HKS GT Charger and TT planned by HKS
 

I know that I will be waiting out for the HKS charger system... If I had to take a guess I think that it will debut at TAS 2010.

http://www.topracing.com.hk/catalog/...IRLADY%20Z.pdf

I know in the past they may not be making the most power but it is my favorite by far.

Mmmm... I may just have to go and pick one up myself.

Nick J.

so what else matters for superchargers other than power again?

good question.

Great question,

I didn't intend to make it seem as though power gains were not the goal, but wanted to reference that historically on the 350z the HKS system provided gains of 70-100 whp if my memory serves me correct. Compared to other FI options that were offered for the VQ, this fell into the average spectrum.

While some members on the board may be looking for the biggest and best bang for the buck regarding modifications and power, my goal is to incorporate unique and well engineered products to create a balanced and well appointed 370z. A calculated combination that I look forward to execute and more importantly enjoy.

The HKS GT system fits the bill, and I am eager to see how the more recently design HKS charger compares to the outsourced rotrex unit used in the past.

Nick J.

What else is important? How about reliability. :tup:

What else matters? it says HKS which is almost as baller as the word Porsche hell I'd pay 4 times as much for it(sarcasm).

Reliability, power delivery, drivabilty. It's probably going to be another High RPM, boost building, centrifugal Heat pump like always. I'd go twin screw(not roots) because I need torque and low-end to pull out of a corner instead of balls out top end power that isn't as usable unless you're a dyno queen.

I'm gunna have to agree with you. I'm going to go with the Twins as well.
Low-mid End power seems more useful on the track as well.

+1 on the twin... I was kidding about the what else matters, but yes... I actually think the power delivery is the biggest difference. I will not be buying anything but a twin screw.

Twin Turbo is nice but I'm not really a turbo guy. They make great power and it feels like the car is gonna take off, but I hate "hitting Boost." I'm talking A Lysholm style twin screw supercharger that looks like a roots blower but the rotors are conical and in a male female relationship that positively compresses the air in side the case of the blower. You "hit Boost" as soon as you put the pedal to the floor and it's at peak right away, there is no boost curve. HUGE torque gains and effectively it's like putting a V12 in your car. It has advantages over a roots setup because the rotors are more efficient so the air charge is cooler and it take less power to drive the supercharger. It also doesn't taper off towards redline like a roots blower does and a whipple 140ax 2.3L blower is capable of pushing 600hp worth of air, with units up over 4Liters available. Of course no one makes a kit with one of these compressors currently so you would have to make it yourself, good thing I happen to be a machinist huh? oh and the whipple i mentioned costs about 2,400 for just the compressor.

^That sounds nice!

yeah there is always hope stillen could use a twin screw unit in their kit so i'll probably wait to see how that goes first before i start because I would love to not have to stay at work for an extra 10 hours a week building the brackets and pulley shafts i would need.

^^ If you think all the other twin screw designs pale in comparison to the Lysholm you should check out the eaton TVS design. I'm fairly certain it's the state-of-the-art unit right now. That being said, I'm also fairly certain that Eaton provide most, if not all, the twin screw units being produced today.

Kind of back on the subject, what kind of superchargers is HKS using these days? I know they used the Rotrex units for at least a time. I heard great things about the planetary drive system Rotrex uses.

the tvs does develop boost a hair faster and harder than the twinscrew units but it's efficiency is nothing like a real twin screw. It takes more power to drive lowering the net output and requires a more sophisticated intercooler to get the temps down due to lower adiabatic efficiency. It's a huge improvement over your standerd roots type but it still isn't twinscrew, it's just a blower not a compressor. Blowers have symmetrical intermeshing rotors like two gears running against eachother. the air is trapped between the teeth of each rotor pushed around the outside of the rotor against the case and shoved below it. Superchargers spin the opposite direction of what most people think they should kinda like this (tOOt) the air goes around the rotors from the top of the t's out the bottom. Twinscrew blowers turn in the same manner but have crucial differences, the rotors are opposing cones set up so that air enters at the fat end of the female cone and is compressed by the male cone into a progressively smaller space until it exits the blower. This actually produces a compression ratio in the blower. My work uses a huge 9 liter version to run all of the pneumatic lines in the shop (well we rent it when our busta 100 yr old two stages are broken). These differences in basic design are what produce the difference in performance. The twinscrew type is always compressing the are despite what happens afterward. Blowers only form boost when they push more air then the engine needs. The heat of compression is actually formed in the manifoldbecause that is where the compression takes place. In a twin screw the heat is released inside the blower and leaks into the manifold with the air charge. Twinscrews need to be built to handle the heat they produce, the rotor design is FAR more complex to machine (I'm a machinist and it makes me wonder how the hell they do it), but in the end it releases less heat into the manifold and due to design creates less in the first place.

