Blown Motor, Engine Rebuild/Replacement.

zguynate · 07-16-2016, 10:13 PM

DIY isn't exactly very quick either because you end up having to work on other peoples time a lot. The machine shop was a big hang up for me. Then getting parts in and what not. Granted I'm sure it's probably getting done quicker than if I were to send it somewhere.

I hope they can get to it next Saturday. What was the hold up for today?

Z&I · 07-17-2016, 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by COSMO

Just got the call. No dyno tonight... It hopefully will be next sat, just a few days before I go to pick it up. Lets hope nothing comes up sat because it would really throw a monkey wrench in everything right before I get my car... One things for sure, I will never do this again because it takes so long. Try having your car in 2 shops for a solid year and tell me its worth it. If I cannot do it myself it won't be done... Kuddos to bryan because he had a ton of cleanup work to do on my car after the motor blew and such.... Bummed............................................ ..............

Same exact thing has happened to me - I've been waiting almost two and a half years now ... 1 blown motor... been in 2 shops ... delays, delays, more delays, and daily missed deadlines.
Ditto the 'Bummed' on this one ...........................................
But I am Irish - and - I am Stubborn aaarrrggghhh

COSMO · 07-17-2016, 10:39 AM

One of the issues was my new clutch over extending because joe from zspeed didn't exactly know what size bushing to send. The next thing was having to get bryan to make new lower charge pipes because when bobby built my turbo kit he decided to go cheap and throw 2.5" piping coming off the intercooler then connecting to 3" piping that goes the throttle bodies. Major bottleneck for that size turbo. I also had him bore out my lower intake. He also had to fix a lot of items that needed to be addressed after bobby had my car for over 8 months. All of that along with removing my old motor, having a new block bored and honed, install a both heads, leak down test, injectors were sent off to be inspected and cleaned, and of course anything else that it takes to button everything back up and checked..

If it wasn't for bryan brooks (BBR racing) I'm really not sure who I would have used. He has given me faith again in honest people that do great work an for that I would highly recommend him to anyone.

I feel this time around the car will be right and fun as hell to drive. Now based that I'm really looking forward to the next project and depending of the new supra or z we will just have to see....

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragonbreath

DIY isn't exactly very quick either because you end up having to work on other peoples time a lot. The machine shop was a big hang up for me. Then getting parts in and what not. Granted I'm sure it's probably getting done quicker than if I were to send it somewhere.

I hope they can get to it next Saturday. What was the hold up for today?

COSMO · 07-17-2016, 11:39 AM

omg man, what exactly are you having done to your car and who has it now?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Z&I

Same exact thing has happened to me - I've been waiting almost two and a half years now ... 1 blown motor... been in 2 shops ... delays, delays, more delays, and daily missed deadlines.
Ditto the 'Bummed' on this one ...........................................
But I am Irish - and - I am Stubborn aaarrrggghhh

COSMO · 07-17-2016, 02:51 PM

Here are the 3" lower charge pipes I had bryan make for me to allow my 6466 to breathe..

Z&I · 07-17-2016, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by COSMO

omg man, what exactly are you having done to your car and who has it now?

Went in 1st for Stillen SC'r upgrade _ Impeller, plugs, injectors, fuel pump, Frozen Boost heat exchanger, and TUNE.
2 weeks promised on that one turned into almost 6 months.

Got the car back for 1 day and blew the motor 1st time down the track.

Back in the shop pulled the motor and sent it down to Import Parts Pro for rebuild. That took almost 6 months.
After it got back from IPP the motor then sat in the shop for another couple of months until they actually started work on it.

The shop owner then decided to take a few months off and stay at home to take care of his brand new baby boy then went on vacation for a few more months to Florida.
That accounted for another 5 months delay in progress.

When he got back we had a little disagreement and I decided to pull the car out of his shop and ship it down to AAM Competition in Maryland - a little over 200 miles away.
This was just before FI was launching it's TT design.

It had been at the 1st shop for a little over a year before shipping it down to AAM.

It's now been at AAM for 15 months or so.
Not all their fault...there have been some legitimate delays due to other after market parts inavailabilty specifically the CJM twin fuel pump that they were upgrading the R+D on.

