install as I drove my car away from the shop I immediately noticed that my car's personality instantly developed a Jekyll and Hyde complex lol. As a heads up to anyone considering a similar set up: the turbos do not muffle the sound as much as one may hope they would. Every time I take it to WOT it sounds like NASA is launching a rocket to the moon. It's pretty fun and the crazy loud sound makes it a head turner from 3 blocks up the road. On a other note, I'm not sure why but now there is feedback into the radio to the speakers. It's especially noticeable when the radio is turned off and I'm on the highway. When I accelerate the speakers really make noise. I used to install car audio and typically that sort of noise would occur if the amp power wire was laid down under the carpet next to line level and speaker wires. Has anyone experienced their ridiculously loud exhausts causing their speakers to make noise? In summary- GTM stepped up with great customer service by over night shipping some parts and helping my mechanic troubleshoot the downpipes fitment. I love the 3" Fast Intentions exhaust. However I have a feeling I'll have to weld on some resonators to prevent my ears from popping off my head LoL Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

02-16-2014, 02:07 PM	#2 (permalink)
Chuck33079 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Houston Posts: 12,265 Drives: 2011 370ztt Rep Power: 29539	It's that loud? You recirculated the wastegates, right? Your description sounds more like open dumps. My experience with the FI 3" was the exact opposite. Mine is catted, but that's not going to result in that much of a difference. The shop that installed mt kit also reported fitment issues with the GTM stuff, but nothing some tweaking didn't fix. GTM is always going to blame the other guy. __________________ 2011 MB Touring-Sport-6sp-Nav/GTM TT/FI TT TDX/JTran/Kosmic/Eibach/Hotchkis/SPC/CSF/RPS/SoThatsWhereAllMyMoneyWent

02-16-2014, 02:21 PM	#3 (permalink)
Mr&Mrs A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2010 Location: Tampa Posts: 4,207 Drives: RZ34 Rep Power: 31940	My car was pretty quiet with the same setup. Dembflyr likes this. __________________ Project Z <--Click - Check out the link too many mods to list!

02-16-2014, 03:21 PM	#6 (permalink)
Chuck33079 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Houston Posts: 12,265 Drives: 2011 370ztt Rep Power: 29539	The external gates will always be a better option. They may not be necessary, but they give much better boost control. As far as the exhaust goes, it's not the FI catback that's loud. It's the open dumps. Get them recirculated into the exhaust and it will be nice and quiet. Open dumps scream. It's pretty cool for a toy car, but it would get old quick on a car you drive often. TerribleONE, F.I. Inc., Mr&Mrs and 1 others like this. __________________ 2011 MB Touring-Sport-6sp-Nav/GTM TT/FI TT TDX/JTran/Kosmic/Eibach/Hotchkis/SPC/CSF/RPS/SoThatsWhereAllMyMoneyWent

02-16-2014, 06:57 PM	#7 (permalink)
Dembflyr Track Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Indiana Posts: 886 Drives: G37S Sedan Rep Power: 16	Like Chuck said, your car is not loud due to the exhaust rather it's due to the lack of one. When the WG's are open (when you are on the boost) the exhaust is bypassing the turbos. Your sound level would be equal to open headers. Installing the GTM down pipes with the recirculating WG pipes is a difficult task to get it to align properly. I fought with mine for months before I got them to align. I tried about five different times to get them aligned. I was convinced that there was something wrong with the pipes. Sam sent me a complete new set even though he felt that it was an install issue which it turns out it was. I went open dumps until I got them in. Now that I know how to do it it would take me 2 hours tops to remove and reinstall. You need to get the WG's recirculated. It refines the sound to an exotic level. Not too loud even under full throttle. TerribleONE, F.I. Inc. and Mr&Mrs like this. __________________ 2012 G37S Sedan 6MT - Project Practicality 2009-6MT-Sport/Touring-Dembflyr's Journal-TT Build Thread-CAR IS SOLD Last edited by Dembflyr; 02-16-2014 at 07:03 PM.