Technical issues aside look at the vehicles they go in twin screw: Some AMG cars, ford GT40, tvs:GM four poppers and the vette ZR-1(GM has a purchase agreement for the TVS technology). It's a price thing if you want to pay 50% more and don't care so long as it is the pinnacle of performance with real world gains you buy screw not roots. There is a TVS Based four lobber in the new gt500, the best upgrade for it right now is a brand new whipple twinscrew (kenne bell is coming out with a dedicated unit for it as well). With the same boost you make more power with a twinscrew and it is delivered in a flatter manner.

Oh and EATON makes the majority of ROOTS BLOWERS not TWINSCREW COMPRESSORS

Has anyone heard any news on the HKS charger? I was wondering if I could use the HKS 2.5" exhaust with this system???

That doesn't sound too good. Sounds like a spin-fest.

I'm trying to find the topic, but wasn't there someone on here who already tried twin screw and the shop that they went to told them there was not possible way to put a twin screw on because of something... lol I don't know...

Okay just took me damn near a half hour to find this and I don't even think it is the one I am talking about but anyway, he is referring to the Vortech supercharger which may be getting installed on his car.

So I lied about it not working, but according to MINI: It will need a new hood! I plan on getting an new hood anyway so that would be cool with me!!!

They stopped using the Rotex a while back. There are conflicting opinions on why.... Some say reliability, others will say it was more of a cost issue. Regardless, HKS thought they could do it just as well on their own because they are using a proprietary centrifugal-style "blower" that is very similar to the Rotex. It has a planetary gearless drive system in a pretty compact size.

More info. here: HKS USA GT Supercharger

My question is: Will my HKS 2.5" exhaust be a bottle neck if I were to get somthing like this?? Below are some clips! :happydance:

Here is a 350z with an HKS charger: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFetQlD5IbI&NR=1

Here is a G35 with an HKS charger: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYhn3FF4TQw

Don't think it will be a problem. The HKS GT S/C will not be a high boost kit, and S/C don't need a free flowing exhaust like a turbo does. A true dual 2.5" exhaust should be sufficient.

Let's not forget HKS spent the money here in the US to get the GT Supercharger for the 350Z CARB certified. No tickets, no referee stations, no changing your car back to stock to get a smog check done so you can get your registration renewal.

I car pool with a friend/coworker who has the GT Supercharger on his 350. It's awesome. He's not going to win a WHP shoot out but it's got lots of useable power under the curve and great response. He beats on it too and no probelms.

hop on over to the stillen thread it is almost impossible to put a twin screw or roots unit on our cars.

What kind of supercharger is the HKS.?

The 350Z kit was a relabeled Rotrex supercharger.

So if they were to do a supercharger kit it would have to be a twin??? Wouldnt that make it cost twice as much?? But also alot more power. Two chargers would sure put alot of stress on the belts and what not!

It's not necessary to have two chargers.. you could do one charger into an intercooler with two exits to the two throttle bodies..

no they can use one two would be sweet but they will only use one.

Two chargers would bring the cost up to TT cost most likely which would negate a HUGE incentive for the SC over the TT setup...

Yeah but have you seen the twin supercharged r35? MONEY

Oh not knocking the idea of twin rotrex units just saying it 1) isn't required to be two and 2) not likely to happen based on the cost to play...

If twins were available though, I'm sure someone would rock them.. I'd be interested to see the results personally...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aSR5Vd4eRM

Your right this is straight money. I would of hated to be the guy who has to tune this thing with twin turbos and twin chargers :ughdance: . I would like to see the Z get some twin chargers like this! might cost alot but you would get a setup that is fast and reliable! Superchargers don't give off as much heat as turbos right???

They stopped using Rotrex a while back after designing what they say is a better drive system. They weren't happy with the falure rate and other things on the Rotrex units. They have detailed info here, click the tabs to get to the various info:
GT Supercharger

The twin turbo they are working on is an engineering excersise to see what's possible. A S/C is not off the table either, but they are not really putting it out there right now because they don't want to piss off anyone if they decide not to produce one or either. The OP must have found out about it through a friend. I think I'm going to see a friend at HKS soon and I'll look at the car if it's there, but I don't know what I'll be able to share.

Please let us know something. Hope they show sc at TAS 2010!

Where that gain is, and how reliable the engine will be with it! :)

+2:bowrofl:

has anyone heard anything from HKS regarding either of their FI options?

Alright here is an update.