Since the car has been at AAM:
The TT install has been upgraded and I've made some additions to the build "as long as it was there" anyway.

The changes that have added more time to the build than anticipated.
New Technology and Products have been introduced and now filtered in to the mix.

Flex Fuel Capabilities
Twin Fuel Pump [R+D] and other fuel system components of AAM design.
Upgraded to Stage II TT's - now Borg Warner 7163's
EcuTek TUNE with Launch and Slip Control capabilities.

I'm doing a custom system to drop out the ABS/ABLS and power the Line Locks.
Also incorporating a separate Rotary Switch to control the Slip portion of the EcuTek T/C capability in conjunction with the ABS/ABLS Line Locks.
I've done all the operational design for this and have worked with the AAM engineering dept to make it work.

The dash has been totally reconfigured to accept a full compliment of guages and a Defi Tach.
Jason Gale has fabricated a Cubby panel to accept 2 more guages - that has turned out really nice.

Another mini project along the way was to convert to smaller brakes in order to allow the fitment of 17" wheels and larger tires geared for the 1/4 mile.
I went with Racing Brake - they have a kit for the 370Z just for this purpose.

What's left to do down there is the final engineering acceptance of their new upper intake manifold.
That in itself has taken some time to develop properly having gone through a few design refinements and test castings.
But I was waiting any way.

Once the car gets back up here I will be changing out the FD to Quaife and Automatic gears and adding a Z1 Diff Housing.
That has already been paid for to the original shop and I just don't want to have to pay for it again.
I did leave the original shop on sort of good terms and have gone back to say hi a few times.
Can't afford to burn bridges here.

I drove down to AAM a few weeks ago to check on progress - dropped off the little wheels with the big tires - looks pretty good on the car - I prefer the fatties look anyway.

So we will see ... I do plan [hopefully] to run the car in the fall season after a 'getting used to and break in period'.
hmmmm ... I seem to have said that 2 years ago as well ...

When it's finally done I will have a complete AAM Twin Turbo System with Flex Fuel capabilities.
Extended AAM Oil Cooler Performance and a host of other supportive performance gizmos to keep it safe and cool.

That's the short story

Wishing you the best with your build as well

Z&I · 07-17-2016, 05:44 PM

Here's the Z at AAM ... but that's not my crank in the foreground.
The Center Caps aren't on and I took the photo from under another car ...

COSMO · 07-17-2016, 06:05 PM

Wow now that is a long @ss wait but I'm guessing it was well worth it? What are your built motor specs and can you post up a dyno of that beast???

COSMO · 07-17-2016, 07:19 PM

A few more pics..

COSMO · 07-17-2016, 07:20 PM

and more pics....

TopgunZ · 07-17-2016, 09:16 PM

Show me proof you need 3" pipes on a 6466 and that 2.5" are "bottlenecks". Waste of money there.

COSMO · 07-17-2016, 09:39 PM

To be honest I took much time and research on others that have made Big power that used the precision 6466 gen 2 to see how everything was plumbed.
Have a cup of Hater-aid and be on your way...

Quote:

Originally Posted by TopgunZ

Show me proof you need 3" pipes on a 6466 and that 2.5" are "bottlenecks". Waste of money there.

COSMO · 07-17-2016, 10:58 PM

*.4 Mach is the point at which air becomes turbulent and losses in efficiency start to occur exponentially. The key is to stay under that speed. You want to use the smallest piping possible that still flows enough to meet your needs. Larger than necessary piping increases lag time with no measurable gain

The velocities are in miles per hour and mach, and the flow rates are in cfm. Measurements for the piping are in inches.

I use the rule of thumb that every 1 psi drop is roughly 10-11 h.p. lost at the 450 h.p. level. So if I have a 2.25" lower I.C. pipe that has 2 90* bends with 4 feet of straights, I get a psi loss of about 1.22 psi loss. If I upgrade to a 2.5" pipe with the same configuration I get about .74 psi loss. For 3" I get about 0.32 psi total pressure loss. At best, the switch to the 3" pipe on the lower I.C. pipe is worth about 0.9 psi gained back in the intake manifold, or about +9.0 h.p.