02-16-2014, 02:32 PM	#4 (permalink)
dimsler Base Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Canada Posts: 97 Drives: V36 Rep Power: 13	The external dumps will scream, I mean common, if you're only boosting 6-10psi those dumps are opening up very early. So basically past 1800rpm its as if you didn't have a mufflers at all. ZR should have explained this to you. Also thats the silliest reason to switching to external gates I've ever heard. You should go back to internal wastegates, I've never had any issue regulating boost on the internal gates that GTM provides, and if you don't like those you can also get dual port internal gates from any garret dealer. I mean if you wanted just 10psi why didn't you just buy the 10psi wastegates from GTM and ran no boost controller at all? GTM Motorsports::FORCED INDUCTION::Wastegates::GTM Internal Wastegate Actuator I suggest you find a more competent shop to work with. Because its sounding like a case of user error.

02-16-2014, 02:51 PM	#5 (permalink)
NOBLE\|370Z Base Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Calgary AB Posts: 61 Drives: 09 Nissan 370Z Rep Power: 14	Open dumps without recirculation set up that is correct. No cats either. Yeah the mechanic has a lot to learn I agree. Overall he does good work but other than bolting up stuff he's not the best given all the evidence. I had him try to make the internal wastegates work a few times. Finally I got fed up and did the extreme option of going external WG. If someone can recommend a better shop in Calgary area let me know. I understand there is a good shop in Red Deer called Lightspeed performance that I may try. 1.5 hour drive but for this level of investment I may as well. Here in Calgary (Canada) the population is about 1,000,000. There aren't a lot of shops around because not many people buy what they consider impractical 2 seater cars like the 370z. Therefore not a ton of shops due to supply and demand that can work on these cars effectively. Had I live in California I would have lots to pick from... I want to have boost control between 6psi to 10psi and the EBC provides that option. I knew the car set up was going to be a bit loud but I have the turbos too much expectation that they'd muffle. In hindsight I should have got the re-circ option. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

02-16-2014, 07:07 PM	#8 (permalink)
TerribleONE A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Socal Posts: 10,203 Drives: WOT Rep Power: 5850	Completely agree about getting the wastegates recirculated. I really didn't like the way my car sounded when it was on the open dumps. I didn't mind the volume but it didn't sound good at all IMO. __________________ 638WHP 541WTQ @ 13.5PSI Build thread

02-16-2014, 07:41 PM	#9 (permalink)
1slow370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: In the D Posts: 3,732 Drives: v8 74 260z ;) Rep Power: 7251	he could always try muffling the wategate pipes, a small glass pack or spark super trap works great, that is if you don't want to go recirc. NOBLE\|370Z likes this. __________________ ANSWER PRICE LIST Answers - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - $0.75 Answers (requiring thought) - - - - $1.25 Answers (correct) - - - - - - - - - - $12.50

02-16-2014, 07:43 PM	#10 (permalink)
1slow370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: In the D Posts: 3,732 Drives: v8 74 260z ;) Rep Power: 7251	something like this __________________ ANSWER PRICE LIST Answers - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - $0.75 Answers (requiring thought) - - - - $1.25 Answers (correct) - - - - - - - - - - $12.50

02-17-2014, 01:09 AM	#11 (permalink)
NOBLE\|370Z Base Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Calgary AB Posts: 61 Drives: 09 Nissan 370Z Rep Power: 14	Dembflyr is your FI exhaust resonated? I find the exhaust is still loud even when there is no boost... Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

02-17-2014, 05:20 AM	#14 (permalink)
1slow370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: In the D Posts: 3,732 Drives: v8 74 260z ;) Rep Power: 7251	Also depending on how much gate you need you may get some creep with a super trapp on the dump, but with the trapp you can add more plates to it to increase its flow. Sent from my HTCONE using Tapatalk __________________ ANSWER PRICE LIST Answers - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - $0.75 Answers (requiring thought) - - - - $1.25 Answers (correct) - - - - - - - - - - $12.50

02-17-2014, 06:30 AM	#15 (permalink)
Mr&Mrs A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2010 Location: Tampa Posts: 4,207 Drives: RZ34 Rep Power: 31940	I now own Dembflyr's car and the exhaust was non resonated. NOBLE\|370Z likes this. __________________ Project Z <--Click - Check out the link too many mods to list!

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