I went down to HKS to test and exhaust (I'll have a seperate post on that later with some pics). They have thier own Z and GTR. The Z had an incomplete partially prototype turbo system on it. I say partially because the kit is using parts from thier "set up kit". I'll explain what that is below. It wasn't complete as it had no finished I/C or intake piping yet but it did have cast manifolds, turbos, turbo exhaust outlet housings/pipes, and front mount intercooler cores mounted up. The intercooler had some piping and the cores were separate (one for each bank with thier own in/out but mounted together similar to HKS's Z32 front mount if you've ever seen that kit.

At this point there is not much else to share except that it is still and engineering excersice with no sure answer whether they'll make it or what the cost will be. Judging by the amoun't of parts used I wouldn't expect it to be really cheap though.

If you have plans to do a custom turbo kit they make what they call a set up kit. A set up kit is basically the major components to get started, but no vehicle specific piping and engine management. Those parts would be left in the hands of a capable shop or installer if you have the skills. In fact the set up kit is that same as the VQ35-HR kit. I was told that the compressor outlet pipes will not work on the Z34 but most of the rest will work. Here is a pic from thier site that shows a VQ35DE set up kit, I was told they look very similar:
http://www.hksusa.com/images_products/3388.jpg

Here is a list of set up kits with different turbo options from thier site:

HKS VQ Set Up Kits

All I could get on the GT Supercharger kit was it's being considered but no ETA right now. I was left with the impression they are going to look at it because my friend mentioned what a pain in butt a mounting location would be.

Sorry nothing more concrete for you guys except it looked bad assz lol.

Cool! But, holey over sized pic Batman.

LOL I was getting an error when I tried to post the smaller thumb nail. If you click the link to the application guide the pic is there also in a smaller size. Sorry.

Yeah that pic is huge and this is the best news I have heard in a long time! I am dieing to see those pics you speak of!!!!! So HKS products are developed in usa and not in HKS Japan??? You must live close, like a said pics would be killer G Fo12ce

Edit: Sorry for the wall of text lol. Little bored at work.

ALL of the products are made at HKS Japan.

I got to tour the factory once and it's very impressive. They have crazy stuff there, for example in the exhaust factory they have a long isle with every hanger for every exhaust they make in bins on both sides. The Isle is like 100 yards long and the shelves are really high. When they are getting ready to start a production run a guy types in part numbers on a console and a robotic arm slides on a track and goes and retrieves the hangers for that run. There's more cool stuff obviously but that stood out in my mind lol.

In terms of HKS USA how it works is HKS Japan will send over lets say an exhaust for an EVO. HKS USA will test it for fitment and make any modifications necessary, Dyno, decibel test it ect. Once they are happy they send it back and say "make it exactly like this". Sometimes you have JDM cars with shorter bumpers or equipment differences that necessitate USA to change it.

In recent years HKS Japan has wised up and taken more input from it USA counterpart in the design phase, because after all they know more what the car culture here will want and what will sell. Instead of the "here, we made this, this is what is cool in Japan, sell it there" attitude. I don't think it's as much as the USA guys would like but they take what they can get I guess. That being said some parts start the design phase in USA, although not many. For example I believe the Dual Hi-Power exhaust for the 350 was made/tested from scratch here for us by the techs at HKS USA and then made in Japan and shipped back over. Same for the 370 version.

That is why you've seen some posts from guys in other parts of the world saying they have trouble ordering it from their dealer’s in say the UK. It's a part they make for the US only and is not in the international "Good Master" catalog. Also I believe their S/C "kit" was designed here, although the blower design was done in Japan obviously. It makes sense if you think about it. It would be unwise to take parts designed and made off JDM cars and just resell them. If they don't work right on US cars customers get pissed and you ruin your name. I think they've done a pretty good job protecting the brand from that kind of stuff. The fact that certain items are designed here like ECU tunes or other items shouldn’t take any "shine" off their products for the JDM fan boys. The 3 guys that run the R&D at USA are super old school and knowledgeable Japanese guys who really know their stuff, and some sales/tech guys/gals who know the market.

So to answer your question, I think HKS USA may be leading the charge on the forced induction kits for the 370Z and reporting back to Japan. If it gets made, it will be made in Japan with input from them along the way. They sometimes send an Engineer over for certain phases of projects as well.


Anyway I don't live all that close, about 45 mins away in South Orange County. HKS is in LA. I only know all this stuff because like it said in my intro post I worked there for a time (about 8 years ago) and still have a few friends there. I figured I would just try to share whatever I knew for you guys although it wasn't much. I'll see what I can do about a pic but it's whenever they want to let me take it. I have to go back on Monday to pic up my stock exhaust, I'll bring my camera lol. Other than that I don't go there much as it's pretty out of the way for me.