Also keep in mind when you switch to bigger I.C. pipes the transition off the turbo outlet has to be taken into consideration, which the psi loss actually increases as the pipe size increases, so the gains going to a bigger lower I.C. pipe are not as great as the case I just illustrated. Which is why you need to sketch out exactly the pipe configuration you have now and what you will have when you uprgrade for an accurate loss analysis.

You can play with the numbers all day long but you get the idea. There are gains to be had optimizing the piping size IF your turbo compressor is already dropping off boost at high rpms. Otherwise the turbo will simply command itself to spin up a little faster to compensate. When the turbo is pinned wide open at high rpms and your already seeing boost drop off due to the engine outflowing the turbo, THIS is where reducing pressure losses in the intake system pays off.

2.5" piping
4.90625 sq in = 2.453125 x 2
300 cfm = 100 mph = 0.13 mach
400 cfm = 133 mph = 0.17 mach
500 cfm = 166 mph = 0.21 mach
600 cfm = 200 mph = 0.26 mach
700 cfm = 233 mph = 0.30 mach
800 cfm = 266 mph = 0.34 mach
900 cfm = 300 mph = 0.39 mach

2.75" piping
5.9365625 sq in = 2.96828125 x 2
300 cfm = 82 mph = 0.10 mach
400 cfm = 110 mph = 0.14 mach
500 cfm = 137 mph = 0.17 mach
600 cfm = 165 mph = 0.21 mach
700 cfm = 192 mph = 0.25 mach
800 cfm = 220 mph = 0.28 mach
900 cfm = 248 mph = 0.32 mach
1000 cfm = 275 mph = 0.36 mach

3.0" piping
7.065 sq in = 3.5325 x 2
300 cfm = 69 mph = 0.09 mach
400 cfm = 92 mph = 0.12 mach
500 cfm = 115 mph = 0.15 mach
600 cfm = 138 mph = 0.18 mach
700 cfm = 162 mph = 0.21 mach
800 cfm = 185 mph = 0.24 mach
900 cfm = 208 mph = 0.27 mach
1000 cfm = 231 mph = 0.30 mach
1100 cfm = 254 cfm = 0.33 mach
1200 cfm = 277 mph = 0.36 mach

TopgunZ · 07-17-2016, 11:21 PM

I wonder how the 350z guys pre hr are running 800whp on a single 2.75" intake?

How big are your throttle bodies and intercooler?

TopgunZ · 07-17-2016, 11:40 PM

I already know, 3" pipes are not needed. I like how you deflected answering that though.

07-16-2016, 10:13 PM	#1501 (permalink)
zguynate A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Strangeland Posts: 1,054 Drives: 09 370z Rep Power: 73	DIY isn't exactly very quick either because you end up having to work on other peoples time a lot. The machine shop was a big hang up for me. Then getting parts in and what not. Granted I'm sure it's probably getting done quicker than if I were to send it somewhere. I hope they can get to it next Saturday. What was the hold up for today? __________________ 2009 370z touring w/sports package

07-17-2016, 09:16 PM	#1511 (permalink)
TopgunZ A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Minneapolis Posts: 2,651 Drives: 06 350Z , 09 370Z MT Rep Power: 6834	Show me proof you need 3" pipes on a 6466 and that 2.5" are "bottlenecks". Waste of money there. __________________ ROTREX SUPERCHARGER TUNER KITS - $6799/ CUSTOM STILLEN AIR TO AIR KITS -$2100/ 700+ WHP!! WWW.TOPGUNSPEEDWORKS.COM

07-17-2016, 10:58 PM	#1513 (permalink)
COSMO A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: FL Posts: 1,816 Drives: 2012 Touring GTM TT Rep Power: 20	.4 Mach is the point at which air becomes turbulent and losses in efficiency start to occur exponentially. The key is to stay under that speed. You want to use the smallest piping possible that still flows enough to meet your needs. Larger than necessary piping increases lag time with no measurable gain The velocities are in miles per hour and mach, and the flow rates are in cfm. Measurements for the piping are in inches. I use the rule of thumb that every 1 psi drop is roughly 10-11 h.p. lost at the 450 h.p. level. So if I have a 2.25" lower I.C. pipe that has 2 90 bends with 4 feet of straights, I get a psi loss of about 1.22 psi loss. If I upgrade to a 2.5" pipe with the same configuration I get about .74 psi loss. For 3" I get about 0.32 psi total pressure loss. At best, the switch to the 3" pipe on the lower I.C. pipe is worth about 0.9 psi gained back in the intake manifold, or about +9.0 h.p. Also keep in mind when you switch to bigger I.C. pipes the transition off the turbo outlet has to be taken into consideration, which the psi loss actually increases as the pipe size increases, so the gains going to a bigger lower I.C. pipe are not as great as the case I just illustrated. Which is why you need to sketch out exactly the pipe configuration you have now and what you will have when you uprgrade for an accurate loss analysis. You can play with the numbers all day long but you get the idea. There are gains to be had optimizing the piping size IF your turbo compressor is already dropping off boost at high rpms. Otherwise the turbo will simply command itself to spin up a little faster to compensate. When the turbo is pinned wide open at high rpms and your already seeing boost drop off due to the engine outflowing the turbo, THIS is where reducing pressure losses in the intake system pays off. 2.5" piping 4.90625 sq in = 2.453125 x 2 300 cfm = 100 mph = 0.13 mach 400 cfm = 133 mph = 0.17 mach 500 cfm = 166 mph = 0.21 mach 600 cfm = 200 mph = 0.26 mach 700 cfm = 233 mph = 0.30 mach 800 cfm = 266 mph = 0.34 mach 900 cfm = 300 mph = 0.39 mach 2.75" piping 5.9365625 sq in = 2.96828125 x 2 300 cfm = 82 mph = 0.10 mach 400 cfm = 110 mph = 0.14 mach 500 cfm = 137 mph = 0.17 mach 600 cfm = 165 mph = 0.21 mach 700 cfm = 192 mph = 0.25 mach 800 cfm = 220 mph = 0.28 mach 900 cfm = 248 mph = 0.32 mach 1000 cfm = 275 mph = 0.36 mach 3.0" piping 7.065 sq in = 3.5325 x 2 300 cfm = 69 mph = 0.09 mach 400 cfm = 92 mph = 0.12 mach 500 cfm = 115 mph = 0.15 mach 600 cfm = 138 mph = 0.18 mach 700 cfm = 162 mph = 0.21 mach 800 cfm = 185 mph = 0.24 mach 900 cfm = 208 mph = 0.27 mach 1000 cfm = 231 mph = 0.30 mach 1100 cfm = 254 cfm = 0.33 mach 1200 cfm = 277 mph = 0.36 mach jaytirbhaw and BBRSpeedWorks like this. Last edited by COSMO; 07-17-2016 at 11:42 PM.

07-17-2016, 11:21 PM	#1514 (permalink)
TopgunZ A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Minneapolis Posts: 2,651 Drives: 06 350Z , 09 370Z MT Rep Power: 6834	I wonder how the 350z guys pre hr are running 800whp on a single 2.75" intake? How big are your throttle bodies and intercooler? __________________ ROTREX SUPERCHARGER TUNER KITS - $6799/ CUSTOM STILLEN AIR TO AIR KITS -$2100/ 700+ WHP!! WWW.TOPGUNSPEEDWORKS.COM

07-17-2016, 11:40 PM	#1515 (permalink)
TopgunZ A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Minneapolis Posts: 2,651 Drives: 06 350Z , 09 370Z MT Rep Power: 6834	I already know, 3" pipes are not needed. I like how you deflected answering that though. __________________ ROTREX SUPERCHARGER TUNER KITS - $6799/ CUSTOM STILLEN AIR TO AIR KITS -$2100/ 700+ WHP!! WWW.TOPGUNSPEEDWORKS.COM

07-17-2016, 06:05 PM	#1508 (permalink)
COSMO A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: FL Posts: 1,816 Drives: 2012 Touring GTM TT Rep Power: 20	Wow now that is a long @ss wait but I'm guessing it was well worth it? What are your built motor specs and can you post up a dyno of that beast???

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